New 35 Summilux vs 35 Apo

[IkarusJohn]

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I'm not sure that “nitpicking about bokeh is a meaningless excuse”.  Sure, it’s not the out of focus areas that you look at. That’s the point. When the quality of the out of focus areas distract from the subject, that’s a problem.

If you look at images taken by a 50/2 Summitar, an f/2 Noctilux or your 35 Summilux (FLE) wide open with a busy background (leaves of a tree will do it), then look at the same image taken with a 50 Summilux ASPH, you will see a different, and perhaps why the quality of the background might matter for some when buying an expensive lens. They’re all expensive!

If, like many, you don’t find the bokeh of your lens distracting, that’s great. Enjoy what is a very fine lens.  But don’t suggest that the conclusions of others are meaningless excuses.  I don’t need an excuse for any of my choices. I’ve owned two 35 (FLE) lenses, and sold them in favour of the APO.

Your choices vary - that’s fine. There’s no criticism of your choices.  We are simply exchanging opinions. 

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[Smudgerer]

1 hour ago, IkarusJohn said:

I'm not sure that “nitpicking about bokeh is a meaningless excuse”.  Sure, it’s not the out of focus areas that you look at. That’s the point. When the quality of the out of focus areas distract from the subject, that’s a problem..................

Your choices vary - that’s fine. There’s no criticism of your choices.  We are simply exchanging opinions. 

If this is a response to what I said in the post before yours you misread it, I said "exercise" not "excuse"..............Two quite different meanings there.

Bokeh isn't something that's high on my personal list of what I look for in a lens and yes obviously we all, as you say, differ in what we look for or try to achieve in an image, I have other priorities, that's all. Not a criticism.

[Jeff S]

1 hour ago, Smudgerer said:

If this is a response to what I said in the post before yours you misread it, I said "exercise" not "excuse"..............Two quite different meanings there.

 

More importantly, you said “for me.”  I took it as your opinion/preference, not a universal criticism.

Bokeh also isn’t a personal priority, as I typically stop down, but as an owner of the 35 Summilux ASPH v.1, I do agree with John that the bokeh can occasionally be distracting.  Because of that, I’ve learned to avoid circumstances prompting overly busy backgrounds and find the Summilux FLE v.1 otherwise stellar.  I appreciate the infrequent times when f/1.4 works to my advantage, as well as when the smaller and lighter 35 Summicron ASPH v.1 better suits.

Combined with the fact that I shoot using RF-only with my M bodies, I find the close focus design of both new lenses - 35 APO M and 35 Summilux ASPH - unnecessarily complex. 

Jeff

Edited July 5, 2023 by Jeff S

[IkarusJohn]

My combination of 35mm lenses is the 35 Summilux pre-asph v2 and APO Summicron.  As I’ve mentioned elsewhere, I’m coming to grips with the 35 field of view.  It’s one of the traditional “standard” lenses, and I find it requires some care. I guess that reflects my preference for either 50mm or 28mm.

I do find it interesting how Leica ownership has resulted in multiple, complimentary lenses in the same focal lengths; particularly, 28 (with the Summilux and Summaron), 35 and 50 (Summitar LTM, Summilux ASPH, Noctilux 0.95 & APO Summicron).  I did have the Noctilux for sale, but have decided to keep it.  Each lens has its appeal and character, adding to my confusion over which camera to take as I head oit the door! 🫣

[pgh]

4 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

I'm not sure that “nitpicking about bokeh is a meaningless excuse”.  Sure, it’s not the out of focus areas that you look at. That’s the point. When the quality of the out of focus areas distract from the subject, that’s a problem.

If you look at images taken by a 50/2 Summitar, an f/2 Noctilux or your 35 Summilux (FLE) wide open with a busy background (leaves of a tree will do it), then look at the same image taken with a 50 Summilux ASPH, you will see a different, and perhaps why the quality of the background might matter for some when buying an expensive lens. They’re all expensive!

If, like many, you don’t find the bokeh of your lens distracting, that’s great. Enjoy what is a very fine lens.  But don’t suggest that the conclusions of others are meaningless excuses.  I don’t need an excuse for any of my choices. I’ve owned two 35 (FLE) lenses, and sold them in favour of the APO.

Your choices vary - that’s fine. There’s no criticism of your choices.  We are simply exchanging opinions. 

This all may be true, but I honestly cannot recall ever seeing a truly strong photograph (that had the real stuff - content, composition, light, etc) that was in any way lessened, let alone ruined by some busier looking bokeh. I mean sure, it can take away from like a picture of a flower amongst leaves, I guess - but that's not much to look at anyways. 

I take both your points but I do think that when push comes to shove if the bokeh appears to be the issue in a picture, then the issue is actually much more fundamental. 

Then again, I've never owned more than one focal length in a Leica lens - standard issue summis for me here - and I don't ever plan to. 

Edited July 6, 2023 by pgh

[jakontil]

5 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

I'm not sure that “nitpicking about bokeh is a meaningless excuse”.  Sure, it’s not the out of focus areas that you look at. That’s the point. When the quality of the out of focus areas distract from the subject, that’s a problem.

If you look at images taken by a 50/2 Summitar, an f/2 Noctilux or your 35 Summilux (FLE) wide open with a busy background (leaves of a tree will do it), then look at the same image taken with a 50 Summilux ASPH, you will see a different, and perhaps why the quality of the background might matter for some when buying an expensive lens. They’re all expensive!

If, like many, you don’t find the bokeh of your lens distracting, that’s great. Enjoy what is a very fine lens.  But don’t suggest that the conclusions of others are meaningless excuses.  I don’t need an excuse for any of my choices. I’ve owned two 35 (FLE) lenses, and sold them in favour of the APO.

Your choices vary - that’s fine. There’s no criticism of your choices.  We are simply exchanging opinions. 

I agree very much.. sometimes prefer the noct 1.2 swirly bokeh, other time might go for the lux asph

im still keeping my fifties cant decide still