Lenses for a crazy kids' birthday party

[JoshuaR]

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Yesterday I took my son to a crazy (in a fun way!) birthday party for four-year-olds. It was at a local "farm"—basically a giant garden store with an attached restaurant, arcade, massive playground, huge petting zoo (with goats, rabbits, monkeys, zebras, even a giraffe), and gift shop. There were perhaps two dozen kids at the party, plus parents. At times we were all crammed into a tiny room together for pizza and cake, at other moments we were spread out everywhere doing pony rides, etc. Bright sun outdoors, dark indoors, kids running around at top speed, tall people, short people, camels and cows leaning out of their enclosures—it was a lot. Truthfully, it might have been the most difficult and chaotic photography environment I've ever encountered.

I brought my M10 with CV 21 f/3.5, 35 FLE, and 50 Cron. Some quick reflections:

• Three lenses was too many for me. I should've just brought 28 / 50. I've recently been experimenting with three-lens kits, but I find them confusing and fiddly. I think I'm a two-lens-kit guy at the end of the day.
• I was constantly wrong-footed by changes in lighting. Suddenly we'd be indoors and something would be happening and I'd take a bunch of photos at f/11. This is probably about muscle memory. 
• The FLE felt too chunky and heavy. I like the lens but also find it a bit big, and in this context—running around, kids everywhere—it seemed in the way. I find the quality of the FLE images to be exceptional, but have still been thinking of downsizing to a smaller 35—perhaps the Cron ASPH or maybe Cron V4—and simply living without an f/1.4 lens. On the other hand, I could have simply left the FLE at home.
• The 21mm was very useful on one or two occasions. But overall it was less useful than I thought it would be for capturing the chaos. The place seemed packed, but my frames were often sparse—perhaps in part because there were so many short kids and I wanted to keep the camera level. So, more practice on that front. 
• I've been debating between the 28 Summaron and the 28 Elmarit, leaning towards the Summaron. But the complexity of this kids' party, especially with the shifts between light and shadow, has made me think that the Elmarit is a better and more practical choice.
• The 50 Cron v5 was a dream, and I'm very happy to have bought it to replace my Zeiss 50 Sonnar.

Overall, my feeling afterward was that I've spent too much time obsessing about lens rendering. For my photography—which is basically about documenting my family and travel for work—what I prefer is just getting the shot. Simpler and smaller is better. The day might have been more fun, photographically speaking, with a simple kit of 28 Elmarit ASPH and 50 Cron v5.

I wish I could share some photos, but shouldn't, because so many of the kids belonged to other people. So here's my son, with cowboy hat and gift-shop truck, in the tranquility of the after-party parking lot. M10 and 50 Cron v5.

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Edited May 22, 2023 by JoshuaRothman

[evikne]

Thank you for sharing this experience. It reminds me a lot of things I've done myself. I have photographed many wild children's birthdays and also a wedding that was both indoors and outdoors. I understand you liked the 50mm Summicron, which is small and light, and quick to focus. A relatively fast 35mm (but smaller than the Summilux) could probably also be useful, but I think I would try to avoid changing lenses as much as possible.

[LocalHero1953]

1 hour ago, JoshuaRothman said:

Overall, my feeling afterward was that I've spent too much time obsessing about lens rendering.

This applies to many photographers.🙂 
Getting the shot should always be the priority, getting it with perfect IQ is secondary. 

[Pintpot]

Lovely photo of your son. Personally I'd gave taken my Dlux 7 to an event like this, all in one 24 to 70, not as good as an M10 obviously but far less stressful. I hope you enjoyed yourself anyway - the young lad seems to! Cheers

[ianforber]

I’d have taken my Q2. ISO on auto and aperture at f11. Probably on auto focus with the new updated face detection but could always revert to zone focusing if that produced better results. My nephew has his 12th birthday party in early June so I might give this setup a go. He has Down’s syndrome and behaves much younger than his actual age suggests so I’m expecting a rough and tumble type event!

[pgk]

I'm afraid that any decent AF camera with a good wide to tele zoom would be a better solution in such an environment. The M system is really not the best choice for such conditions. I've shot a lot of tourist attractions, some specifically intended for children, and even with 'captive models' (if children can ever be described as such) I have used a dSLR and zoom. I wouldn't think of using an M because it simply isn't the most effective solution for such photography.

[cboy]

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Most obsesss about shallow DOF but in reality unless under strict portrait conditions  < f1.4 handheld, manual focus in mixed lighting with kids running around isnt not going to cut it. Sure one can get a couple of shots in focus in whole events worth of potential shots, but f4 or greater would be my ideal range and mostly doing hyperfocal distancing. Its in these situations that AF and a pocket  flash would be my friend. Not saying it can't be done, but it would surely help enjoy the day more😉. 

Edited May 22, 2023 by cboy

[Olaf_ZG]

I’m thinking: in such environment, would a 24mm, f11, zone focus on 1,5m, auto iso get you great action pics? Just jump in the scene and shoot…

Either this, or two bodies, but changing lenses wouldn’t work for me…

[spydrxx]

Young kids are too fast for Leica cameras to really excel, at least in my experience. When my daughter was young, I could capture one or two kids, but I really had to break them apart from other kids to get good shots. Now with a granddaughter, I took a different approach...I used a more modern AF camera and got about 95% of the shots I wanted. So, IMHO it comes back to using the appropriate tools for the job...AF for fast action and the Leicas for mostly other things. I've also cheated and used my old Leica lenses with a Techart adapter on a Sony A7Rii for autofocus, but IMHO it works well for many things, but probably not a "crazy" party for 4 yr olds.😄

[wdshuck]

I have a three year old, so following this with interest. I’ve found I do best when I pick one lens and use that for the duration - either a 35 or 50. I wait for moments when they’ve stopped running around to play with something and then snap a picture.
 

I found I struggled getting good photos of them in motion even with an AF camera. I like using an M because it’s smaller, but it sometimes is more difficult since it requires using both hands to focus.

Edited May 22, 2023 by wdshuck

[JoshuaR]

Thanks for these responses! So many of my photographic idols do things that are definitely not taking pictures of kids at birthday parties, so it's nice to discuss this sort of quotidian reality.

To be honest, it actually wasn't the focusing that was difficult—I was basically zone focusing, which I prefer for fast-paced situations even over AF, which I don't enjoy. Occasionally, I sought narrow depth of field with the 50, but otherwise I was shooting at f/8 or f/11. Actually, it was zone-focusing that led to one of my persistent missteps at the party: forgetting to open up the aperture when I was suddenly indoors.

I actually like the slightly messy, imperfect, "documentary" look of fast-action family photos taken on the M system. I used to own a Q2 and sold it, partly to embrace the "handmade" feeling of M family pictures. And the challenge of using the M is fun, too. I'm okay missing a lot of shots in family situations, since there will be more photo opportunities coming up soon.

To me, the big lesson of the party was about practicality and simplicity. I should've just brought two lenses, not three, and in the future I'm just going to do that with 28/50—or maybe even just bring one lens. And it's not going to be a 21mm or a 35mm but a 28mm. On the 28mm front, I need a new lens, and I've been contemplating the Summaron because of its rendering—but after this experience, I think I'm just going to buy the Elmarit ASPH. Small and sharp, with a nice handy focus tab and a design that's easy to get on and off the camera. I've been using the M system for a few years, and I'm learning that all the lenses are excellent. I'm going to stop worrying so much about rendering and just use lenses that help me get the shot.

More photos: here's my kid with a camel at the party, taken with the FLE during a slow-ish moment. And the second shot is a zone-focused vacation picture from a while ago, taken on the run. 

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Edited May 22, 2023 by JoshuaRothman

[Olaf_ZG]

@JoshuaRothmanwhy a 28mm? Why not slightly wider? Really curious about your decision process here…

[didier]

Thanks for sharing.

I am into such experiences as well with my 3 and 5 year old girls  

In such environments I try not to change Lenses. I’d bring my Q2 which is fast and easy to use, and my M10M either with a 50 or my APO 75 for portraits.

Didier

[JoshuaR]

44 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said:

@JoshuaRothmanwhy a 28mm? Why not slightly wider? Really curious about your decision process here…

It's mainly about managing distortion. I've really been enjoying 21mm, but in that fast-paced environment, with so many people running around—and especially with so many of them being low to the ground—it was really hard to use 21mm quickly. Maybe it's my own inexperience. But I think I'd enjoy a lens that can be pointed up, down, and any which way at my next crazy kid party.

Edited May 22, 2023 by JoshuaRothman

[wda]

Lots of advice. General agreement on the unsuitability of any M-system for such a project.

In recent years  I have chosen either my D-Lux or V-Lux is perfect for quickly changing scenes. The letter has been excellent for capturing special moments from a distance. Each camera is versatile  and avoids constantly agonising over lens choice.

[sometimesmaybe]

1 hour ago, wda said:

General agreement on the unsuitability of any M-system for such a project.

just curious... with kids running around, why not stick the 28mm on f8 and just enjoy the deep DOF?  

[kinetic]

Another option for this could be the iPhone camera (or mobile camera). Great image quality, wide angle, basically hyper focused. If you have an iPhone, it would even have Live Photos for small 1 second snippets of video.

[KFo]

Nah.  I totally disagree with the M being ill suited for these types of endeavors.

This is a dynamic, energetic event, not a "is that eyeball sharp" event.  Rig a 28 or 21, setup hyperfocal and shoot away.  One lens only.  Drop the photos in a shared album for the other parents and move on.

Capturing the feeling of the event is much more important than pretending its portraiture.

Edited May 23, 2023 by KFo

[LocalHero1953]

Plenty of alternative personal practices being explained here, but I think the OP has got his analysis right. I used a M9 and M240 often enough for small children (and other energetic activity indoors - play rehearsals etc) and I see nothing inherently wrong with a M for a kids party. Now, I don't have a digital M, but would use the Q2 - since it has poor AF for such things as this, I would also use manual focus.

I agree with him that the solution is to keep it simple: one lens and zone focusing if it's light enough to stop down. Between the 21 and 28, my choice would be the 28 (I have never tried a 24 prime); the 21 can create distracting angles unless you can 'anchor' a vertical or horizontal in the real world - which is tricky when you're working fast. And you need guesswork or a supplementary OVF for a 21/24 - or the LV/EVF which can introduce its own problems in low light indoors.

Edited May 23, 2023 by LocalHero1953

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[Aryel]

Maybe it is because I do not shoot digital: For such events, I usually take two bodies a M2 for indoor usually with a fast 35mm (if tight then 28) and a M3 for outdoor with a 50mm or sometimes even a 90mm if I have enough room... I also do not like changing lens at such events but swapping camera is fast.

One of my favourite birthday shot:

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m3, 50 summitar, hp5+ at 800 in dd-x