Close focus mod - Summilux-M 35mm F1.4 Steel Rim reissue

[yukosteel]

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Article with details on performing close focus mod on Leica Summilux-M 35mm F1.4 Steel Rim reissue lens.

It's involving metal grinding of lens internals to allow focusing down to 0.76m and using RF patch in that range. 

 

 

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[Pyrogallol]

There seems to be an obsession with using rangefinder Leicas at very minimum focussing range and the lenses at maximum aperture. Not what the Leica rangefinder is designed to do best, even using live view and overcoming the viewfinder parallax alignment. Use an SLR and keep the Leica for middle distance pictures which it does best.

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[Ernstk]

2 hours ago, Pyrogallol said:

There seems to be an obsession with using rangefinder Leicas at very minimum focussing range and the lenses at maximum aperture. Not what the Leica rangefinder is designed to do best, even using live view and overcoming the viewfinder parallax alignment. Use an SLR and keep the Leica for middle distance pictures which it does best.

Couldn't agree more. Is it really worth all this angst over a 20cm focus distance difference?

Ernst

Edited May 1, 2023 by Ernstk

[pgk]

Just because something is possible does not always make it a good idea. Rangefinder M cameras work exceptionally well within their original design parameters but soon become usurped by innumerable other, more effective cameras, outside them. They are a mature technology with few refinements left to be made without repurposing them entirely.

[yukosteel]

Regardless of primarily targeted purpose and optimal designed conditions for equipment use - it remains to be just a guideline median. It's a human with own freedom of choice, personal preferences and habits who is making decision for own way of utilizing that equipment. Photography is an art, a profession, a way to depict the world in the way we percept for sharing with others. I don't see a serious reason to establish limiting guidelines or label people preferences wrong only because more classic and conservative baselines making most sense of utilizing RF camera system. 

Leica engineers have various justifications to produce numerous modern Leica lens with much closer than 1m focusing distance and native camera support of 0.7m-1m focusing in rangefinder, which  definitely has it's good use. Having extra closer focusing is not forcing anyone to use it, but it's a nice flexibility to have for that situations where you'd prefer to take a closer shot.

If Leica produce two modern versions of 35mm F1.4 Steel Rim, same optics, same mechanics, selling for same price, one with MFD limited to 0.9m, and second with MFD limited to 0.75m, I'm wondering how many people would decide to purchase the first option over the second, even though they don't plan to utilize that extra closer focusing range.

 

[hdmesa]

18 hours ago, Pyrogallol said:

There seems to be an obsession with using rangefinder Leicas at very minimum focussing range and the lenses at maximum aperture. Not what the Leica rangefinder is designed to do best, even using live view and overcoming the viewfinder parallax alignment. Use an SLR and keep the Leica for middle distance pictures which it does best.

 

15 hours ago, Ernstk said:

Couldn't agree more. Is it really worth all this angst over a 20cm focus distance difference?

Ernst

 

15 hours ago, pgk said:

Just because something is possible does not always make it a good idea. Rangefinder M cameras work exceptionally well within their original design parameters but soon become usurped by innumerable other, more effective cameras, outside them. They are a mature technology with few refinements left to be made without repurposing them entirely.

The amount of pearl clutching in this thread is off the charts.

[rustyrus]

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Great article and precision on this! I wouldn't have the courage to even remove a screw  I am assuming this is you doing the work here?

 

Interesting other articles on your site as well. Cheers! 

 

Rusty

[mediumformula]

I find it confusing that Leica reissued this lens with only the 1m MFD in the first place considering a common complaint about the pre-Asph Summiluxs is their lack of .7m MFD.  

[Pyrogallol]

5 hours ago, hdmesa said:

 

 

The amount of pearl clutching in this thread is off the charts.

Not sure what “pearl clutching” means?

[Lelmer]

On 5/1/2023 at 5:44 AM, yukosteel said:

Article with details on performing close focus mod on Leica Summilux-M 35mm F1.4 Steel Rim reissue lens.

It's involving metal grinding of lens internals to allow focusing down to 0.76m and using RF patch in that range. 

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Good job. I am wondering why Leica hasn't produced it like this.

I also discovered other interesting articles on your site. Thanks for sharing.

[Ernstk]

2 hours ago, Pyrogallol said:

Not sure what “pearl clutching” means?

By saying 'pearl clutching' he means that those of us who think that the whole focus thing is a bit ludicrous, are over protesting and feigning shock, just to put down the original poster.

By using the 'pearl clutching' term, hdmesa has become the biggest pearl clutcher on this thread. Which was probably his intent...

Ernst

[RexGig0]

On 5/1/2023 at 1:33 AM, Pyrogallol said:

There seems to be an obsession with using rangefinder Leicas at very minimum focussing range and the lenses at maximum aperture. Not what the Leica rangefinder is designed to do best, even using live view and overcoming the viewfinder parallax alignment. Use an SLR and keep the Leica for middle distance pictures which it does best.

This is a valid viewpoint, but I will respectfully dissent. I have world-class Canon EF DSLR equipment, for macro photography, a system which I accumulated during my career in public service, when evidentiary/forensic/crime scene photography became an added duty. I also have some decent Nikon SLR macro lenses. So, I certainly can use SLR cameras and lenses for close-range and macro shooting. Sometimes, however, I do not want to carry more than one camera, or, would rather not tote my SLR macro equipment. For the first five decades of my life, travel meant automobile travel, but, I have aged to the point that I can foresee moving about, over large distances, mostly by bus and train, and then having to move on foot, or on a bicycle, to the photographic destination.

A true minimalist may want to use just one or two focal lengths. I cannot disagree with them.

Then, of course, there is the joy of using a customized tool, that can do what a factory-spec tool cannot do. I will probably never “hot rod” an automobile, because I have no safe, protected place to park it, but a customized lens, well, that is practicable. I already have a Leica R lens, converted by Skyllaney to M mount, with rangefinder coupling, for example. 

Notably, the customized lens, being discussed, is not being converted to true 2022-level “close focus,” anyway, but being converted to have an MFD nearer to the MFD of a pre-2022 Summilux-M ASPH, with rangefinder coupling throughout the range.

 

Edited May 2, 2023 by RexGig0

[lct]

Reducing the MFD is not a simple task optically. A complete redesign could be necessary to keep good performance on close up. I would try the lens with a close focus adapter before imagining that such a work can give good results. 

[yossi]

On 5/2/2023 at 4:26 AM, yukosteel said:

Regardless of primarily targeted purpose and optimal designed conditions for equipment use - it remains to be just a guideline median. It's a human with own freedom of choice, personal preferences and habits who is making decision for own way of utilizing that equipment. Photography is an art, a profession, a way to depict the world in the way we percept for sharing with others. I don't see a serious reason to establish limiting guidelines or label people preferences wrong only because more classic and conservative baselines making most sense of utilizing RF camera system. 

Leica engineers have various justifications to produce numerous modern Leica lens with much closer than 1m focusing distance and native camera support of 0.7m-1m focusing in rangefinder, which  definitely has it's good use. Having extra closer focusing is not forcing anyone to use it, but it's a nice flexibility to have for that situations where you'd prefer to take a closer shot.

If Leica produce two modern versions of 35mm F1.4 Steel Rim, same optics, same mechanics, selling for same price, one with MFD limited to 0.9m, and second with MFD limited to 0.75m, I'm wondering how many people would decide to purchase the first option over the second, even though they don't plan to utilize that extra closer focusing range.

 

Great job and well said!  Cannot agree more.

Edited May 3, 2023 by yossi

[Al Brown]

Understanding the initial problem of Steel Rim's not so great MFD and asking the “what-if-instead” question led @yukosteel to an inovation that neither interferes with the limitation of Leica's RF, nor forces anyone to make any changes to their gear, it is merely a tutorial for those that are courageous enough to undergo the procedure.
 

[pgk]

On 5/2/2023 at 3:28 AM, mediumformula said:

I find it confusing that Leica reissued this lens with only the 1m MFD in the first place considering a common complaint about the pre-Asph Summiluxs is their lack of .7m MFD.  

Really? There seems to be an idea that Leica stands for quality, rightly or wrongly. Wide-angle lenses used to suffer from poorer 'quality' optical performance ot closer focus distances, as lct points out. Why would Leica reissue an older lens with closer focus if this might well be the case? And FWIW apart from anything else, I see no logical reason to modify such a lens when there are newer alternative which work better. Yes, its an innovative modification, but that doesn't make it a particularly useful one.

[yossi]

>>”wide-angle lenses used to suffer from poorer ‘quality’ optical performance ot (?) closer focusing distances…”

Fact: One variant of the original steel rim has a close focus distance of 0.65m. See attached pix. 

Fact: the selling point for the steel rim is not superior optical performance to begin with. It’s about its “classic” “characters” & Leica glow (reads spherical aberrations 😄).  Focusing it nearer would likely enhance this “classic characters” even more. Why not??

And btw, I am a great fan of the steel rim. Love the glow.

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Edited May 3, 2023 by yossi

[rramesh]

Why?

[yukosteel]

On 5/2/2023 at 9:36 PM, lct said:

Reducing the MFD is not a simple task optically. A complete redesign could be necessary to keep good performance on close up. I would try the lens with a close focus adapter before imagining that such a work can give good results. 

I think this is the best practical summary and recommendation in this thread so far, thank you lct, you nailed it.

However it's hard to try the lens on native M sensor, the approximate check could be testing it e.g. on Kolari Mod thin sensor filter FF camera. 

I'm glad to see many interesting points of views and various personal opinions here. Of course you may debate a lot around theoretical points and try to explain the unknown by logical explorations and come to new interesting conclusions, that definitely helps to deeper learn and overview various aspects of reduced MDF usefulness or flaws. Though all that info is barely influencing subjective opinion of person giving it a practical try and judging by themselves if the result is what they like to see.

We need to see some representative pictures to build that subjective opinion.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[lct]

6 hours ago, yukosteel said:

[...] it's hard to try the lens on native M sensor, the approximate check could be testing it e.g. on Kolari Mod thin sensor filter FF camera [...]

Summilux 35/1.4 v2 on Kolari mod A7r2 at about 0.7m below. Details in exif data. Could be worse but i'm not sure i would butcher my v2 for that.

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