Voigtländer 50mm Heliar Classic

[SNJ Ops]

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Hello all.

I’m wondering if anyone has experience of or owns the Voigtländer 50mm f1.5 Heliar Classic? I have a street photography project that requires a lens that is the opposite of clinical and was wondering just how vintage looking the Heliar Classic renders stopped down around f6.3-f11?

This might sound strange but I’m actively looking for a lens that is somewhat soft.

I have a 35mm Biogon and 50mm Planar for my regular street photography.

[hmzimelka]

3 minutes ago, SNJ Ops said:

Hello all.

I’m wondering if anyone has experience of or owns the Voigtländer 50mm f1.5 Heliar Classic? I have a street photography project that requires a lens that is the opposite of clinical and was wondering just how vintage looking the Heliar Classic renders stopped down around f6.3-f11?

This might sound strange but I’m actively looking for a lens that is somewhat soft.

I have a 35mm Biogon and 50mm Planar for my regular street photography.

I too would be very interested in this question being answered. FM Forums has a good thread on the Heliar Classic, but most shots there are all wide open. 

I'm very temped by the 50mm Heliar Classic for its, perhaps, twin nature... wider apertures vs stopped down. I have a Summicron-M 5cm Collapsible that can fulfil this for me, but its an old lens mechanically, and not always the easiest to use.

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[Anthony Miller]

I had one for a day. A bit larger than I was expecting but felt good on the camera and of course, no focusing tab so something to get used to if normally shooting Leica glass. Mine came new with a huge white particle or inclusion either stuck to the back of the front element or in the glass. It was near an edge but not acceptable on a $700 lens so it went back for a refund. I will just keep enjoying my 50mm f1.5 Summarit instead.

 

I did take this one image on my Leica M8 with the Heliar wide open.

 

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[01maciel]

I have a Heliar 50mm and I can confirm that it is in a class of its own. Comparing it to the Summarit 50mm 1.5 is quite close to the characteristics of the lens. As usual with Voigtländer, the build quality of the lens is very good. Here are two more shots. The lovely rose shot wide open, the colourful houses between f4 and 5.6. Click to view properly.
M10 + Voigtländer Heliar Classic 50mm f1.5 VM

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[01maciel]

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[01maciel]

Just found another one

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[01maciel]

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Last one wide open. The bicycle handlebars are as sharp as they could be with this lens. And there is certainly some 3D pop. A lens with a lot of character. I find the results extremely nice for some use cases. In other non-Leica forums, where sharpness is often used as the sole indicator of a lens' quality, the Heliar would be considered inferior.

M10 + Voigtländer Heliar Classic 50mm f1.5 VM (click to view properly)

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[SNJ Ops]

1 hour ago, 01maciel said:

Last one wide open. The bicycle handlebars are as sharp as they could be with this lens. And there is certainly some 3D pop. A lens with a lot of character. I find the results extremely nice for some use cases. In other non-Leica forums, where sharpness is often used as the sole indicator of a lens' quality, the Heliar would be considered inferior.

M10 + Voigtländer Heliar Classic 50mm f1.5 VM (click to view properly)

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“Inferior” is actually what I’m looking for. From your sample images the Heliar Classic might just be the lens I need.

[SNJ Ops]

3 hours ago, Somchai said:

It won’t be soft there. The vintage soft rendering stops after f4. 

Save yourself some money and adapt a real soft vintage lens for a fraction of the price. 

How much is the Heliar? $800? Why pay all that money on a modern lens pretending to be a “bad” performing old lens? Doesn’t make sense. 

Pick up a Jupiter 8 for less than $100 bucks. Soft vintage lenses cost pennies. You can get a few of them. There are vintage lenses that are very soft at every aperture and they cost $40-$50 bucks. 

Vintage lenses can be a gamble especially when bought online, However I have seen an Industar FED N-61 52mm f2.8 which is currently bidding at under £15 including shipping so its a gamble I’m more than willing to take. 

[intangiblethings]

I agree that the Jupiter option is something you could explore, but I've heard it's quite hard to get a good copy. 

I would like to see more comprehensive character comparisons between the Heliar and the Light Lens Lab Panchro. 

[SNJ Ops]

5 hours ago, Somchai said:

Yea. I never bought anything from eBay. Obviously always get from a reputable source. 
 

But it’s sort of odd to pay $800 for a lens made crappy “with character” 😀, when you can just get old crappy lenses for nothing. Like those Helios lenses that last forever and have that crazy bokeh. 
 

 

I occasionally use vintage lenses on my Sony camera for portraits, however due to the flange distance difference between M42 and E mount the adapters are as big as some as some of the lenses. In the end I bought the emout version of the 50mm f1.2 Nokton which I briefly used but ended up selling after deciding to buy into the M system for my street photography.

However for LTM/M39 lenses the adapter is a lot lot smaller by comparison. That was my main concern which quickly proved to be not an issue at all. 
 

Yes the Voigtländer is far more expensive but there’s peace of mind that it was designed specifically to be used on the M system and will be free of haze, fungus and other age related issues.

[01maciel]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb Somchai:

But it’s sort of odd to pay $800 for a lens made crappy “with character”

I don't think the wording is really close to the point

[ocean2059]

In general, with most of 50mm lenses, when you step f-stops down to f/6.3 – f/11, the images are pretty sharp across the frame if your focus distances are from 5 meters and beyond. The Heliar Classic is no exception – usable in most if not all shooting situation in my own user experiences. But when I use this lens, I set the f-stops between f/1.5 – f/2.8 with subjects around 1 – 3 meters distance. As mentioned earlier, the image characters are remarkably similar to those from the vintage Leica Summarit 50/1.5 M/LTM lens, even though the optical designs of the two lenses are different. I consider that one advantages that the Heliar Classic has is the ability to focus down to 0.5 meter (of course, from 0.7 to 0.5, the rangefinder is not engaged). 

I have had the lens for a while and I really like the unique characters that are very different than many of more modern Leica lenses. It’s even better to use it on Leica monochrome bodies. Whether it is worth the price, one has to answer on his/her own.  I purchased my copy used and I have seen the used prices fall between $500 - $600 USD.  

I include two images here, one taken at f/1.5 and the other at f/8, and the focus distance is about 0.7 meter. (you may click on the images to view in better resolution) 

 

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Edited April 29, 2023 by ocean2059

[ocean2059]

F-stop at 11 with focus distance at about 5 meters (with M10R)

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[ocean2059]

This one is at f/1.5.

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[01maciel]

Am 27.4.2023 um 18:45 schrieb SNJ Ops:

This might sound strange but I’m actively looking for a lens that is somewhat soft.

So how did your story progress and what did you end up doing?

[SNJ Ops]

7 hours ago, 01maciel said:

So how did your story progress and what did you end up doing?

I ended up getting the Voigtländer 50mm Heliar Classic but I haven’t yet used it for the type of shots I have in mind. 

I did shoot some regular street with it back in June and I was happy with the results. With editing I think I’ll be able to make it look even more vintage.

 

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Edited August 6, 2023 by SNJ Ops

[01maciel]

The Heliar Classic ekes out a bit of a shadowy existence in the M world. So I have to bring this thread out of the depths of the archive and certify that the lens can also produce sharp and atmospheric images when stopped down. Of course, only if you click on the photo you can see this in the reflection of the left side of the boat hull.

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[Emtsoh]

It is an interesting lens this one..

If anyone here has compared it to the new Noctilux 50 1.2, would be great to share some input.

Both lenses are considered ''character'' lenses (I guess because they render differently to the super sharp and modern glasses), however if the Heliar is somehow comparable to the expensive Noctilux, it would be a great alternative to consider.

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[FrozenInTime]

The Heliar is a traditional spherical lens ; the Noctilux 1.2 is arguably the progenitor of modern aspherical lenses.

Try comparing the Heliar with the older Summilux and other lenses from 1930's through the 1960's such as the Sonnar or the Cooke Panchro