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Leica Lens Survey Today – Hints at Possible New Lenses


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7 hours ago, sebben said:

Please please make a compact line of Elmarits a possibility. Everyone who wants big heavy lenses is already well served. 

The suggested 35/2.8 Elmar saves merely 40g over the f/2.5 Summarit which has now been discontinued. Replacing  the discontinued Summarits with a new line of Elmer's makes little sense to me I'm afraid.

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15 minutes ago, pgk said:

The suggested 35/2.8 Elmar saves merely 40g over the f/2.5 Summarit which has now been discontinued. Replacing  the discontinued Summarits with a new line of Elmer's makes little sense to me I'm afraid.

40g is a lot! It would make it 160g which would be really nice.

My favourite Leica lens is the 50mm Summarit which ways 105grams the only downside is that it only focuses to 0.8m

 

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59 minutes ago, sebben said:

40g is a lot! It would make it 160g which would be really nice.

My favourite Leica lens is the 50mm Summarit which ways 105grams the only downside is that it only focuses to 0.8m

 

Does the 50 Summarit (2.4 or 2.5?) weigh 105 grams? Really? That seems nearly impossible!

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1 hour ago, pgk said:

The suggested 35/2.8 Elmar saves merely 40g over the f/2.5 Summarit which has now been discontinued. Replacing  the discontinued Summarits with a new line of Elmer's makes little sense to me I'm afraid.

Is it possible that the “problem” the Summarit line had was that is was marketed and seen by the community as a “budget” line. Not only in the sense that the lenses were cheaper and slightly slower, but also (and perhaps more importantly) that they had somehow lesser built quality? 
 

What I’d like is a new range of really compact and light lenses with really premium build quality and good quality control. Optics don’t have to be perfect, they can be characterful in a nice way while performing better than the classic lenses.
 

Example: a new 35mm Summicron with the size of the v4 (but with better build quality). Weight should be under 200 grams and price around €3000. Then design the optics to be the nicest they can be (with *current* technology!) within the constraints above. I bet that lens would sell like hot cakes. 

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I see the point but not sure to which extent they want to sell lenses like "hot cakes" due to their very limited production capacity. It looks to me (again, an opinion) that their model is biased towards high margin, low volume products that people want and that are almost always on back-order - in a way it is as if they want demand to remain higher than offer. The APO-M-35 has a multi-years backlog from what I read (and hear from resellers), even the Summilux 35 Steel Rim remake plus others like the Noctilux 75... Many lenses cannot be found on their on line site and often, one has to consider a waiting list from resellers. 

I had and have Summarits, they have excellent build quality. It could seem lower but we often forget that light lens appear to have lower quality than bulkier models.

Back to this survey, whether they are testing the grounds to reassess a change of strategy or to confirm the current one is the question in my view. But honestly I don't see why they should change it (not that I don't want them to lower their prices!!). Despite all the different remarks or complaints about their current line up, there will always be a new Leica lens that one wants to buy whether it is a new design or a remake. The backlogs confirm this...

I also don't know to which extent the short focus adds to the manufacturing costs now that the design and engineering costs are "done". The APO-M 50 costs as much as the APO-M 35 while it is a standard .7m vs .3m The shorter focus distance could add to the bulk, but I don't see it as something that will shed (say) a thousand euro from the cost of a hypothetical APO-M 35 version that focuses to .7 instead of .3

 

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Yes, the proposed 35mm f2.8 is more compact but not much closer focus than the Summarit.  Apparently it is a focusing barrel modification that allows the closer focus of the newer lenses - why not incorporate it into every new lens?  (Especially for the asking price.)  The above-mentioned 35mm f2 Voigtländer is 28mm in length and has a modern ASPH design.  The proposed 35mm f2.8 Elmarit apparently does not have any aspheric element(s).  Looking at the evolution of the 28mm f2.8 Elmarits, the last version incorporating an ASPH element, Erwin Puts' analysis suggests a non-ASPH version might be more "retro" than modern.

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5 hours ago, roelandinho said:

Is it possible that the “problem” the Summarit line had was that is was marketed and seen by the community as a “budget” line. Not only in the sense that the lenses were cheaper and slightly slower, but also (and perhaps more importantly) that they had somehow lesser built quality? 

I have three Summarits. They are very well built lenses. Whilst 'budget' by Leica's standards, they were anything but cheap compared with any other lens of similar specification. But ypur point is well taken though, in that with a new line of Elmars and different marketing such lenses might be more profitable.

Edited by pgk
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6 hours ago, sebben said:

Why on earth would it need to be 6K? Leica is overpricing themselves. The rest are catching up with ever improving optical performance and much much better prices. I don’t think the Leica myth will keep sustaining the company over the next 25 years on its own. 

Why would it be the same or cheaper than the current $4K price if you want it to be more compact and have better optical quality? Leica prices are already high and Voigtlander has been making comparable lenses for much less money for years – yet Leica still has many of its lenses on perpetual backorder.

That said, I too wish Leica lenses were less expensive. 

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53 minutes ago, pgk said:

They are very well built lenses. Whilst 'budget' by Leica's standards, they were anything but cheap compared with any other lens of similar specification

Different feeling here i must say (35/2.5, 50/2.5, 75/2.5). I'd rate any of my late CV and ZM lenses significantly higher. Only my Summarit 90/2.4 seems to reach this level. YMMV.

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5 minutes ago, lct said:

Different feeling here i must say (35/2.5, 50/2.5, 75/2.5). I'd rate any of my late CV and ZM lenses significantly higher. Only my Summarit 90/2.4 seems to reach this level. YMMV.

Could it be the newer f/2.4 versions are better? I would love to try a Summarit to see for myself. 

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4 minutes ago, roelandinho said:

Could it be the newer f/2.4 versions are better? I would love to try a Summarit to see for myself. 

On basis of my own but limited experience, i would say better made yes. Both my Summarit 35/2.5 and 50/2.5 suffer from loose aperture rings while that of my Summarit 75/2.5 was fragile and has broken. No problem with my Summarit 90/2.4 though.

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16 minutes ago, lct said:

On basis of my own but limited experience, i would say better made yes. Both my Summarit 35/2.5 and 50/2.5 suffer from loose aperture rings while that of my Summarit 75/2.5 was fragile and has broken. No problem with my Summarit 90/2.4 though.

Thanks. I think I want to try the 50 mm f/2.4. I read it weighs only 105 grams (which can't possibly be true, can it?), but even if it's 190 grams (like mentioned in some other places) that's still fantastic for a 50 mm lens. Now if only it doesn't flare too easily... 

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Just now, roelandinho said:

Now if only it doesn't flare too easily...

My 50/2.5 can produce some naughty flare in special circumstances, 10:00 AM with the sun outside the frame typically.

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4 minutes ago, lct said:

My 50/2.5 can produce some naughty flare in special circumstances, 10:00 AM with the sun outside the frame typically.

Noooooooo... 😞 Is this with or without the lens hood? 

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52 minutes ago, lct said:

Different feeling here i must say (35/2.5, 50/2.5, 75/2.5). I'd rate any of my late CV and ZM lenses significantly higher. Only my Summarit 90/2.4 seems to reach this level. YMMV.

Oddly enough, my experience is that all work and perform well although the 90 has more CA than the others. And the 35 is pretty flare resistant too. Could be sample variation; they are hand assembled after all ( I assume, being Leica).

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13 minutes ago, pgk said:

Could be sample variation; they are hand assembled after all ( I assume, being Leica).

I seem to recall that this flare issue has been recorded elsewhere but i could not say where or by whom. As for Leica assembling those lenses, i will only talk in the presence of my lawyer :D.

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