Any thoughts on which of the m lenses might best replace the excellent Fuji GF 110mm, f2.0.

[Sid Bolan]

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In the hope of replacing my Fuji medium format with something smaller, I have just purchased a Leica M11. However, the sticking point, it turns out, is not just the medium format body but also the excellent Fuji GF 110mm, f2.0. Any thoughts on which of the Leica m lenses might best take its place?

 

[goodbokeh]

90/2.0 AA or 90/1.5 Asph. would be the closest matches. Sid, I have the 100S and the 110 also, so I understand your angst. When you leave medium format you simply aren't going to get that 110 look back. So be resolved about that and look to the positives of your new M.

[sometimesmaybe]

2 hours ago, Sid Bolan said:

Any thoughts on which of the Leica m lenses might best take its place?

i went through this process about 7 months ago, when i got a m246

i'd agree 90mm is the natural replacement for the 110mm, but from a usability standpoint have a think about something like a 75mm

the problem at least for me is that nailing critical focus on a 90mm is hard when i don't have AF to help. 75mm is a good compromise between 50mm's ease of use and the FOV/compression of a 90mm

have a look at the CV Nokton 75mm f1.5 or the CV Ultron 75mm f1.5 (if you're not obsessed with shallow DOF)

[hdmesa]

5 hours ago, sometimesmaybe said:

i went through this process about 7 months ago, when i got a m246

i'd agree 90mm is the natural replacement for the 110mm, but from a usability standpoint have a think about something like a 75mm

the problem at least for me is that nailing critical focus on a 90mm is hard when i don't have AF to help. 75mm is a good compromise between 50mm's ease of use and the FOV/compression of a 90mm

have a look at the CV Nokton 75mm f1.5 or the CV Ultron 75mm f1.5 (if you're not obsessed with shallow DOF)

I think you mean 75 Ultron 1.9? It still has very shallow DOF plus the benefit of 0.5m MFD.

I've used the GF 110 on both 50S/R, and if I had to replace the look of that lens on the 35mm M sensor, I would break the piggy bank (all of them) and get the 75 Noctilux or 90 Summilux. Insanely expensive, but it is what it is.

Edited April 10, 2023 by hdmesa

[sometimesmaybe]

30 minutes ago, hdmesa said:

Insanely expensive, but it is what it is

that sums up my leica experience nicely 😅

also yes typo on my part CV Ultron 75mm f1.9.

[Olaf_ZG]

8 hours ago, sometimesmaybe said:

 

have a look at the CV Nokton 75mm f1.5 or the CV Ultron 75mm f1.5 (if you're not obsessed with shallow DOF)

The nokton is totally different then the gf110, as it renders much softer. Personally I prefer this but it would not be a replacement in this case.

[SiggiGun]

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My choice will be between APO75 and APO90. 75 is smaller but more difficult to focus. The 90 is bigger and easier to focus (no FLE). Both lenses are great in color rendering, sharpness etc. 

however, for travel the best alternative is the small, lightweight and very sharp Macro-Elmar. 

[sometimesmaybe]

8 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said:

The nokton is totally different then the gf110

you sir are of course correct 🙂

but my comment is more directed towards usability and the transition from a medium format system with PDAF and IBIS, to the M system... with its manual RF and brick like ergonomics

having a 1kg lens on a GFX100s is no problem, but having a 0.6kg lens on a M is a totally different proposition (i can't even imagine using the current 90mm lux on a M body - that baby weighs 1kg). similarly focusing the 110mm on the GFX is reasonably easy, but focusing a 90mm on RF is challenging (even with an EVF)

@Sid Bolan just as a side note, i actually prefer using my m246 + 75mm to my GFX + 110mm because:

1. i spend far less time editing; and
2. the images coming from the m246 are more than good enough my for my normal use case

 

[Stuart Richardson]

The 90mm APO Summicron is a killer lens. It does not get talked about as much now because it is a bit older, as the first of the super high resolution APO M lenses. It is cheaper than most on the used market, but it is a stellar lens with excellent bokeh, color and contrast, as well as excellent sharpness edge to edge, especially at distance. I have compared it to my SL 90-280mm, and it is ahead of the 90-280, which is extremely good itself. I also think it is a lot more usable than something like the 75mm Summilux or 90mm Noctilux, as those lenses are so large and heavy by comparison. The 75mm APO Summicron is another great option, but it is noticeably wider (as you might imagine!). It is also worth thinking about what your standard lenses are. If you are mostly a 35mm shooter, then the 75mm is the natural pairing. If you are mostly a 50mm shooter, then the 90mm is a natural pairing.

Anyway, it probably will not tell you too much, but here are a few from the 90mm APO...I seem to use it for aerial work a lot! 90mm is good for that...

 

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[Sid Bolan]

Thank you Stuart for these extraordinary photos.  I doubt I'd have much opportunity for aerial photography and volcanoes here in London, but they provide a wonderful insight into the 90 apo's qualities and to the extraordinary country you have adopted as your own. Very much enjoyed looking at your websites, both of them.

It's been such an inspiration to read all the suggestions made here. The conclusion appears to be that to keep the medium format qualities of the GF110 there is a price to pay and that price is weight, volume and if I follow the life affirming advice of  @hdmesa and @goodbokeh considerable cost.

One of the many things I love about the M system is its diminutive lenses. They may not always match medium format levels but I am, at least, willing to carry them with me away from the studio.

With that in mind I'll definitely be giving the 90 apo a trial, along with one or other of @sometimesmaybe Voigtlander 75s. I might even follow  @SiggiGun and give the macro-elmar a try, though at f4.0 I'm not expecting to be stunned by its wafer thin DOF. 

Thank you everyone. What a goldmine of experience you are.

 

[hdmesa]

Good luck with your decision. If it were me, I would go with the CV 75 1.5 due to balance of size/weight and very neutral but beautiful rendering. It’s been noted that this lens improves in contrast/sharpness just by shooting it right between f/1.5 and f/2 without loosing the look it has wide open.

I would also note that the CV 75 1.9 would be a smaller option if you liked the look of the GF 80, which has a bit more character than the GF 110.

Although the larger Leica 75 Noct/90 Lux options are closer in look to the GF 110, I wouldn’t want to carry those around with me regularly, either.

Edited April 11, 2023 by hdmesa

[Stuart Richardson]

16 hours ago, Sid Bolan said:

Thank you Stuart for these extraordinary photos.  I doubt I'd have much opportunity for aerial photography and volcanoes here in London, but they provide a wonderful insight into the 90 apo's qualities and to the extraordinary country you have adopted as your own. Very much enjoyed looking at your websites, both of them.

 

Thank you for the very kind words! I should note too that the aerial photos were just taken out the window the regular commercial flights to and from Iceland, not on a special trip etc. If you can tolerate a window seat, there are often lovely things to see! I am sure the 90mm APO would do well in London as well. The collapsible 90mm Elmar is attractive in its own right...90mm at f4 is still fairly isolated, especially since you can focus closer with it. If you want to focus more on compactness, it is worth a try.

[jaeger]

It's intrigue to see all of the comments above.

[RexGig0]

If “diminutive” is desirable, the Macro-Elmar 90mm option, as already mentioned, certainly merits attention. I do not yet own one, but it remains high on my mental list of future additions. I already acquired a well-preserved, pre-owned Macro-Adapter-M, in anticipation of eventually adding the lens, itself. (I can already use the adapter with my NON-diminutive Thambar-M 90mm lens, which is a “character” lens, so, probably not relevant to this discussion.) I have no delusions that the Leica M system is going to rival my Canon macro-shooting equipment, but, unless the “mission” is serious macro, it is nice to be able to enhance the ability of M equipment, by toting one additional accessory, rather than the additional bulk and weight of DSLR equipment.

The Zeiss 85mm f/4 ZM is light in weight, if not exactly diminutive in length. I acquired this one, in anticipation of finally being able to get on the road, to explore landscape opportunities. The price point is notably buyer-friendlier than Leica M lenses. Fred Miranda posted some amazing images, with his sample of this lens, at his forum.

I can attest that the APO Summicron-M 75mm ASPH is certainly an interesting lens, and I know that shooters can do excellent work with it. A relatively recent acquisition, for me, I have yet to build much skill. Rangefinder focusing is notably more challenging, for me, than with a 50mm lens. This prompted me to acquire a pre-owned Visoflex 020, to help with this lens, but I found the Visoflex annoying, so, well, back to working with the rangefinder. This ‘Cron has a magnification ratio that might make it quite useful for close-range shooting, so, I plan to try it with the Macro-Adapter-M, focusing with Live View.

 

[Sid Bolan]

On 4/11/2023 at 8:34 PM, hdmesa said:

Good luck with your decision. If it were me, I would go with the CV 75 1.5 due to balance of size/weight and very neutral but beautiful rendering. It’s been noted that this lens improves in contrast/sharpness just by shooting it right between f/1.5 and f/2 without loosing the look it has wide open.

I would also note that the CV 75 1.9 would be a smaller option if you liked the look of the GF 80, which has a bit more character than the GF 110.

Although the larger Leica 75 Noct/90 Lux options are closer in look to the GF 110, I wouldn’t want to carry those around with me regularly, either.

I have slight packhorse tendencies that often lead me into carrying more than I should; on occasions, more than I can use. I will certainly be trying the 75 1.5 and keeping in mind how the lens will feel after several hours hanging on my shoulder.

[Sid Bolan]

On 4/12/2023 at 4:23 PM, RexGig0 said:

If “diminutive” is desirable, the Macro-Elmar 90mm option, as already mentioned, certainly merits attention. I do not yet own one, but it remains high on my mental list of future additions. I already acquired a well-preserved, pre-owned Macro-Adapter-M, in anticipation of eventually adding the lens, itself. (I can already use the adapter with my NON-diminutive Thambar-M 90mm lens, which is a “character” lens, so, probably not relevant to this discussion.) I have no delusions that the Leica M system is going to rival my Canon macro-shooting equipment, but, unless the “mission” is serious macro, it is nice to be able to enhance the ability of M equipment, by toting one additional accessory, rather than the additional bulk and weight of DSLR equipment.

The Zeiss 85mm f/4 ZM is light in weight, if not exactly diminutive in length. I acquired this one, in anticipation of finally being able to get on the road, to explore landscape opportunities. The price point is notably buyer-friendlier than Leica M lenses. Fred Miranda posted some amazing images, with his sample of this lens, at his forum.

I can attest that the APO Summicron-M 75mm ASPH is certainly an interesting lens, and I know that shooters can do excellent work with it. A relatively recent acquisition, for me, I have yet to build much skill. Rangefinder focusing is notably more challenging, for me, than with a 50mm lens. This prompted me to acquire a pre-owned Visoflex 020, to help with this lens, but I found the Visoflex annoying, so, well, back to working with the rangefinder. This ‘Cron has a magnification ratio that might make it quite useful for close-range shooting, so, I plan to try it with the Macro-Adapter-M, focusing with Live View.

 

I had no idea there could be so many paths leading from this crossroad. Do, please, share some results from your 75 'cron + macro-adapter-m combo. 

[Jared]

On 4/9/2023 at 10:48 AM, Sid Bolan said:

In the hope of replacing my Fuji medium format with something smaller, I have just purchased a Leica M11. However, the sticking point, it turns out, is not just the medium format body but also the excellent Fuji GF 110mm, f2.0. Any thoughts on which of the Leica m lenses might best take its place?

 

I think it depends a lot on what you are hoping to do with this replacement lens. Are you planning on using this lens for portraiture or landscapes or what? If portraits, I'd say the 75 Summicron APO is the best bet. You get a reasonably shallow depth of field (though not as shallow as the 110, of course). You get a much smaller and lighter form factor than your GF, and you get excellent on-axis optical performance with very gentle rendering. I wouldn't, however, recommend it as a landscape lens as it is a bit soft in the corners even stopped down a bit. That's pretty much irrelevant for portraits, but can be frustrating for landscapes. 

I never bonded with the 90mm Summicron APO, so I wouldn't recommend that even though it's a closer match to your 110 in terms of field of view. Despite the APO designation, it has a fair amount of longitudinal chromatic aberration wide open. I also found it harder to nail focus than the 75mm even with equivalent framing. It also doesn't focus as close as the 75mm, so the 75mm is arguably better for head shots (though you may prefer the perspective from a longer lens). 

If you want a bitingly sharp short telephoto in a compact form factor, look no farther than the 90mm Macro. It's a really fantastic lens, a solid choice for landscape work, and is very small and light. Plus, you get the benefits of having some macro (or at least relatively close) focus capabilities. It's slow, though, so you may not want it if your main intent is portraiture.

I can't speak to any of the Voigtlander lenses in this focal length. You'll have to look at others' experiences for those lenses.

Obviously, no Leica M lenses are going to have autofocus, so in that regard nothing is going to be able to match the GF 110mm. You'll need relatively static targets for telephoto images with an M.

 

- Jared