Peter Karbe's lens and camera of choice in 2023

[wizard]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Am 19.3.2023 um 15:51 schrieb Danner:

Apparently, Mr. Karbe values technical perfection over artistic rendering.

That is very true. I met Mr. Karbe several times, and he was always thrilled by the improvements in image quality resulting from the progress in optical construction. Personally, he could hardly understand why anyone would use old and optically inferior lenses, let alone the new trend of reissue lenses. As an optical engineer, his aim always was to provide a lens that is as good as it gets (within the set boundaries obviously, such as for example size and cost).

[fil-m]

In 40 years his lenses will be seen as "optically inferior" and everyone will rush to buy them for their "soul and character" compared to 2070's clinical lenses  

Assuming photography as we know it, remains  

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[aesop]

On 4/23/2023 at 9:24 PM, otto.f said:

I don't see why he would not be honest about this. Every choice he would have made could have been set aside as commercial. There are a lot of renovated M lenses at the moment, e.g. the Summiluxes 50 and 35, and new SL lenses too. If he just wanted it sharpsharpsharp he would have chosen an SL lens. And the big campaign at the moment is M11M with the new Summilux50, which he did not choose.

 

    ...probably because the new 50mm Summilux ASPH (11728) offers nothing extra over the previous 50mm Summilux ASPH (11891), unless you are into close-up focusing.

Remarkably, the MTF graphs for both lenses look like a cut-and-paste job. It is also worth remembering that the 11891 was a film-era design from 2002, and even though design has clearly moved on since then, the 11728 from 2023 shows little evidence of any optical improvement.

Personally, I have never considered close-up focusing ability to be one of the key strengths of the M system (for obvious reasons). Karbe is an top engineer but, technical achievements notwithstanding, I would not agonise over his personal preferences that involve an artistic element. To me, it makes total sense for Karbe the engineer to choose a more modern, über-sharp, gee-whizz 'digital' lens.

For what it is worth, I actually prefer the rendering of my Mandler pre-ASPH 50 Summilux (11114) to that of my clinical Karbe 11891, especially at full bore. But I guess that is irrelevant as I am not Head of Optics at Leica. Right?🙄

    

[John Smith]

4 hours ago, aesop said:

 

    ...probably because the new 50mm Summilux ASPH (11728) offers nothing extra over the previous 50mm Summilux ASPH (11891), unless you are into close-up focusing.

Remarkably, the MTF graphs for both lenses look like a cut-and-paste job. It is also worth remembering that the 11891 was a film-era design from 2002, and even though design has clearly moved on since then, the 11728 from 2023 shows little evidence of any optical improvement.

Personally, I have never considered close-up focusing ability to be one of the key strengths of the M system (for obvious reasons). Karbe is an top engineer but, technical achievements notwithstanding, I would not agonise over his personal preferences that involve an artistic element. To me, it makes total sense for Karbe the engineer to choose a more modern, über-sharp, gee-whizz 'digital' lens.

For what it is worth, I actually prefer the rendering of my Mandler pre-ASPH 50 Summilux (11114) to that of my clinical Karbe 11891, especially at full bore. But I guess that is irrelevant as I am not Head of Optics at Leica. Right?🙄

    

I am considering trading in my Summilux for the new CF version. But I use an SL2, and it might make more sense to buy the new Summicron-SL 50 instead of the Summilux. Decisions. Decisions. 

[otto.f]

17 hours ago, aesop said:

über-sharp

As far as I know now after studying its behavior in Sean Reid’s tests, and owning it now for 10 days, I find the APO35 the first Karbe lens which is not over the top, has natural sharpness and a classic bo-keh, comparable with the Summaron 35 M and the Summicron 35 R. I can’t wait to see how it draws with Delta 100.
I sold my Summilux 50 asph i in 2008 because I’m not very much into 50mm and given that I found it too big. Summicrons and 39mm lenses are the first choice for M’s, so the Elmar-M 50 is my little lensy. Hard to imagine I would sell it. 

[Jon Warwick]

On 4/29/2023 at 7:32 AM, otto.f said:

As far as I know now after studying its behavior in Sean Reid’s tests, and owning it now for 10 days, I find the APO35 the first Karbe lens which is not over the top, has natural sharpness and a classic bo-keh

Sounds rather like my sort of lens! "Natural sharpness" is something I'm always looking for. I know a lot of people love the SL Summicron primes, but i thought the SL 50mm Summicron on the SL2 wasn't always to my taste, especially for some portraits where i couldn't get it gentle enough.  

[otto.f]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

6 minutes ago, Jon Warwick said:

Sounds rather like my sort of lens! "Natural sharpness" is something I'm always looking for. I know a lot of people love the SL Summicron primes, but i thought the SL 50mm Summicron on the SL2 wasn't always to my taste, especially for some portraits where i couldn't get it gentle enough.  

Plus the image stabilization on the SL2 which makes the digital world complete and people won’t believe anymore that it’s a living creature

[stephen.w]

 

Andreas Kaufmann's favourite M lens is a Canadian Summicron (v2? v3?), seen here on his M11:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CkCPbkByS-p/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

[trickness]

3 hours ago, otto.f said:

Plus the image stabilization on the SL2 which makes the digital world complete and people won’t believe anymore that it’s a living creature

Lol this might be the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever read on here, and that’s saying something 

[otto.f]

On 4/30/2023 at 1:11 PM, trickness said:

Lol this might be the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever read on here, and that’s saying something 

Talking about natrural sharpness

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

Edited May 2 by otto.f

[trickness]

4 minutes ago, otto.f said:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

This is a great portrait. But it is no more a document of a "living person" for having been shot on an M rather than an SL or any other camera. No IBIS has literally zero to do with the success of this image.

Edited May 2 by trickness

[otto.f]

Just to be clear: I did not make this foto, nor with a Leica. Made by Francis Raoul with a 4x5 and posted at Flickr, sorry that this origin didn’t come with the image

16 hours ago, otto.f said:

Talking about natrural sharpness

 

[chris7273]

On 3/19/2023 at 3:51 PM, Danner said:

Apparently, Mr. Karbe values technical perfection over artistic rendering.

for artistic rendering : no need for a Leica. A Lomo is sufficient.... if still too sharp, just add a smear of vasoline (... on the lens of course 🙂 )

[pippy]

On 4/30/2023 at 10:57 AM, stephen.w said:

Andreas Kaufmann's favourite M lens is a Canadian Summicron (v2? v3?), seen here on his M11...

Appears to be a 1977 v2 35mm Summicron. Interesting choice!

Philip.

[trisberg]

15 hours ago, pippy said:

Appears to be a 1977 v2 35mm Summicron. Interesting choice!

Philip.

I think that they were making the v3 by then, the v2 is older and looks a bit different from the front. Some pics here.

-Thomas

[pippy]

7 hours ago, trisberg said:

I think that they were making the v3 by then, the v2 is older and looks a bit different from the front. Some pics here.

-Thomas

Thank you for the correction, Thomas, and of course you are quite correct. Mea Culpa. I knew what I meant to type but clearly had a brain-fart moment...

Philip.

[jakontil]

On 4/30/2023 at 4:57 PM, stephen.w said:

 

Andreas Kaufmann's favourite M lens is a Canadian Summicron (v2? v3?), seen here on his M11:

https://www.instagram.com/p/CkCPbkByS-p/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Dr. Kaufmann didnt seem to favor the classic strap that came with m11