Why I stayed with SL 601 instead of upgrading to SL2

[pf4eva]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Hi folks,

I currently have SL 601 and I've recently bought SL2, which I'm going to sell soon, so I though to put some info why I'm choosing to stay with 601. It might be helpful for some.

 

First, things I like about SL2 in comparison to SL 601:

1. Better viewfinder, OLED, more contrasty and Sharper (although not by much)

2. Better LCD, noticeably sharper than 601 as it has more pixels

3. USB charging, no need to take additional charger for travel.

4. Ability to use AF lens adapters (on 601 Novoflex is pretty much the only choice and it doesn't really work)

5. Enhanced live view giving a nice boost at very low light situations

6. Eye AF is very nice

 

 

Now what things made me keep my SL for longer:

1. Although viewfinder is higher res, difference is not huge and if you switch to 120fps it drops resolution to something unusable when half pressed. Viewfinder also has lower magnification.

2. AF is faster, but not significantly better than on my 601 with leica lenses (24-90 and 75/2). I've tested it in different conditions and I was suprised that even in low light 601 didn't perform significantly worse than SL2

3. Rear buttons on a left hand side, which mean to view them you can't really press play with right hand

4. Design changes are questionable. They rounded some corners near the shutter button, which looks weird. Also LCD screen with buttons now extended from the body. Strap lugs are external.

5. Menu looks more complicated now

6. Fotos app still slow, useable as a remote, but that's the same as with 601

7. no GPS, you need to keep phone with BT enabled for geotagging. This is not a problem by itself, however if camera is used by more than one person it is not great

8. Camera is more rubberised, which might be good, however it feels less solid for some reason. I never had an issue with SL 601 ergonomics.

 

My plan was to get rid of SL 601, Sony A7RII+200-600mm and get SL2 + bigma150-600mm instead, but now I think I'll just get another 601 + 150-600mm

 

 

Edited March 6 by pf4eva

[LocalHero1953]

You don't mention IBIS - is that not useful to you?

[Advertisement]

The Leica Q3 is available for pre-order at B&H Photo Video and Adorama

[pf4eva]

1 minute ago, LocalHero1953 said:

You don't mention IBIS - is that not useful to you?

Not really, on shorter lenses camera is stable enough to take decently sharp pictures with 1/f rule, on longer lenses OIS is much better.

Also, IBIS is not really a free lunch, it may degrade picture in corners etc.

[LocalHero1953]

Yes, the 1/f rule works, but I can go 2-4 stops slower than that with IBIS - with slow moving subjects anyway. 

[pf4eva]

4 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Yes, the 1/f rule works, but I can go 2-4 stops slower than that with IBIS - with slow moving subjects anyway. 

True, but as I said, I can't say it is extremely useful, 24-90 has very decent OS, with fix lenses I don't feel i really need IBIS. Don't get me wrong it is a useful feature, but I had multiple cameras with and without it, and I can happily live with just OS in the lens. I'd personally would prefer higher cleaner iso, than IBIS.

 

Edited March 6 by pf4eva

[Robert E]

45 minutes ago, pf4eva said:

and I can happily live with just OS in the lens.

Which severely limits you to lenses available and leaves out all M lenses. Ive had both cameras and sold my 601. The improvements in the SL2 make it a so much better body. The SL lenses with OS are big, heavy and expensive. There are so many other good lenses out there that work great with the SL2’s IBIS. Example; my Leica VE 24-70 f2.8 is awesome on it. I also frequently use some of the TL zooms on the SL2 that work nicely with the camera. Sure, they have slower aperture’s, but the IBIS compensates for that and photos come out sharp, even with the 55-135mm zoom. Now that’s a great carry round lens! Even with the APS-C crop, you still get the sweet 22mp in your files.
It’s your choice of course, but sorry, the SL2 wins for me.

[Jeff S]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

You also didn’t mention difference in camera resolution (47 vs 24 MP), or other potential image rendering differences. 

Jeff

Edited March 6 by Jeff S

[Photoworks]

1 hour ago, pf4eva said:

1. Although viewfinder is higher res, difference is not huge and if you switch to 120fps it drops resolution to something unusable when half pressed. Viewfinder also has lower magnification.

isn't it from the AFc not the 120fps?
The LCD-EVF of 601 looses color and definition in low light .

1 hour ago, pf4eva said:

AF is faster, but not significantly better than on my 601 with leica lenses (24-90 and 75/2). I've tested it in different conditions and I was suprised that even in low light 601 didn't perform significantly worse than SL2

the limitation is based on contrast AF, but the addition of Face Eye AF makes it much quicker for shooting people

1 hour ago, pf4eva said:

Rear buttons on a left hand side, which mean to view them you can't really press play with right hand

you can if you hold the camera in left hand. but a much more useful option is to hold shutter button to preview in EVF

I you use othe leica camera you will appreciate the design consistency of layout and menu.

1 hour ago, pf4eva said:

Fotos app still slow, useable as a remote, but that's the same as with 601

The issue is most likely the 2.4 g wifi. newer camera use the 5g connection do much better.

But USB-C is fast to shoot tether on computer and iPad Pro

1 hour ago, pf4eva said:

no GPS, you need to keep phone with BT enabled for geotagging. This is not a problem by itself, however if camera is used by more than one person it is not great

hunchback of notre dame. People where complaining that it took longer to get a connection in some situations.
Many manufacturers opt to use the cellphone with assisted gps for this, I think it is overrated and a proper GPS is probably better for my taste, but i must say using external tracker with multiple GPS signal made positions much more precise , I log my data true Apple Watch ultra with success . Maybe more beneficial on the battery.

 

1 hour ago, pf4eva said:

Camera is more rubberised, which might be good, however it feels less solid for some reason. I never had an issue with SL 601 ergonomics.

Both camera still scratch easily of the paint of the edges.

 

1 hour ago, LocalHero1953 said:

You don't mention IBIS - is that not useful to you?

IBIS is a good option for summicron lenses and longer zooms, SL2 is smart to decide which IS system to use and the combination to use. 
IBIS makes it better for video, Make it better for focusing , and composing.

the 601 was a real good camera in 2015, the limited lens option made it hard to justify the price of almost $8000 at the time.
But 2019 lunch of SL2 was much more welcome with IBIS and 1.5 more DR, better video 10 bit to SD, more lenses , better EVF, 2 faster memory cards slot.

All considering the 601 is still today a good camera, and it good someone still uses the old stuff.

[pf4eva]

3 minutes ago, Photoworks said:

isn't it from the AFc not the 120fps?
The LCD-EVF of 601 looses color and definition in low light .

I'm pretty sure it is the same with AFS. In terms of color in 601 in low light - probably,I didn't notice too much difference. IMO In a low light I don't think anyone really care about color in EVF.

7 minutes ago, Photoworks said:

IBIS is a good option for summicron lenses and longer zooms, SL2 is smart to decide which IS system to use and the combination to use. 
IBIS makes it better for video, Make it better for focusing , and composing.

As I've mentioned, for long telephoto IBIS is not very useful. Agreed on video, but I'm not shooting video at all.

 

9 minutes ago, Photoworks said:

But 2019 lunch of SL2 was much more welcome with IBIS and 1.5 more DR, better video 10 bit to SD, more lenses , better EVF, 2 faster memory cards slot.

 

SL2 is better camera, no doubt, but I can't say DR is so much better, other differences are also quite minimal IMO. It is not as fast as I've expected. And for me personally, I'd rather have 2x601 than single SL2

[pf4eva]

35 minutes ago, Robert E said:

Which severely limits you to lenses available and leaves out all M lenses. Ive had both cameras and sold my 601. The improvements in the SL2 make it a so much better body. The SL lenses with OS are big, heavy and expensive. There are so many other good lenses out there that work great with the SL2’s IBIS. Example; my Leica VE 24-70 f2.8 is awesome on it. I also frequently use some of the TL zooms on the SL2 that work nicely with the camera. Sure, they have slower aperture’s, but the IBIS compensates for that and photos come out sharp, even with the 55-135mm zoom. Now that’s a great carry round lens! Even with the APS-C crop, you still get the sweet 22mp in your files.
It’s your choice of course, but sorry, the SL2 wins for me.

I was thinking about this as well. I use M lenses on M camera mainly and M doesn't have IBIS, so I'm fine with that. IBIS is useful, but far from decision maker for me. I have 24-90mm which I think is the best zoom available, I don't like 24-70 because of the range mainly as well as because it is rebranded Sigma.

 

[Photoworks]

Sounds like you option to save money made your choice .

Nothing wrong with that!

I still find many point to disagree .

[pf4eva]

5 minutes ago, Photoworks said:

Sounds like you option to save money made your choice .

Nothing wrong with that!

I still find many point to disagree .

Partially correct, for me, those changes do not justify over twice the price and some things are even worse than in original SL IMO. SL2/SL2s is really an minor incremental upgrade in terms of performance IMO.

Edited March 6 by pf4eva

[pf4eva]

58 minutes ago, Jeff S said:

You also didn’t mention difference in camera resolution (47 vs 24 MP), or other potential image rendering differences. 

Jeff

My aim was to replace Sony A7Rii+SL1 with single SL2. Apart from increased resolution, I don't see how it renders differently than 601, tbh I'm not even sure if any better. It looks like colour from 601 out of the box is actually better (but that's just a personal preference). Maybe this is due to original SL used more exotic sensor than standard off the shelf Panasonic sensor in SL2.

[Jeff S]

6 minutes ago, pf4eva said:

My aim was to replace Sony A7Rii+SL1 with single SL2. Apart from increased resolution, 

So are you keeping the Sony, or do you not value in any way the SL2 resolution advantage over the SL601?

Jeff

[pf4eva]

7 minutes ago, Jeff S said:

So are you keeping the Sony, or do you not value in any way the SL2 resolution advantage over the SL601?

Jeff

I want to have convenience of single system. Also Sony ergonomically is very bad IMO. So I still will be selling Sony, but getting a second SL 601. 

[Jeff S]

6 minutes ago, pf4eva said:

I want to have convenience of single system. Also Sony ergonomically is very bad IMO. So I still will be selling Sony, but getting a second SL 601. 

So resolution difference between SL versions is not at all meaningful, as it did not appear on your lists.

Jeff

[Simone_DF]

Why don’t you wait for the SL3? It could be a more significant generation jump and at the sane time it’d drop the price of a SL2 even more

[pf4eva]

1 minute ago, Simone_DF said:

Why don’t you wait for the SL3? It could be a more significant generation jump and at the sane time it’d drop the price of a SL2 even more

Yes, I hope SL3 will have a phase detection as s5ii and high resolution BSI sensor. Would be nice to have different resolution options for RAW as well, similar to what they did in M11. We'll see, after trying SL2 i really not impressed direction Leica is taking with SL. Seems like they're trying to cut corners now.

[IkarusJohn]

The 601 is incredibly robust, and I also saw nothing in the SL2 to tempt me.  I’m generally not on an upgrade treadmill …

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[darylgo]

@pf4eva

I read with interest your post, my SL continues to perform well for me.  Playing the numbers game 24mp is underwhelming, the images tell a different story and rarely do I see much that makes higher resolution necessary.  I am continually underwhelmed by greater megapixels and overwhelmed with Leica 24mp sensors. 

Rarely mentioned on these forums is the Panasonic S1R, perhaps I shouldn't but as an L alliance member I might not be breaking any rules.  The camera has similar capabilities as the SL2.  That Leica and Panasonic are now promoting further cooperation I can't help but think the sharing happened with the SL2 and S1R.