Guest tummydoc Posted October 30, 2007 Share #21 Posted October 30, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) well the sad thing is that we all know these are the issues and it is entirely believable, which is why I would not say this is not trolling.... I'd say the fact these issues are well-known and have been discussed to death for almost a year, absolutely makes this trolling. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 30, 2007 Posted October 30, 2007 Hi Guest tummydoc, Take a look here I love my M8, but it is rubbish. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Shootist Posted October 30, 2007 Share #22 Posted October 30, 2007 I'd say the fact these issues are well-known and have been discussed to death for almost a year, absolutely makes this trolling. You got that right. Or he never heard of any of the problems, which is hard to believe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
canlogic Posted October 30, 2007 Share #23 Posted October 30, 2007 I'm not sure if this is true today on current models. The H3 (39 meg Kodak sensor) has it built in to the sensor. The Mamiya backs come with removable filters that fit on the sensor. And I haven't seen any mention of needing IR filters with other current MF backs. The info on the Dalsa chips just says that they are "perfectly matched to the visual spectrum." Thought that I had read that somewhere recently. Maybe the AA filter? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jay101 Posted October 30, 2007 Share #24 Posted October 30, 2007 I'd say the fact these issues are well-known and have been discussed to death for almost a year, absolutely makes this trolling. Long term members of any forum always sigh when newer members raise old issues, or fail to use the search function before posting (guilty as charged), but if the issues are new to the user who raises the questions, then they're new from their perspective and older hands can always skip the thread concerned. The early idea about a sticky for "pre-purchase advice" is a good one though. Meantime, I am taking heart that some members of this forum are quite defensive about the M8, as this tells me the camera is worth defending, and thats the best news of all in this thread... @Ken_Tanaka - excellent post, thanks for your wise words. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob_x2004 Posted October 30, 2007 Share #25 Posted October 30, 2007 tummydoc, I am new to Leica. Now lets see. You walk into the Leica dealer with a fist full of dollars...which bits do they start telling you about. At various stages two Australian dealers told me they were really pissed with this site. I wonder whether they would send people here before making a purchase? People get caught up, or caught out with their expectations. It happens tummy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chilihead Posted October 30, 2007 Share #26 Posted October 30, 2007 Buy a brand new Noctilux and a Brand new Asph Summi to go with your rubbish M8 and then take two aspirin - you'll feel much better. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
robertwright Posted October 30, 2007 Share #27 Posted October 30, 2007 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'd say the fact these issues are well-known and have been discussed to death for almost a year, absolutely makes this trolling. i think if you read the tone of the op it is pretty clear it is lament and not bashing, overall it feels balanced to me, at least for someone new to the ballgame here. Yes we have all heard it for a year now, me too, but it is a very unique perspective, shall we say "endlessly fascinating" how many hoops we all have had to jump through in this journey with this fledgling digital camera company called Leica. From an outside perspective, I can understand someone doubting my sanity buying this very expensive beta product. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankg Posted October 30, 2007 Share #28 Posted October 30, 2007 Wow a lot of posts of people with M8 problems again lately and many saying they haven't had any problems but the usual 'glitches' ! Some how that doesn't make me any more comfortable. It's making me very nervous because I haven't had any problems, glitches or anything else. The Finder was calibrated dead on out of the box and the camera has performed flawlessly. Am I just incredibly lucky or has any one else had no problems not even 'normal glitches'. I am not counting the IR issue as that is just how the camera operates and you accept it or use something else. Having the previous frame come up when you hit play will happen if the camera is still writing the file (I don't use auto play) and if I'm to quick hitting play when I want to chimp I'll get the previous shot -just press the forward arrow to get to the current shot. But no lock ups, zebra stripes or any other hiccups in 9 months of regular use. I use 4GB Transcend 150x cards and as they have never been a problem won't use anything else. I still haven't updated to the latest firmware -I'm on the previous iteration and since it works fine will wait and see if the next firmware go-round has anything worth upgrading for. I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed. Anyone have months of reliable operation and thousands of frames and suddenly have the camera go bad? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
newyorkone Posted October 30, 2007 Share #29 Posted October 30, 2007 1 post. Go away Canon troll. I had numerous Canon D-SLR's with scratched LCD covers. 6 months and the M8 is fine. Then again, why am I even responding. You don't even have a M8. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrEd Posted October 30, 2007 Share #30 Posted October 30, 2007 Alright Simon, If you don't like your new toy, send it to me........ ... . tummydoc, Now lets see. You walk into the Leica dealer with a fist full of dollars...which bits do they start telling you about. At various stages two Australian dealers told me they were really pissed with this site. I wonder whether they would send people here before making a purchase? People get caught up, or caught out with their expectations. It happens tummy. ...at the same time I don't doubt for a minute there are unscrupulous dealers trying to sell anything for a penny... Just as car dealers selling "Type X Jaguars" to suckers who buy them for the "nice" leather seats, not doing their homework to find out later they bought lemons:D ....suckers ! ha ha ha... . Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grduprey Posted October 30, 2007 Share #31 Posted October 30, 2007 I also am sorry you have had such a bad experience with your new M8. don't be shy about asking for a replacement or gettting help from the dealer or Leica UK. My experience has been just the opposite, not a single problem what so ever since purchasing it in February. I also have the new 28 Elmarit Asph, and love it, no loose elements or anything else. As has been mentioned, there are known problems, and Leica is getting them fixed with firmware updates. Also as mentioned, the RF is a different animal from the SLR, and takes some getting used to, some never do make the conversion. Good luck and I hope you get your problems solved quickly, and are able to get back to making pictures with the M8. Gene Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamie Roberts Posted October 30, 2007 Share #32 Posted October 30, 2007 {snipped}I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed. Anyone have months of reliable operation and thousands of frames and suddenly have the camera go bad? Hank, mine has been great too through many thousands of frames, if not tens of thousands. Yesterday, on a shoot (but not a wedding, thankfully!), the camera locked up for the first time. It was pretty cold out, but not ridiculously so. The meter stayed on but would not work; the shutter wouldn't fire. Pulling the battery rebooted the camera and it was fine again all day. What I suspect happened was the mode wheel got stuck in between continuous and single (or perhaps in between self timer and continuous) and it somehow locked the camera. I haven't been able to reproduce, but that particular switch is easy to mess up, IMO, especially carrying multiple cameras Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hankg Posted October 30, 2007 Share #33 Posted October 30, 2007 Hank, mine has been great too through many thousands of frames, if not tens of thousands. Yesterday, on a shoot (but not a wedding, thankfully!), the camera locked up for the first time. It was pretty cold out, but not ridiculously so. The meter stayed on but would not work; the shutter wouldn't fire. Pulling the battery rebooted the camera and it was fine again all day. What I suspect happened was the mode wheel got stuck in between continuous and single (or perhaps in between self timer and continuous) and it somehow locked the camera. I haven't been able to reproduce, but that particular switch is easy to mess up, IMO, especially carrying multiple cameras I imagine there are things that can be done that would get the camera to lock up just like there are things that could be done sure to lock up your computer. If it was what you suspect that doesn't fall under a freeze caused by some fault in the cameras electronics just something to avoid doing and you won't have a problem. I must say my M8 is more reliable then my PC or Mac as the need to reboot is not that uncommon on my computers but I've never had a freeze/crash on my camera. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bradreiman Posted October 30, 2007 Share #34 Posted October 30, 2007 i love my 2 m8's and don't find them to be rubbish, quite the opposite. as regards the new 28/2.8-i bought one last month and am about to get my 3rd unit as the front element came loose on the first two. this lens is absolutely not rubbish either, its a new design and going through some growing pains. im glad to be a part of it...B Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
marioalessi Posted October 30, 2007 Share #35 Posted October 30, 2007 Comparing a Leica M8 to any other camera except an Epson RD1 or RD1s is skewed. Why? Because those are the only 2 rangefinders that are digital.If he insists on comparing then it seems like directly comparing a Nissan 350Z to a Ferrari 430. One is mass produced through economy of scale. The other a rare, exclusive, hand made temperamental (comparatively) vehicle. It always amazes me that people who complain (before allowing the manufacturer to correct a mistake) usually have done no research whatsoever on what they are buying, other than looking for a FANCY LOGO. These same people generally would also buy a high performance almost race car, and have no training in in driving such type of vehicle, or comprehension of insurance cost, gas cost, cargo capacity, etc..... I bought my M8 the minute i had the money and found one for sale. I saw for 9 months that the camera problems but what brand new product in the history of man kind doesn't?, and my camera is at Leica right now getting worked on. Of course I have plenty of photos for the last 7 months that I wouldn't have had otherwise. Anecdotal evidence: 1988 I buy a brand new Honda Prelude. A new version. With a 12 month 12,000 mile warranty. At 45,000 miles and 2.5 years later, my transmission stops working. I write a letter to Honda expression my disappointment that the car didn't last longer. They gave me a new transmission. I continued to drive honda products for a number of years afterwards, I still highly recommend them, even though now I buy Porsche. If people wear out and have defects, why do people think a man made machine wont? It seems unreasonable. Final thought: We all make mistakes, and all have failures. It how we handle them, thats sets us apart. If Leica didn't make an effort to make things better or more reliable (if technically and financially possible) then I would say complain. As for the filters, I ordered filters ahead of time, paid for them, still haven't even sent off for the free ones. And I actually LIKE the fact that you have to put a infrared filter on it. I LIKE being able to have a camera that is easily used for infrared photos. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibbons Posted October 30, 2007 Share #36 Posted October 30, 2007 I've had two M8s in the last month (long story on the first one), but they both have the latest firmware (1.107) and I have experienced the view image "zebra banding" with both of them. It's almost akin to a scrambled TV picture. I've also had problems with the menu system in general; for instance, when scrolling up/down the menu system will continue to scroll in the last direction continuously until I stop it by moving the scroll wheel around! The IR bleed is definitely more pronounced than I really thought it would be (especially when you don't want it)... in fact, most of my pictures suffer from it. However, I knew about that "problem" before hand and it was actually a selling point for me. After all it's easier to slap a uv/ir filter over the lens then remove the filter from a CCD cover when one wants IR sensitivity (See Rainer Bültert's, A Different Side to Andalusia). For the record, I don't blame Leica for the SW problems per se because they're not a digital house (let me clarify, a digital sw house) like other companies. Well, that's my 2 cents vr, jg Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
carstenw Posted October 30, 2007 Share #37 Posted October 30, 2007 I had a 5D which shipped with a scratch on the sensor, and ended up having to pay for it myself. Anyone who bought the 1D3 for its intended function is likely also not happy, as it can't focus on fast-moving subjects in daylight and warm temperatures, and Canon doesn't even apologise. Leica at least admitted the problem and have done what they can, and they offered me to take it back. I have had my Leica M8 for a year now, with not a scratch on the screen, not even a light one. My 5D had scratches almost instantly, and I always carried it in a proper camera bag, just like I do with the M8. You should try doing to the Fuji and the Canon whatever you did to the M8's screen. Did you shell out $5000 on a camera you didn't research properly? Did you know of the problems, but think that it wouldn't hit you? I don't know what the real problem is here, but it is between your ears. You have made exactly one post here after being a member for 20 days, and have left an impression of a complainer who should have known better. This forum is full of people who know these problems, but have accepted the state of affairs and are making great photos. This forum is not your mother. Go home, sit down, and write a proper letter to Leica. Unlike most other forums, the one on this site works exceedingly well. Add your complaining posts to one of the existing threads rather than throwing a hissy fit. A final tip for you: return both the Leica M8 and the Canon 1D3. They clearly are not good enough for your discerning tastes. Stick to the Fuji, fine little trooper that it is. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stunsworth Posted October 30, 2007 Share #38 Posted October 30, 2007 I think given the experience that Simon's had he's entitled to let off some steam. £5000 is a lot of money to spend and not be happy with the purchase. Whether he was or wasn't aware of the problems is for him to say. If he wasn't then they would have come as a shock. And yes, spending so much money he should have done some research, but people don't always do what they ought to. The only point I'd take issue with is the scratched screen. I've owned digital cameras for around 8 years and in all that time I've never scratched the screen on any of them. It's user error. The screen on the M8 doesn't seem any more liable to scratches than any of the others - which have included Kodak and Canon models. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delander † Posted October 30, 2007 Share #39 Posted October 30, 2007 I think Simon is perfectly entitled to post his experience as a new user here. After all all those who bought their M8s 3-6-9 months ago enjoyed that privilege. In fact it is very important that new users continue to post, negative as well as positive comments, otherwise we will all assume, wrongly, that Leica have solved these problems. This public forum is great feedback for Leica. If there are still problems with new M8s then it is no use glossing over them or sticking your heads in the sand. Leaving all else aside, the M8 is an expensive camera and simply should not go wrong as often as it appears to do. Jeff Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
larry Posted October 30, 2007 Share #40 Posted October 30, 2007 Reading this thread is somewhat like driving past a cemetery and worrying if your number is up next. It should be no surprise that everyone and everything eventually dies. But if death becomes the focus of your life, it's not going to be particularly rewarding. This is all old news and my M8 keeps chugging along and I haven't grown tired of it. Ken Tanaka's post said it best. Larry Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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