Konica Hexanon 60mm

[Kiwimac]

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I saw one of these for sale recently. Is it worth buying?

[Ecar]

It depends.

[Kiwimac]

On?

[Ecar]

Version, condition, price, acceptance of "odd focal length", your own requirements, etc.

[Kiwimac]

It is from the 800 lens limited reissue. Grade is Mint minus, complete with box and case etc.

[fil-m]

It is a collector lens, quite interesting rendering, relatively compact, well made.

https://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2013/01/07/clash-of-the-titans-the-ultimate-leica-m-super-fast-5060-lens-battle-by-kristian-dowling/

Though no longer supported by the manufacturer since they exited the business. So for repairs and cleaning, you must rely on third parties with the risks and limitations that come with that.

IMHO I'd go for a Leica at that price, unless you're attracted to the "collector" aspect and the rarity/uniqueness of this object.  

[Ecar]

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https://yanidel.net/gear/60mm-hexanon-review/

[Kiwimac]

It’s about US $6000. To be honest I was quite surprised to see it. 
 

For that money I’d probably buy a 75 Apo. Or 2/3rds of a 28 Summilux. 

[Ecar]

The price of rarity... Although it's a pretty good price these days if it is indeed near-mint and boxed.

[01af]

The Hexanon 60 mm 1:1.2 is a good lens but not extraordinary. From a user's perspective it's comparable to many other 50 mm, 55 mm, and 58 mm 1:1.2 lenses; the value is maybe $500. The rarity adds a couple of hundred bucks, so let's say, $800. That's what this lens was traded for ... until Yanidel's review came out. Over night, the price jumped to $2,000, then gradually increased from there.

It's just an Internet hype. This lens worth several grands just as long as someone is willing to pay several grands. For practical use on an M camera, it's an inconvenient focal length because there's no framelines for 60 mm; the field-of-view is pretty much exactly in the middle between 50 mm and 75 mm.

[insideline]

I have owned and used one of these Konica 60 1.2 lenses and compared to directly to my original 1975 E58 F1 Noctilux and V2 E60 Noctilux. The lens itself is incredibly well made and the size is actually nicer in use than my smaller E58 F1. If the kit comes complete then it will have the unique 60mm separate viewfinder to attach but I rarely bothered with it. The rendering on center is sharper than the V1 F1 Noctilux yet it's out of focus rendering is yet again different, not quite as much aberrations as my original '75 E58 F1 yet quite artistic and fun. The only single issue I had is my copy had to be adjusted to focus correctly as it back focussed on my then M9M and I have heard this is not uncommon issue. Original complete in box Leica E58 F1 Noctilux's are selling in the $7500-$12,000 range so is $6,000 that far out of line, I personally would buy it, enjoy and in a year or so decide to keep it or sell it on for a similar price. Just as the limited edition 35mm F2 UC Hexanon is a very strong competitor to the Leica V4 35mm F2 Summicron yet even nicer made and just beautiful in hand, this 60 1.2 is not an overhyped lens but it also is not totally mainstream although Ione could use it as an everyday lens and be totally happy with the unique character of the output and very very high quality of construction. 

Many many lenses that just years ago were $100's or $1,000's of dollars to buy are now trading at ten times those prices as the market for Leica M rangefinder glass which render in unique and artist manner have become very desirable. Most have never tried a P. Angeneuix S21 50mm 1.5 lens on an M mount or SL mount yet to me this cine lens is one of the most magical lenses I have ever shot with and these sell for between $10,000-$15,000 and yes to me worth every penny for the look and color it can provide as its up to the buyer what they are looking for in photography and what is that cost they are willing to pay for that look. 

[skueh]

I am currently using one in place of the Leica Noctilux E58 F1 and the E60 F0.9, mainly on weight consideration. The Leica Noctilux, with the exception of the re-issued E49 F1.2, is just too heavy for me to carry around.

As you may know, the Konica 60 1.2 cannot focus down to 0.8 meter of its MFD on Leica M cameras without modification. I have mine modified by DAG and it works perfectly as designed.

[JMF]

18 minutes ago, skueh said:

I am currently using one in place of the Leica Noctilux E58 F1 and the E60 F0.9, mainly on weight consideration. The Leica Noctilux, with the exception of the re-issued E49 F1.2, is just too heavy for me to carry around.

As you may know, the Konica 60 1.2 cannot focus down to 0.8 meter of its MFD on Leica M cameras without modification. I have mine modified by DAG and it works perfectly as designed.

Hello !

How close did Don manage to modify the   RF coupling ?

Could you show us a side photo of the lens barrel at minimum distance ?

Does the mod leave a gap next to the lens mount?!

Thank you 

best

JM 

Edited February 12, 2023 by JMF

[skueh]

4 hours ago, JMF said:

Hello !

How close did Don manage to modify the   RF coupling ?

Could you show us a side photo of the lens barrel at minimum distance ?

Does the mod leave a gap next to the lens mount?!

Thank you 

best

JM 

It can go down to 0.8 where the focus ring stops as shown on pic 1. Pic 2 shows the trimmed flange in front of the focusing tab (shown in MFD position). Before the mod, the untrimmed flange is higher than the focusing tab, thus prevents the focusing roller to follow the focusing tab going further down. It is a very simple modification. If you are brave enough, you do it yourself. I am just too chicken to mass with my 6k lens.

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[shirubadanieru]

1 hour ago, Al Brown said:

Every Konica Hexanon-M lens is worth buying.
The 60/1.2 has a super ugly bokeh though, the nervous type. Wide open it is an average-to-ok performer. IMHO this lens should be worth max. 2000 euros, not a cent more.

Same can be said for all vintage leica lenses no? If not for collector prices, that’s how much they’d be worth…:p 

[JMF]

2 hours ago, Al Brown said:

Every Konica Hexanon-M lens is worth buying.
The 60/1.2 has a super ugly bokeh though, the nervous type. Wide open it is an average-to-ok performer. IMHO this lens should be worth max. 2000 euros, not a cent more.

I like Hexanon lenses and differ with the above comment regarding the bokeh , which is a subjective matter anyway .

Concerning the wide open comment above, my sample of the 60 1.2  is so sharp even wide open that I keep a 1/8 black promist on it at all times .  I guess it comes down to a well collimated lens matching a well calibrated body .

Let's remember we're discussing the v2 reissue of the 60 1.2 Hexanon LTM v1 .

My two cents

JM

Edited February 13, 2023 by JMF

[skueh]

My copy is also very sharp wide open.

As far as bokeh, it is very subjective. I try to work my lens to please me. LOL!

Edited February 13, 2023 by skueh
Typo

[Ecar]

Here we go again on "overpriced" lenses...
"Worth" is subjective. Realised price (at a given point in time) is a measure that usually reflects what an item is worth to a sufficient number of people, whatever the reason. In this case, the reason may be rarity / collectability, appreciation of its imaging characteristics, curiosity, bragging rights, temporary hype, etc. - or a combination thereof.
The price of this particular lens has been hovering around 7k USD for a few years now, with transactions being made at such prices. It is therefore fair to say that this is what it's worth to a number of people, however limited.
Clearly, these do not include the OP, 01af or Al (and the vast majority of Leica users, I suspect), which is perfectly understandable.
FWIW (pun intended), the Summilux 35/1.4 AA is not worth its current price to me (and wasn't even when it was cheaper). But I understand why others are prepared to pay it.
Similarly, the Hexanon 60/1.2 v2 is worth more to me than an APO 75/2 or "two-thirds of a Summilux 28/1.4" - or a Noctilux 50/1.2 re-issue for that matter (remember how many - including myself - thought its price was "reasonable" when it was released?). AFAIC, I don't find its bokeh objectionable at all. My only gripe with this lens is its focal length. On the other hand, with the exception of this 60/1.2 and the UC 35/2, I have always found the rendering of the modern Hexanons to be rather bland. Indeed, YMMV.
 

Edited February 13, 2023 by Ecar

[Ecar]

9 hours ago, JMF said:

my sample of the 60 1.2  is so sharp even wide open that I keep a 1/8 black promist on it at all times

Mmm, I think you "need" the original v1 LTM version...😉 

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[yanidel]

On 2/10/2023 at 7:47 AM, 01af said:

The Hexanon 60 mm 1:1.2 is a good lens but not extraordinary. From a user's perspective it's comparable to many other 50 mm, 55 mm, and 58 mm 1:1.2 lenses; the value is maybe $500. The rarity adds a couple of hundred bucks, so let's say, $800. That's what this lens was traded for ... until Yanidel's review came out. Over night, the price jumped to $2,000, then gradually increased from there.

It's just an Internet hype. This lens worth several grands just as long as someone is willing to pay several grands. For practical use on an M camera, it's an inconvenient focal length because there's no framelines for 60 mm; the field-of-view is pretty much exactly in the middle between 50 mm and 75 mm.

More than 10 years after I wrote the review, looks like I am still the guilty one for having its value skyrocket  But you are right, I paid about 1600 euros at the time and it surpassed the 10'000 euros at some point before settling around the current 6'000-8'000 euros range. I never cashed out on it though and still own and use it. And I still do think it is extraordinary, at least for my use.

You get a Noctilux equivalent yet much smaller, lighter and easier to focus. Which are all very important characteristics when you shoot street photography like I do. There aren't that many lenses in the 50-75mm range that are easy to focus quickly to get the shot, the Hexanon is one of them. Build quality is on par with Leica, mine is still in an excellent condition despite many years of use. I'll let the point go to the Noctilux for bokeh. And yes, the framelines are a bit of bother on the M10 (though they almost perfectly matched in the M9),  I had to learn to guesstimate.

Is it worth buying it? Like mentioned above there are only 800 of them, so as time passes, it will only get more scarse, and value will probably hold or even rise. Also, it is a Noctilux equivalent in terms of depth of field and general characteristics in a much smaller package. Now can you take excellent pictures with a similar feel with much cheaper lenses? Yes of course. I can take similar pictures with my 1000 euros 50mm Summicron IV in 90% of cases. Yet, if I want to throw the background out of focus when my subject is in the 5 to 10 meters range, there only the Hexanon can achieve it with significant effect. This is due to its outstanding center sharpness wide open and extra thin depth of field. 

So to conclude, if cash is not an issue and want to please yourself with a great lens, get it, you'll get the value. Otherwise you'll be perfectly fine with any fast 50mm lens. 

 

Edited April 24, 2023 by yanidel