Leica M4 frame lines issue (masking issue?)

[Datachrome]

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Hi everyone

Got that M4 back from service and have an issue with the masking of the frame lines it seems. There is an extra thin line appearing on the side of the 35mm right frame line. Anybody had this happen before? Is it fixable? Any idea where this could come from? I'll attach a picture to show the issue. Thanks for your help!

 

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[Mute-on]

If your service technician can create the problem, they ought to be able to fix the problem. Send it back immediately to be rectified. 

[Datachrome]

It existed before the service, but was still there when I got it back. The issue was not created by the tech, just overlooked or not addressed. Can you confirm this is not a normal behavior on this camera? None of my Ms ever done this before.

[Mute-on]

Definitely not normal. Sometimes the frameline selector mechanism gets stuck, which can cause partially visible framelines and other odd phenomena. It can help to exercise the frameline selectors lever back and forth (gently) for a few minutes without a lens to free up the mechanism. However if this doesn’t work, it may require the attention of a (possibly different) technician. 
 

Good luck!

[Mute-on]

Other experiences here … 

 

 

[Datachrome]

This was sent twice to DAG, first time it was overlooked and the rangefinder focussing system was sticky too when I got it back. Sent it again to have this frame line issue rectified and the sticky rangefinder arm. Got it back today and it focus correctly. The weird frame line is not fixed tho. 💩

[Datachrome]

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thanks, yes I have seen this post too before posting!

[Mute-on]

3 minutes ago, Datachrome said:

This was sent twice to DAG, first time it was overlooked and the rangefinder focussing system was sticky too when I got it back. Sent it again to have this frame line issue rectified and the sticky rangefinder arm. Got it back today and it focus correctly. The weird frame line is not fixed tho. 💩

That’s very disappointing, and obviously frustrating. I’ve not used DAG. Perhaps a call to discuss options is in order?

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Datachrome]

Unfortunately I can't call him, I am located in Japan and can't phone internationally with the mobile plan I have right now. This is only half of the train wreck I went thru with this camera repair from DAG. This is actually going on since one year and an half now, and still not done with it seems.

Edited January 12 by Datachrome

[plaidshirts]

6 hours ago, Mute-on said:

Other experiences here … 

 

 

That was me. I sent it to YYE for a CLA but it couldn't be fully corrected.

[Huss]

If the rest of the camera works perfectly, I would just ignore it and use the camera.  Frustrating I know, but at this point the endless shipping and wait times is just not worth it.

My M3 works perfectly but the frame lines in a couple of places have 'defects' - from age I am sure.  But as it works perfectly I chalk this down to age - and your M4 is old too - and get on with it.

It just seems at this point you are banging your head on a wall and you have done what you can.

[Mute-on]

11 hours ago, Datachrome said:

Unfortunately I can't call him, I am located in Japan and can't phone internationally with the mobile plan I have right now. This is only half of the train wreck I went thru with this camera repair from DAG. This is actually going on since one year and an half now, and still not done with it seems.

Oh, well since you are in Japan, I’ve used Kanto Camera to fully overhaul a BP M4 that had frameline mask issues (different problem from yours), and two 35/2.8 Summarons.  In your position, if you would like to pursue a resolution, I would go straight to Kanto. They are very thorough, and in my experience their work is immaculate. 

[George Collier]

You also have a small "second" line at the right end of the top edge, as if there is a misaligned reflection or something going on both.

[Datachrome]

Got an answer from DAG, this is not fixable apparently. You gotta change the part and it's not available anymore...

[williamj]

2 hours ago, Datachrome said:

Got an answer from DAG, this is not fixable apparently. You gotta change the part and it's not available anymore...

I understand that you are in Japan and that this is a long drawn out saga and you might want to take some of the advice above and move on.

However, the defect might be too annoying. DAG says the part does not exist anymore and that is probably true, I don't know. But there are other options. When the M3 viewfinder claps out, usually due to Canada Balsam deterioration and crystallisation, there's no part to replace it but what Leica have done is to replace it with the M6J viewfinder. Furthermore, Camera Repairs & Restoration, Luton, Bedfordshire, England offer a service to rebuild your viewfinder https://www.angelfire.com/biz/Leica/page10.html. However, this is difficult because of the custom and import changes of the UK Government and CRR don't take jobs from outside the UK anymore. If anyone knows more they should add or correct what I've said. Maybe if you're in the UK you could drop it off, or if you've got a friend, etc.

I don't think any of this will be cheap, but maybe a company in Japan can do the same work, I'd be surprised if they could not.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[LocalHero1953]

10 minutes ago, williamj said:

I understand that you are in Japan and that this is a long drawn out saga and you might want to take some of the advice above and move on.

However, the defect might be too annoying. DAG says the part does not exist anymore and that is probably true, I don't know. But there are other options. When the M3 viewfinder claps out, usually due to Canada Balsam deterioration and crystallisation, there's no part to replace it but what Leica have done is to replace it with the M6J viewfinder. Furthermore, Camera Repairs & Restoration, Luton, Bedfordshire, England offer a service to rebuild your viewfinder https://www.angelfire.com/biz/Leica/page10.html. However, this is difficult because of the custom and import changes of the UK Government and CRR don't take jobs from outside the UK anymore. If anyone knows more they should add or correct what I've said. Maybe if you're in the UK you could drop it off, or if you've got a friend, etc.

I don't think any of this will be cheap, but maybe a company in Japan can do the same work, I'd be surprised if they could not.

It's worth checking that Camera Repairs in Luton still exist, or at least still work on Leicas. That looks like an orphan website. What looks like a current one (http://www.lutoncameras.co.uk/) does not list Leica among its repair options.

Malcolm Taylor (no website, but https://www.yell.com/biz/malcolm-taylor-leominster-3607553/) will repair rangefinders.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[williamj]

1 hour ago, LocalHero1953 said:

It's worth checking that Camera Repairs in Luton still exist, or at least still work on Leicas. That looks like an orphan website. What looks like a current one (http://www.lutoncameras.co.uk/) does not list Leica among its repair options.

Malcolm Taylor (no website, but https://www.yell.com/biz/malcolm-taylor-leominster-3607553/) will repair rangefinders.

Thanks, that is definitely my mistake, I was thinking of Cameraworks-UK https://www.cameraworks-uk.com/. They fix a lot of things, I believe that they are still an ongoing concern, and they will fix viewfinders as well. In fact they re-engineer brightline masks that have not been available since the 1990s. I am not sure how I conflated them but the links are close together in my bookmarks. Thanks for checking that Camera Repairs in Luton is no more.

Edited January 17 by williamj
UK

[jakontil]

On 1/17/2023 at 2:11 PM, Datachrome said:

Got an answer from DAG, this is not fixable apparently. You gotta change the part and it's not available anymore...

 My m2-r exhibits the same frame line issues, i guess i just have to live with it, just CLa’ed

Edited January 19 by jakontil