Stevejack Posted November 16, 2022 Share #21 Posted November 16, 2022 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) On closer inspection it seems like this is how it’s meant to operate, it sits on a little leaf spring and applies pressure to the film, but the wiggle/play where it can slide up towards the top of the plate and back down again when there is no pressure on it actually looks like it’s by design. Can anyone else with an MP confirm? IMG_0427.MOV Edited November 16, 2022 by Stevejack Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 16, 2022 Posted November 16, 2022 Hi Stevejack, Take a look here Brand new MP/M-A/M6 film scratches [Merged]. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
logan2z Posted November 16, 2022 Share #22 Posted November 16, 2022 5 hours ago, 250swb said: My BS meter is off the scale with this thread. Maybe it needs a CLA. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huss Posted November 16, 2022 Share #23 Posted November 16, 2022 3 hours ago, Stevejack said: On closer inspection it seems like this is how it’s meant to operate, it sits on a little leaf spring and applies pressure to the film, but the wiggle/play where it can slide up towards the top of the plate and back down again when there is no pressure on it actually looks like it’s by design. Can anyone else with an MP confirm? IMG_0427.MOV 13.1 MB · 0 downloads 1. You should never touch the surface of the pressure plate. 2. There seems to be an awful lot of dust in your camera. Depending on the dust, it can scratch your film. 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevejack Posted November 16, 2022 Share #24 Posted November 16, 2022 (edited) 38 minutes ago, Huss said: 1. You should never touch the surface of the pressure plate. 2. There seems to be an awful lot of dust in your camera. Depending on the dust, it can scratch your film. Yep saw the dust in the video and cleaned it (wasn't really visible in person), also wiped off the plate properly after I made the vid. You could be right about the dust being the culprit of the scratching. The camera is a 2022 build but I'm not the first owner - do you have any information regarding the sliding up/down of the pressure plate? Is this normal on the MP? Edited November 16, 2022 by Stevejack Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
labyrinth Posted November 16, 2022 Share #25 Posted November 16, 2022 5 hours ago, Stevejack said: On closer inspection it seems like this is how it’s meant to operate, it sits on a little leaf spring and applies pressure to the film, but the wiggle/play where it can slide up towards the top of the plate and back down again when there is no pressure on it actually looks like it’s by design. Can anyone else with an MP confirm? IMG_0427.MOV 13.1 MB · 0 downloads mine 2003 MP behaves the same 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevejack Posted November 16, 2022 Share #26 Posted November 16, 2022 Just now, labyrinth said: mine 2003 MP behaves the same That's great thank you, good to know it's not a one-off issue. I started looking because I notice scratches on my negative (which I assumed were from my scanner, but this thread made me wonder!). I also find the MP very noisy and 'crunchy' when rewinding. It also has an audible and tactile "clunk" about once every rotation which is very different to both M3 cameras I've owned which are smooth as butter during the film rewinding. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
labyrinth Posted November 16, 2022 Share #27 Posted November 16, 2022 Advertisement (gone after registration) 14 minutes ago, Stevejack said: That's great thank you, good to know it's not a one-off issue. I started looking because I notice scratches on my negative (which I assumed were from my scanner, but this thread made me wonder!). I also find the MP very noisy and 'crunchy' when rewinding. It also has an audible and tactile "clunk" about once every rotation which is very different to both M3 cameras I've owned which are smooth as butter during the film rewinding. My M6 is smoother and quieter in operation than my MP 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topsy Posted November 16, 2022 Share #28 Posted November 16, 2022 Just checked my 2003 MP and it is the same as yours however my M2 amd M4-P are solid, no movement at all. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevejack Posted November 16, 2022 Share #29 Posted November 16, 2022 1 hour ago, Topsy said: Just checked my 2003 MP and it is the same as yours however my M2 amd M4-P are solid, no movement at all. Thanks Topsy, good to know. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted November 16, 2022 Share #30 Posted November 16, 2022 The pressure plate is wide enough so that it rests on the outer two frame rails, which are slightly higher than the center two, so it doesn't really "press" on the film, but creates a channel for the film to pass through and keeps it flat. It may touch the film as the film tries to bow, so keeps it flat. That "touch" can be enough to scratch film if there is dust or a burr on the plate, especially if the film has taken a "curl" from being wound tightly. Back in the '60s I have had new cameras that scratched the back of film, and cured it by polishing the plate with a very fine "Arkansas stone" to remove small burrs. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Brown Posted November 17, 2022 Share #31 Posted November 17, 2022 (edited) The problem is real. As is the new Summilux 35mm CF diaphragm collapsing and new M-A Titanium paint chipping. It. Just. Should. Not. Be. Like. This. Edited November 17, 2022 by Al Brown Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Brown Posted November 17, 2022 Share #32 Posted November 17, 2022 On 11/16/2022 at 3:10 PM, TomB_tx said: That "touch" can be enough to scratch film if there is dust or a burr on the plate, especially if the film has taken a "curl" from being wound tightly. There are several other points where film could have been scratched, not just the pressure plate. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
archive_all Posted November 17, 2022 Share #33 Posted November 17, 2022 Was it mentioned which side of the film was scratched? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted November 17, 2022 Share #34 Posted November 17, 2022 1 hour ago, Al Brown said: There are several other points where film could have been scratched, not just the pressure plate. And many of them nowadays are in film manufacturing. Without the big plants running 24/7 switching them off and then on again is introducing random faults in the film. Where faults were once spotted very quickly the feedback to the manufacturer is now much slower and the manufacturer is dealing with smaller volumes to be representative in quality control. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hdmesa Posted November 18, 2022 Share #35 Posted November 18, 2022 (edited) This happened to me with a new M-A but also a Leica M4-P with a Leica CLA. The problem was caused by not fully engaging the rewind lever, causing too much pressure to be applied to the film as it was rewound. It was noticeably easier to rewind the film after figuring this out. The scratches I was getting were random and never in the same place. They didn't show up on color film scans, only on b&w with lab scans. Once I made sure the rewind lever was fully engaged – pushing it HARD, not just casually flipping it – no scratches from either camera. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited November 18, 2022 by hdmesa 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/355800-brand-new-mpm-am6-film-scratches-merged/?do=findComment&comment=4568380'>More sharing options...
lmans Posted November 18, 2022 Share #36 Posted November 18, 2022 2 hours ago, hdmesa said: This happened to me with a new M-A but also a Leica M4-P with a Leica CLA. The problem was caused by not fully engaging the rewind lever, causing too much pressure to be applied to the film as it was rewound. It was noticeably easier to rewind the film after figuring this out. The scratches I was getting were random and never in the same place. They didn't show up on color film scans, only on b&w with lab scans. Once I made sure the rewind lever was fully engaged – pushing it HARD, not just casually flipping it – no scratches from either camera. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Can u explain the issue more… sorry I am it following… as you describe rewind process Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
delta100 Posted November 18, 2022 Share #37 Posted November 18, 2022 (edited) It may be when you have rewound the film back into the cassette. I know on mine it winds in very tight and when I unload the cassette it unwinds very fast in the cassette. It could well be some kind of internal film cassette tension. Is the scratching on the cell or the emulsion side? Edited November 18, 2022 by delta100 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacobjuul Posted November 18, 2022 Share #38 Posted November 18, 2022 On 11/16/2022 at 6:37 AM, labyrinth said: My M6 is smoother and quieter in operation than my MP Mine too Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmans Posted November 18, 2022 Share #39 Posted November 18, 2022 (edited) Three things to be mindful of..... might make a difference or not. 24 exp to 36 exp rolls. The tightness in rewinding the last 10 exposures in a 36 count canister might add to the scratch level if your pressure plate has any dust on it. Not sure if this was mentioned prior but if so, shouldn't be an all inclusive Leica problem. When rewinding all the way into the canister, it might scratch even though there is some sort of felt lining. Again, not all-inclusive to just Leica. Type of film....some cheaper films scratch easier....Again, not all-inclusive to just Leica. jim Edited November 18, 2022 by lmans Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hdmesa Posted November 19, 2022 Share #40 Posted November 19, 2022 23 hours ago, lmans said: Can u explain the issue more… sorry I am it following… as you describe rewind process To rewind the film, you must flip the release lever on the front of the camera. This releases the film spool and allows you to use the rewind knob or crank to rewind the film. If the release lever is not flipped all the way over with a good amount of pressure, the film spool will release but still be under too much tension. This means the film is being held too tightly against the pressure plate as it’s rewound, resulting in scratches simply from the friction involved. Also when it’s under this tension, it will be dragged back into the film canister with too much tension, and the opening of the film canister may scratch the film. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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