Rotating shutter release button? Soft shutter release button does not tighten anymore.

[Salqass]

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Hello!

I have been using an M11 for some time now, and I have always preferred using a soft shutter release button. From time to time, I try to make sure that my soft shutter release button is on and didn’t fall out, I usually do not tighten it hardly, I just make sure it’s rotated all the way.

Yesterday however, as I attempted to rotate my soft shutter release button onto my M11 to make sure it doesn’t fall off, it would just keep rotating and does not feel like it’s tightened.

The soft shutter button seems to rotate all the way in and doesn’t fall off, but the actual button on the Leica M11 keeps on rotating. I can remove the button if I pull up and rotate the other way and I can rotate it back on. But now, even though the button is screwed on, it just keeps rotating on and on, it doesn’t behave the way it used to where I can feel that soft shutter tightened all the way.

The camera behaves normally — the half click and the shutter goes off the way it normally does thankfully, but I am not sure what happened with the shutter release, can anyone help? 

I believe the mechanism is exactly the same on the M10s as well, but never had this issue before on the M10 variants when using a soft shutter release button. 

Thank you!

[RMF]

I use the Komaru”s soft releases and they come with a small rubber gasket (to use on the thread) which allows you to screw them down firmly but not really over tighten; the rubber gasket when installed also seems to put enough pressure on the threads to stop the release from coming unscrewed. 
 

Edited December 9, 2022 by RMF

[MyLeicaWorld]

I’ve been using leica ones with gasket for many years .. never unscrewed or lost ..

[Salqass]

I wanted to clarify that it’s not the soft shutter release button that gets loose. It’s the actual shutter trigger on the camera that is loose — it is in place, but it rotates endlessly. Therefore I can’t actually tighten a soft shutter release button anymore because there’s no end to the rotation. It just happened overnight, and it could be because I might have tightened the button on too hard or played with it.
 

I tried putting the same button on my Leica M10 and I was able to screw it on and rotate it until it stopped rotating. I hope this clarifies the problem.

Thank you!

[Photoworks]

just get it looked at, it is probably the ring on top that needs to be screwed back tight.

some cameras with the chrome switch had this issue.

[MikeMyers]

I bought two of these "soft releases", thinking they would be useful. In some instructions I read, I was told to never use those buttons.  The finger that presses on the shutter should be flat, resting in two places on the ring that surrounds the shutter release.  Then smoothly apply pressure in the middle, to capture an image.  I tried it both ways, and the camera was much more likely to stay steady when I did it properly, without the soft release button.  

I now have two soft releases sitting in my drawer, which I'll never use again.

[jakontil]

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4 hours ago, MikeMyers said:

I bought two of these "soft releases", thinking they would be useful. In some instructions I read, I was told to never use those buttons.  The finger that presses on the shutter should be flat, resting in two places on the ring that surrounds the shutter release.  Then smoothly apply pressure in the middle, to capture an image.  I tried it both ways, and the camera was much more likely to stay steady when I did it properly, without the soft release button.  

I now have two soft releases sitting in my drawer, which I'll never use again.

which instructions are you referring to if you dont mind me asking

[John Ricard]

Despite what those “instructions” said, everyone just takes the top of their index finger and they use it push the shutter button. And it seems to be working just fine. If someone prefers to use an alternate method of activating the shutter, that is fine if it works for them. But those instructions should not imply that everyone who doesn’t use that method is doing something wrong.

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[MikeMyers]

9 hours ago, jakontil said:

which instructions are you referring to if you dont mind me asking

This was about a year ago.  I will try to find them again, and post one of the inks.  It may have been in the instruction manual, or one of my Leica Books, but chances are it was something I read online.

Before I made any changes, I did some testing.  By using the tip of my finger and pushing down, I was unable to do this without the camera body wanting to move downwards.  By gripping tightly and preventing that movement, I thought that cured this potential problem.

 

Then I tried it with my finger flat across the shutter release area, with the "ball" on the bottom of my finger right over the shutter release, smoothly applying pressure.  As  pressure built up, the camera fired, but the camera didn't move downwards from my finger pressure. 

The top of the shutter release is at the same height as the "cylinder" surrounding the shutter release.  

 

I removed my soft releases, and have shot this new way for a long time now.  Probably someone here can explain this better than I just did, but it's very easy for anyone to try on their own.  

[Jeff S]

Jaap described his shutter release method in the FAQ.  I would guess that Gunther Osterloh covered this in his manual back in the 50’s.  

No additional button required; never found the need.
 

Jeff

Edited December 11, 2022 by Jeff S

[MikeMyers]

2 hours ago, Jeff S said:

Jaap described his shutter release method in the FAQ.  I would guess that Gunther Osterloh covered this in his manual back in the 50’s.  

Ouch!!  My memory is going who knows where.....    Jeff, THAT is where I read it, and it left no doubt in my mind - but I had to try it myself anyway.  In less than a minute I removed my soft buttons.  Now I remember what he wrote, and the two photos, and realize since the 1950's I had been doing it incorrectly.  

I never heard of Gunther Osterloh or his manual.  I do have two copies of "Leica Manual, the complete book of 35mm photography, by Douglas Morgan, David Vestal, and William Broecker, one of them dated 1961 and the other (larger and thicker and with color images), the 16th edition.

 

It's not really a "choice".  I'm surprised it isn't in the  M10 User Manual (or maybe I missed it).

To me, @jaapvis the Leica bible.

Edited December 11, 2022 by MikeMyers
typo

[jaapv]

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[MikeMyers]

I found the book, one for a bit over $100 and the other for a bit over $200, but dating back to 2011, while I'm sure it will help me with my M3, it's not going to have much on digital.

https://www.amazon.com/Leica-Advanced-Photo-School-Photography/dp/1454700696

They do have the book that I bought many years ago about the M10 though. 

 

Hopefully I'll never have the problem this thread was originally about, a rotating shutter button.

[jaapv]

It is not about films or sensors, but about the M cameras and system, not much new there.

[Jeff S]

Exactly.

Jeff

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[MikeMyers]

On 12/11/2022 at 1:23 AM, John Ricard said:

Despite what those “instructions” said, everyone just takes the top of their index finger and they use it push the shutter button. And it seems to be working just fine. If someone prefers to use an alternate method of activating the shutter, that is fine if it works for them. But those instructions should not imply that everyone who doesn’t use that method is doing something wrong.

I'm not going to ask you why you think "everyone" uses the tip of their finger, but I'm guessing you do.  I also used to do it that way.  I used to make a point of reading anything and everything @jaapvposted here, and I changed my way of doing things to what he described, once I understood what he meant - and why.  Done the wrong way, the camera body moves.  Done the proper way, the camera body is much more stable, and I can't detect movement.  

This was quick and easy to understand.  Jaapv wrote an explanation of 'ETTR' which also made no sense to me, but eventually something "clicked" and I got it.  I started to read through that whole section of this forum, but I still have more left to read.  There are others who contributed a lot of explanations, and things that are well worth knowing.  The links posted up above lead to a lot of them, especially the ones by Andy Barton.

Edited December 13, 2022 by MikeMyers

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[DenverSteve]

Leica certainly sells very expensive "Leica soft release buttons" for M cameras.  I don't know of any other current Leica bodies with shutter-release cable threads but the M. While I have no use for them, I doubt Leica would make and sell such an accessory and then advise not to use it.  If it makes some people want to use one, and they like them, who is to say they're wrong?  I would like to see an energetic engineer do some press-tests to see if there is any actual benefit to them. I doubt it.  But hey, if you can get $75 for an accessory, that probably costs under 5 cents to manufacture, good on you. 

Edited December 17, 2022 by DenverSteve

[Al Brown]

Those b*stards at Leica, selling the soft release buttons even though Gunther and everybody said not to use them. What rudeness towards their clients.

Edited December 17, 2022 by Al Brown

[MikeMyers]

Maybe they make them for people shooting on a tripod, and who don't want to use a cable release?

(I didn't throw mine out, they're in a small plastic envelope.  But when my camera is on a tripod, I usually figure a cable release or a self timer is good.  I've taken sky photos, at night, and using my finger flat across the shutter release was rather inconvenient.....  If I remember correctly, I ended up using my thumb, because of the orientation of the camera.  Next time, I used the cable release.)

[lincoln_m]

I'm convinced that my soft release buttons were the cause of my M7 shutter release failure. Leica said it was bent when they fixed it, I'm sure ~ 5 years ago. Since then I've not used them, I have red, silver, green, and a Leica black and white one I found in the dirt some 10 years ago. I don't use them on MP or M2 even though then don't have the shutter release blocking mechanism of the M7 power switch/release. For the same reason I wouldn't risk using them on M10 either. Early on, when they seemed a good idea to allow less movement when using slow shutter speeds 1/30th and slower, a soft release did seem to work by allowing the two shutter points to be felt with a straight finger but as other's have said above a relaxed technique also works.

Soft Releases, like other accessories, seem to be unnecessary when actually using the camera system but are tempting additions to your kit when you wish you were out using your camera instead of looking at pictures of Leica cameras and accessories on cold dark winter days, like today. I'm guilty of that too.

Cases: Why spend £200 on a case to add weight and cover a £2000-£7000 camera body? Taking the camera in and out of the case just rubs the body! Feeling the camera body the controls and covering are what drew me to the Leica Ms in the first place. I haven't used the Every Ready leather case for 15 years now.

Rewind crank: Particularly for MP, M2, M3. I've heard that users often scuff the M body when using these extras, an expensive mistake? The pull out rewind knurled nut although slow compared to M4, M6, M7 angled crank, doesn't jump from your hand and spin when winding the film back in. The appeal of the crank added to the knurled nut is that you can rewind more quickly. But for me, a non-professional user, time spent rewinding the film is time connected to the Leica M body and you can feel when the film becomes free of the take-up spool, all part of the pleasure of M cameras.

Lens Filters: UV, Warm up, Yellow, Polarisers, just seem to be a good way to enhance the chances of glare with a flat surface in front of the quality Leica lens. Why add a £30 piece of glass in front of your £2000-£7000 Leica lens? A protective lens cap and padded camera bag when not using the camera yes, but I've given up with filters now especially with Leica digital files where such effects can be done in post in Lightroom or PS.

 

Just my opinions/lessons learnt the hard way.