Leitz Photographica Auction, Vienna, 26th November 2022

[willeica]

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Here is my article on a selection of 14 of the highlights for the forthcoming Leitz Photographica Auction which will take place in Vienna on 26th November 2022.

https://www.macfilos.com/2022/11/14/41st-leitz-photographica-auction-checking-the-highlights-for-the-november-26-event/

There will also be a photograph auction on the same day and I will post a link to my article about a selection of the photographs here when it goes online.

William 

[Anbaric]

I wonder what were they thinking with the backwards rewind on that M3 prototype?

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[LocalHero1953]

18 minutes ago, Anbaric said:

I wonder what were they thinking with the backwards rewind on that M3 prototype?

"We can auction this for zillions in 70 years' time"

[luigi bertolotti]

6 hours ago, Anbaric said:

I wonder what were they thinking with the backwards rewind on that M3 prototype?

I wonder which mechanism is under it... by logic, a direct action on the spool MUST be clockwise 🙄 : could it be a trivial engraving error ? Are there other items like this ?

Anyway... I won't try 150.001 Euros to satisfy this curiosity... 😁

Edited November 15, 2022 by luigi bertolotti

[willeica]

7 hours ago, Anbaric said:

I wonder what were they thinking with the backwards rewind on that M3 prototype?

I don't have a direct answer for your query, but Leitz/Leica tried all sorts of combinations over the years before settling on the final design for its various production models. Some images to conjure with below

The first lever wind from c 1934 was back to front:

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An M3 prototype appeared with a knob wind

The above photos are in the book Museum Leica by Lars Netopil. 

I also have works diary entries which show that the flap door at the back dates back to the mid 1930s, but did not appear until the M3 was launched. Most people here also know about the Leica IV prototype with a combined rangefinder and viewfinder which appeared before World War II, long before the M3. 

The tradition of testing every possible layout and combination went back to Barnack's time.

These and other items will appear in an article I will do on 'Unusual Leicas' after I get a few other items out of the way. PCCGB members have already heard this as a talk either in person or on Zoom.

William 

 

 

 

[Anbaric]

1 hour ago, luigi bertolotti said:

I wonder which mechanism is under it... by logic, a direct action on the spool MUST be clockwise 🙄 : could it be a trivial engraving error ? Are there other items like this ?

Anyway... I won't try 150.001 Euros to satisfy this curiosity... 😁

Is there space for (say) indirect drive via an idler gear? But why do that? I guess you could rewind the film anticlockwise and end up with the emulsion on the other side, but why do that either? Maybe it is just an engraving error, but it would be interesting to know either way.

[Pyrogallol]

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If you tried to rewind the film anti-clockwise you would scratch the film and jam it in the mouth of the cassette.

i don’t think it is an engraving error as that design is shown in one of James Lager’s collectors books.

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[nitroplait]

It is probably to simplify the prototype.

The rewind knob of the M3 is not located directly over the film cartridge, meaning when you turn it, it will need to rotate a gear (attached to the rewind shaft) which then turns another gear which will rotate clockwise and correctly rewind the film.
[counter clockwise ⚙ --> clockwise ⚙]

In order to improve ergonomics and make the the rewind knob turn clockwise in the final design, it is necessary to complicate the construction and introduce a third gear, at least so I imagine.
[clockwise ⚙ --> counter clockwise ⚙ --> clockwise ⚙]

 

Maybe @jerzy would know the details of the M3 rewind shaft construction.

[luigi bertolotti]

40 minutes ago, nitroplait said:

It is probably to simplify the prototype.

The rewind knob of the M3 is not located directly over the film cartridge,...

 

OK... I never noticed that  rewind knob and film cartridge are not co-axial : in this case it's clear that there must be gears between, and direction of rotation can be managed (2 or 3, as you say)

[Giuliobigazzi]

Perhaps the designer was left handed!

[derleicaman]

18 hours ago, willeica said:

I don't have a direct answer for your query, but Leitz/Leica tried all sorts of combinations over the years before settling on the final design for its various production models. Some images to conjure with below

The first lever wind from c 1934 was back to front:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

An M3 prototype appeared with a knob wind

The above photos are in the book Museum Leica by Lars Netopil. 

I also have works diary entries which show that the flap door at the back dates back to the mid 1930s, but did not appear until the M3 was launched. Most people here also know about the Leica IV prototype with a combined rangefinder and viewfinder which appeared before World War II, long before the M3. 

The tradition of testing every possible layout and combination went back to Barnack's time.

These and other items will appear in an article I will do on 'Unusual Leicas' after I get a few other items out of the way. PCCGB members have already heard this as a talk either in person or on Zoom.

William 

 

 

 

Here is the "flap" back door on M875 in the Archive. So I guess this goes back to 1912.

[jerzy]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb nitroplait:

In order to improve ergonomics and make the the rewind knob turn clockwise in the final design, it is necessary to complicate the construction and introduce a third gear, at least so I imagine.

fully correct, currently there are 3 gears there. I suppose that the version in 005 has 2 only

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Edited November 16, 2022 by jerzy

[willeica]

7 hours ago, derleicaman said:

Here is the "flap" back door on M875 in the Archive. So I guess this goes back to 1912.

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The hinge looks like it came off the door of a cupboard. Did you get in touch with Malcolm Taylor about Barnack's cine camera from 1912?

William 

[pippy]

Thank you, William, for posting your very entertaining article and the link to the auction.

Looking through the on-line catalogue (purely as a window-shopper!) there are, of course, many items which are truly superb pieces. Two of the highlights for me are not expected to be 'High-Value' items but for me the Almaz 102 'Prototype' is a fascinating thing (I only have a 103) but the Lot which I find to be absolutely Drop-Dead-Gorgeous was this Canon which you, yourself, featured in the Macfilos article. I'm not really a great fan of the Canon rangefinders but, my word, this one is in a whole different league from the more 'common fare';

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Absolutely Stunning. I'd have that thing 'brassed-up' in no time at all!..............

Thanks again, William!

Philip.

Edited November 17, 2022 by pippy

[willeica]

7 hours ago, pippy said:

Thank you, William, for posting your very entertaining article and the link to the auction.

Looking through the on-line catalogue (purely as a window-shopper!) there are, of course, many items which are truly superb pieces. Two of the highlights for me are not expected to be 'High-Value' items but for me the Almaz 102 'Prototype' is a fascinating thing (I only have a 103) but the Lot which I find to be absolutely Drop-Dead-Gorgeous was this Canon which you, yourself, featured in the Macfilos article. I'm not really a great fan of the Canon rangefinders but, my word, this one is in a whole different league from the more 'common fare';

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Absolutely Stunning. I'd have that thing 'brassed-up' in no time at all!..............

Thanks again, William!

Philip.

Philip, Tony Hurst, a fellow camera collector in Dublin and one of the finest product photographers I know- check out his photos for Grays of Westminster in Amateur Photographer magazine- has some black paint Canon rangefinders. They are stunning cameras, beautiful to hold and to handle. As I mentioned in the article, the paint seems to be much thicker and glossier than that on Leica BP items. They seem much less likely to brass and Tony’s items carry little or no brassing.

William 

Edited November 17, 2022 by willeica

[willeica]

Here is the article about the Photographs Auction. I think that I like this one even more than the one about the cameras. I certainly had more fun writing this one.

https://www.macfilos.com/2022/11/17/leitz-photographs-auction-shadow-and-light-highlights-of-the-auction-in-vienna-on-november-26/

William 

[pippy]

39 minutes ago, willeica said:

Here is the article about the Photographs Auction...

Oddly enough (or perhaps not), William, I spent far more time looking at the photographs included in the up-coming auction than I did the 'kit'. Some genuinely magnificent prints coming up.

Philip.

[UliWer]

What do you think of the Auction's results?

To me it looks as if the hype of former years which lead to extreme prices was over:

Some specially featured items didn't surpass or even didn't meet the estimates: Leica M3 prototype, Noctilux 1:1.2 prototype, or the Nikkor #347 unsold. Many unsold items in (Summarex #75, Thambar #78, SOOZi #79) and outside the Leica biotope. Even the Canon in #311 mentioned above only slightly surpassed the estimates. 

Only some surprises: the Leica IIa sync #31 (the only offer I found attractive in he whole auction, though of course I didn't bid), some Summars (#66 and #68).

Of course (is it really "natural"?) lots of military items surpassed the estimates by large margins (e.g. #215😏).

 

[PG Black nickel]

I noticed that there were 152 unsold lots, which is more than usual I think...

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[luigi bertolotti]

1 hour ago, PG Black nickel said:

I noticed that there were 152 unsold lots, which is more than usual I think...

Yes, I do not remember to have seen so many