Leitz Macro-Elmarit-R 60/2.8 for portraits?

[Shepherdphotographer]

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Hello everyone, I own the Summicron-R 50/2 and the Summilux-R 50 / 1.4.  I love and worship both and use them for different types of photographs because, as you all know, they have two very different characters.  I love the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8 for its rendering in portraits of very old people, it emphasizes wrinkles, gives three-dimensionality, but it is not an aggressive lens and I love its colors.  I need a slightly smaller focal lens, around 50-60mm that has the exact same yield as the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8 for ambient portraits, with pastel colors: the Summicron-R 50/2, which I own, it comes close, but it is different, in terms of rendering, from the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8, so I thought about buying the Elmarit-R 60 / 2.8 macro, but before I turned a lot on the internet to try to understand the yield.  It seems to me a very, very contrasted and very saturated lens and I am not looking for this yield, as I wrote before: could you confirm it, please, attaching some portrait photos?  The Summilux-R 50 / 1.4, which I have, I don't like for set portraits, I use it for other types of photos and if you confirmed me that the Elmarit-R 60 / 2.8 was actually very, very contrasted and saturated, not I would buy it and use the Summicron-R 50/2 instead, which I love, I like the colors, but it has a different yield from the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8, which I look for, as a yield, around 50-60mm.  Thank you all!!

Edited October 26, 2022 by Shepherdphotographer

[frame-it]

wonderful lens..do you shoot only jpeg or RAW? contrast and saturation can be adjusted

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[Shepherdphotographer]

Thank you, frame-it. I shoot in RAW with a Nikon D810. Yes, you can adjust contrast and saruration, but I'm a "purist" and I don't want to edit contrast and saruration on post-processing, I want to search and to use a lens with the right personality which I want for every shoot, every photo.

Edited October 26, 2022 by Shepherdphotographer

[Shepherdphotographer]

Contrast seems to be very very high in your pictures and result very different from Elmarit-R 90/2.8, which I search in 50-60mm. Isn't true? Thanks!

Edited October 26, 2022 by Shepherdphotographer

[frame-it]

56 minutes ago, Shepherdphotographer said:

Contrast seems to be very very high in your pictures

i added more contrast.

[wizard]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb Shepherdphotographer:

if you confirmed me that the Elmarit-R 60 / 2.8 was actually very, very contrasted and saturated

I cannot confirm that. The Elmarit-R 60mm lens is very, very sharp, and while it is contrasty and renders colors beautifully, it is by no means overly contrasty and saturated. I own both a Summicron-R 2/50 and an Elmarit-R 60mm lens, and to me their rendering is comparable in terms of both contrast and color saturation. The Elmarit-R 60mm lens is sharper though, in particular towards the edges of the frame.

[Shepherdphotographer]

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"theiir rendering is comparable in terms of both contrast and color saturation."

Thanks, wizard, for your contribute!

[Shepherdphotographer]

However it is true that with a photo editing software you can completely distort the final result of a photo, but I, as I said, choose a lens for its personality, depending on the type of photo and I don't like to retouch much.  However many do, most people, so on the internet you can find photographs taken with the same lens with very different results.  This is why I ask you in this topic.

[hansvons]

I own all of the lenses you mentioned. I use the 50mm Summicron R for all of my B&W portraits (Delta 400), most of them shot at 2, 8 - 4, 0. But please note that these are environmental portraits. For close-ups, the 90mm Elmarit works better. The Summilux is a speciality lensI like but rarely use.

Now the fabulous 60mm Elmarit Macro. It’s a lens that renders sharp, very sharp but remains gentle to the skin. It’s character is interestingly without opinion but creamy and sharp. It renders flat images, closer to the 90mm than to the 50mm Summicron, which renders already flatter than modern 50ies do. It likes colours but don’t exaggerate them. As all other Leica R lenses, it's imagery is on the cooler side compared to modern Leica glass, but not as cool as the 50mm Summicron R. Contrast-wise, I find it in the 90mm Elmarit ballpark.
 

I‘m sure you will like it.

Edited October 26, 2022 by hansvons

[Shepherdphotographer]

17 minutes ago, hansvons said:

I own all of the lenses you mentioned. I use the 50mm Summicron R for all of my B&W portraits (Delta 400), most of them shot at 2, 8 - 4, 0. But please note that these are environmental portraits. For close-ups, the 90mm Elmarit works better. The Summilux is a speciality lensI like but rarely use.

Now the fabulous 60mm Elmarit Macro. It’s a lens that renders sharp, very sharp but remains gentle to the skin. It’s character is interestingly without opinion but creamy and sharp. It renders flat images, closer to the 90mm than to the 50mm Summicron, which renders already flatter than modern 50ies do. It likes colours but don’t exaggerate them. As all other Leica R lenses, it's imagery is on the cooler side compared to modern Leica glass, but not as cool as the 50mm Summicron R. Contrast-wise, I find it in the 90mm Elmarit ballpark.
 

I‘m sure you will like it.

Thank you, hansvons, certainly I would like to use the 50mm / 60mm I'm looking for that I'm talking about in this topic for set portraits: for "normal" portraits, in fact, no one would ever convince me to abandon my favorite lens, which reigns supreme for portraits, the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8: that's why I'm asking you for advice on a lens around 50-60mm with the same personality as the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8, considering the Summicron-R 50/2, which I already have and which could also suit me for set portraits, but it does not have the 90 / 2.8 yield and for this reason I was asking about the personality of the 60 / 2.8 macro. The 60 / 2.8 is sharp and respectful, without being intrusive, you said: I really don't care about sharpness: you definitely know the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8 and you know what I'm looking for, so if you tell me I'd love it, I think it's the right choice to buy it. Unfortunately, however, on the net, you can see photos, obviously very retouched, which would make the Elmarit-R 60 / 2.8 macro look like a completely different personality.

I don't find the Summicron-R 50/2 cold ......, but it's a matter of taste and I certainly respect yours. The 60 / 2.8 has the same pastel colors, originally, without photo editing, but more contrast, saturation, sharpness (moreover from one end of the frame to the other) and is it more correct than the Summicron-r 50/2?

[Shepherdphotographer]

For my taste, this is a nice image, as a rendering, even if the colors are too saturated: (but how much has it been pulled ??)

 

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[Shepherdphotographer]

I finally found this photo, on Flickr, in which the yield of the Elmarit-R 60 / 2.8 Macro would seem to be very similar to that of the Elmarit-R 90 / 2.8, which would have highlighted even more wrinkles on the skin, it would have been more delicate and would have returned even less saturated colors. But we are getting closer ...

 

The link of thi picture is the following: https://www.flickr.com/photos/draculro/15349625032/in/pool-1884412@N24/

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by Shepherdphotographer

[Shepherdphotographer]

I hope it is allowed to post photos of others with the copyright mark ...... Can I rest assured?

[LocalHero1953]

6 minutes ago, Shepherdphotographer said:

I hope it is allowed to post photos of others with the copyright mark ...... Can I rest assured?

I think you should post a link to the photos, not post the photos themselves. The forum (working under German law) is very strict about such things…..but I am not a moderator!

[Shepherdphotographer]

10 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

I think you should post a link to the photos, not post the photos themselves. The forum (working under German law) is very strict about such things…..but I am not a moderator!

Ok, I edit and post only the link

Edited October 26, 2022 by Shepherdphotographer

[Shepherdphotographer]

1 hour ago, hansvons said:

but not as cool as the 50mm Summicron R.

I don't find the Summicron-R 50/2 cold ......, but it's a matter of taste and I certainly respect yours. The 60 / 2.8 has the same pastel colors, originally, without photo editing, but more contrast, saturation, sharpness (moreover from one end of the frame to the other) and is it more correct than the Summicron-r 50/2? I don't like bokeh of Summicron-R 50/2 and it is important for ambiental portraits for me: for this reason I'm searching an alternative eand not the Summilux-R 50/14, which I know, own and is too fairytale for set portraits......

[Shepherdphotographer]

This photo is also close to the yield I am looking for, but it is also too saturated and contrasted

 

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/search/?q=60/2.8&quick=1&item=286217&type=forums_topic&sortby=relevancy&search_and_or=or&search_in=all

[frame-it]

its a good idea to go to a shop that has the lens, and try it out and check the results on your calibrated monitor, then decide.

[Shepherdphotographer]

12 minutes ago, frame-it said:

its a good idea to go to a shop that has the lens, and try it out and check the results on your calibrated monitor, then decide.

I can't, because I have got only a Nikon D810 camera and I can't mount a Leica R lens directly!!!

Edited October 26, 2022 by Shepherdphotographer

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[Shepherdphotographer]

Wandering on the internet, I was intrigued by another lens: not from Leica, however, so I am not asking you to talk about it, but I would like to mention it, just by way of comparison: the Voigtlander Nokton 58 / 1.4 SLII: it seems less saturated and contrasted Elmarit-R 60 / 2.8 macro and excellent blur, excellent colors.