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Scratching the noctilux itch


Aryel

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Hello,

I like 50s a lot but never tried a noctilux yet. I shoot 100% film (70% Black and white) and considering to pick one up to try out. I tend to prefer classic lenses and ergonomics (typically summicron rigid and v1). 

I am considering picking up a second hand new release of the f1.2.  I also have a summilux pre-asph that I like a lot. Are they different enough to justify the two?

Any thoughts?

This is definitely a case of acute gas…

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For me, @Aryel, if you don't try by yourself you would never know.

- each lens is different from another, even the "same" reference

[ I know this with my multiple (a) - Summicron 35 IV that I collected a while back, now still keeping two (one "Canada" & one "Wetzlar"

(b) - now I use three from different period Summilux 50mm pre-asph seeing each is different in use and results (subtle hard to see but always there) ...]

- as curious person, I use for a while so many lenses (try to know them) never saw a "one-lens-do-it-all" or "perfect lens"

so good thing, we can discover them infinitely

- Noctilux lenses are just another lenses even if people (including me ! ) try to make them "special" which they are NOT

...

- only way to find out is using the lens for a while

- You would try one day LTM Canon 1.2/50 which is "better" ( not neglicted the hiding portion of VF at 50 physically shorter ) user lens than my Noctilux 1.0,

color is weird though but b&w rendering is a blend of classic/glow/soft but not too much/and more to discover

 

Arnaud

Edited by a.noctilux
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The rendering seemed different when I had both, but I thought the Summilux was much more useful and pleasing overall, and the cash was wasted on the Noctilux. I admit though, that it was a great attention getter😁. The only way you'll know if it works for you is to try it...if you don't like it there are always anxious buyers just waiting for an opportunity to acquire one.

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I'm sorry I can't comment on the new release 1.2 , although I recently added a F1 E58 Noc, to join the 50:1.4 pre-asph

I quite like to 'match' my lenses, for example I use the 50:1.4 v3 with 35:1.4 v2 and find my copies to render as close as I could wish for for different focal lengths.  The Noc, however, is completely unique and instantly identifiable.

Of course the E58 is known for being gentle, de-saturated colours and low contrast, and is not particularly sharp (part of it's charm IMO).  I am unsure how the re-issue of 1.2 differs but since it's a modern remake could it possibly close the gap on 50:1.4 in sharpness ?  

I just love my Noc and see it's rendering completely out on it's own.  

Hope it's helpful in some way :D 

Edited by grahamc
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I have the last version of the 50 f/1.0 Noctilux, #11-822.  I am pleased with the way it renders colors and with its fingerprint.  It imparts the Leica glow that we hear so much about and the bokeh is very soft and nice.  It produces an artistic rendering at f/1, but performs more like the 50mm f/2 Summicron when stopped down to f/4 or smaller.

  Yes, #11-822 vignettes noticeably at f/1, but that is not an issue to me.  It is part of the signature look of this lens.  Exposure vignetting can be countered in post processing, if need be.

From what I have seen of the reissued Noctilux f/1.2 ASPH # 11-686, it is noticeably closer to the rendering of the f/0.95 Noctilux by a couple of steps - producing somewhat more contrast and being somewhat sharper at f/1.2 while producing a pleasing color rendering.

Either lens will serve you well on both film and digital M camera bodies.  The choice comes down to which rendering you prefer, and of course price.

Edited by Herr Barnack
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I have the 50mm pre asph and the f1 Noctilux. 
 

they have absolutely different rendering. The Noctilux has much more contrast and much better saturated colours and sharpens up in the corners faster than the 1.4. I guess it makes sense since it’s a newer design. 

The 1.4 has a nice Pastell Color palette which works very nicely with portraits. Mine also focuses to 0.7meters which is nice. 
 

To be honest I’m considering selling both and getting the ASPH Summilux as it is the best blend of size and performance. 
 

 

Edited by sebben
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I acquired the re-issue 50/1.2 back in June. I have always coveted the original for as long as I can remember. I almost picked up an original one back in the 80's for about $ 800. Oh well.

The re-issue is better than the original in almost every way. The original was very hit or miss, as there was a lot of variation from lens to lens. The re-issue, with modern coatings and tighter tolerances it is the better lens. The question is, is it too close to the pre-ASPH 50 Summilux? I own that lens too, and again, it depends. I still have my original silver chrome Summilux from the late 50's, and I would say the re-issue Noctilux is a better lens than that. I used to own a late 70's 50 Summilux, and from memory, I would say it was better than the earlier Summilux and more on a par with the re-issue.

I also own the retro 50 Summilux ASPH in black chrome and that lens is better than the re-issue. The re-issue is like two different lenses in one. Wide open dreamy, but much sharper stopped down, just like the pre-ASPH 35 Summilux, which I also own. I own the pre-FLE 35 Summilux ASPH, and it beats all of the above hands down. But lately I have been using a German 35 KOB Summicron, and it is damn close.

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4 hours ago, sebben said:

I have the 50mm pre asph and the f1 Noctilux. 
 

they have absolutely different rendering. The Noctilux has much more contrast and much better saturated colours and sharpens up in the corners faster than the 1.4. I guess it makes sense since it’s a newer design. 

The 1.4 has a nice Pastell Color palette which works very nicely with portraits. Mine also focuses to 0.7meters which is nice. 
 

To be honest I’m considering selling both and getting the ASPH Summilux as it is the best blend of size and performance. 
 

 

Hi Sebben. This is interesting because it sounds like the opposite of my lenses - my pre-asph (v3) being sharper & with more contrast than my Noc.    
 

Which of the f1 versions do you have ? 

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I've had the 50 1.2 reissue for quite awhile now. Wide open it is only "sharp" in the center. Sharp being a catchall term for contrast and resolution together. Wide open off center,  you will not find that combination of contrast and resolution at any distance (it's not a matter of field curvature) until you start getting nearer the edges of the frame. Of, course this only applies to wide open. As you stop it down it gets very contrasty and high resolution throughout the frame, it's almost as if you can dial in the effect of the lens from a lot at 1.2 to none by the time you hit f4/5.6. It's a pretty darn good lens, but just know it's not a matter of a razor thin focus from center to edge wide open.

 

I've also recently acquired 50 1.0 v4, that has had a very recent CLA and coding done at factory in Germany. It' is a very good copy that previous owner obsessed about getting right. All than being said, the 50 1.2 reissue is a tad sharper in the center when wide open, but the f1 v4 has a wider area of focus when wide open. the 50 1 v4 also sharpens up from edge to edge really nicely as it is stopped down.

 

Both of these lenses can stay on your camera all day long giving you the opportunity for deploying the Noctilux effect and still having a perfectly great sharpness available edge to edge jus by stopping down a bit.

The 50 1.2 reissue is smaller that the F1 v4 by quite a bit, very much similar in size and look to 50mm Summilux black paint.

With my 2 Noctiluxes, my Summilux 50 doesn't get a whole lot of use right now.

 

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Thanks a lot everyone for the help! 

I went to a few dealers and had a chance to try a 0.95 asph, a f1 v4 and the f1.2. At the end the ergonomic and smaller size helped finalise the decision along with a deal for a brand new one. Will take my time to try out and learn. The noctilux images on the thread are really different. 
 

On 8/21/2022 at 2:37 AM, sebben said:

To be honest I’m considering selling both and getting the ASPH Summilux as it is the best blend of size and performance. 

I’d suggest to try out before you sell as I did the opposite: I sold a summilux asph to get the pre-asph and never looked back. 
 

Thanks a lot for all the inputs. I should receive the lens in a couple of days. 

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45 minutes ago, Aryel said:

I went to a few dealers and had a chance to try a 0.95 asph, a f1 v4 and the f1.2. At the end the ergonomic and smaller size helped finalise the decision along with a deal for a brand new one. Will take my time to try out and learn. The noctilux

👍 you will see by yourself.

 

45 minutes ago, Aryel said:
On 8/20/2022 at 8:37 PM, sebben said:

To be honest I’m considering selling both and getting the ASPH Summilux as it is the best blend of size and performance. 

I’d suggest to try out before you sell as I did the opposite: I sold a summilux asph to get the pre-asph and never looked back. 

So, Sebben can see if the Summilux-M asph suits him, why not.

Like you @Aryel, I prefer pre-asph Summilux over asph.

I had the two Lux 50 asph. and pre-asph at same time, but sold the asph. (for non use) "cheap" to a young M user.

Edited by a.noctilux
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I own most of the lenses discussed here.

The 1.2 reissue is extraordinary and magical wide open.  Images have a unique look (dreamy is good) but are only really sharp in the very center of the frame.  As you stop down the sharp area gets larger, but also some of the dreamy look still remains up until about f4 or so.  Images are poetic, evocative.  Freaky.  BEAUTIFUL build quality.

The pre-asph is less unique, evocative, poetic and freaky!   I think of it as gentle if that makes sense.  The noct is aggressively unusual, the lux gently evocative.

I also have the black chrome edition lux, which is razor sharp, with a very crisp, contrasty modern rendering, totally different than the other 2.

What I would suggest is also that you rent a copy of the noct and see how you get along with it.  That's what I did  - from lensrentals.com, and I was sold on it.  

I would also propose looking at the CV 50 1.2 and 1.0.  1.2 is a more classic rendering (think something between the 1.2 and 1.0 nocts) and the 1.0 is very much in the spirit of the leica 0.95 - incredibly sharp and crisp from wide open

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My m3 has a new friend:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!


Thank you so much for all the information, feedback and suggestions. Time to discover and learn. 

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On 8/20/2022 at 11:05 PM, grahamc said:

Hi Sebben. This is interesting because it sounds like the opposite of my lenses - my pre-asph (v3) being sharper & with more contrast than my Noc.    
 

Which of the f1 versions do you have ? 

I have the E60. 
 

It renders colours very differently, I was very surprised when I saw the tests. 

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On 8/22/2022 at 12:38 PM, Aryel said:

Thanks a lot everyone for the help! 

I went to a few dealers and had a chance to try a 0.95 asph, a f1 v4 and the f1.2. At the end the ergonomic and smaller size helped finalise the decision along with a deal for a brand new one. Will take my time to try out and learn. The noctilux images on the thread are really different. 
 

I’d suggest to try out before you sell as I did the opposite: I sold a summilux asph to get the pre-asph and never looked back. 
 

Thanks a lot for all the inputs. I should receive the lens in a couple of days. 

When I did the test I had the ASPH loaned from a friend. When I have sometime I’ll post some pictures. 

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