gotium Posted August 11, 2022 Share #21 Posted August 11, 2022 Advertisement (gone after registration) 5 minutes ago, rramesh said: The 28mm Summicron is undoubtedly the best reportage lenses ever made for the Leica M. I'm going to go way out on a limb here and suggest that this is opinion as opposed to established fact. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted August 11, 2022 Posted August 11, 2022 Hi gotium, Take a look here Summicron 28 ASPH bokeh - is this right?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Herr Barnack Posted August 11, 2022 Share #22 Posted August 11, 2022 59 minutes ago, gotium said: I'm going to go way out on a limb here and suggest that this is opinion as opposed to established fact. Perhaps so, but the 28 Summicron is an awfully good lens. I had the first version and I still miss it. I'll replace it with the current version at my first opportunity. As for "the best reportage lenses ever made for the Leica M," I would suggest the 28 Summicron, 28 Summilux, 35 Summicron, 35 APO Summicron or the 35 Summilux. It's a tight race; that's about as far as I can narrow it down. For reportage use, it would be hard to go wrong with any one of the five. 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 12, 2022 Share #23 Posted August 12, 2022 (edited) 22 hours ago, Herr Barnack said: Perhaps so, but the 28 Summicron is an awfully good lens. I think some copies must be awfully good, as I've heard it so many times. Both copies I tried were awful without the good part though, and it cost me enough that I'm not up to trying again. Edited August 12, 2022 by gotium Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 12, 2022 Share #24 Posted August 12, 2022 (edited) I have no experience with the Summilux 28/1.4 but the Summicron 28/2 is a superb lens indeed. So good that i kept both v1 and v2. V1 for 3D subject matters and portraits thanks to its field curvature giving some pop to main subjects i suspect. The opposite of a boring lens contrary to some parroting statements on the web. V2 for landscapes and architecture preferably, also for its screw-in hood that i find less cumbersome than the clip-on ones of v1. Matter of taste obviously but the current Ultron 28/2 is a more than acceptable alternative for photogs on a budget. It has a bit more vignetting and color fringing than the Summicron and its focal length is somewhat longer but thanks to its smaller size it is a great lens on crop cameras like the CL for which vignetting is less critical and a very good lens on M cameras anyway. Edited August 12, 2022 by lct Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smkoush Posted August 12, 2022 Share #25 Posted August 12, 2022 On 8/11/2022 at 4:44 AM, Herr Barnack said: As for "the best reportage lenses ever made for the Leica M," I would suggest the 28 Summicron, 28 Summilux, 35 Summicron, 35 APO Summicron or the 35 Summilux. It's a tight race; that's about as far as I can narrow it down. For reportage use, it would be hard to go wrong with any one of the five. I used to think the same re: 28mm summicron, but the new 28mm Summaron changed that to my surprise. It is such a lovely little thing, with a very unique rendering, my 28mm summicron has been resting on the shelf since the arrival of the summaron (this is for when light allows of course, the summicron is much more versatile given its larger aperture). 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
swatch Posted August 13, 2022 Share #26 Posted August 13, 2022 below photo of a gentleman with his dog on electric car was at f/2.8 as I need buffer for focusing error by following the subject in quick walk. bokeh depends on distance between photographer and subject, aperture and distance between subject and its background. bokeh from Corn 28mm asph is soft / objects out of focus are less defined in shape but not a melting colour. get closer ( the cat photo at f/2.0 ) is another example showing bokeh from Corn 28mm asph is not bad provided the cat was close to the background. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/335334-summicron-28-asph-bokeh-is-this-right/?do=findComment&comment=4488641'>More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #27 Posted August 23, 2022 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) Ok, after all of the positive comments I’ve read about this lens I went ahead and RENTED a copy and I can confirm that it has a huge focus shift. I also think it has a funny focal plane that brings sharpness way forward at the edges. For me the focus shift would make it unusable. And this is the third copy I’ve tried. I can’t believe I’m the only one seeing this. Maybe I just have really bad luck? Edited August 23, 2022 by gotium Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 23, 2022 Share #28 Posted August 23, 2022 3 hours ago, gotium said: Ok, after all of the positive comments I’ve read about this lens I went ahead and RENTED a copy and I can confirm that it has a huge focus shift. I also think it has a funny focal plane that brings sharpness way forward at the edges. For me the focus shift would make it unusable. And this is the third copy I’ve tried. I can’t believe I’m the only one seeing this. Maybe I just have really bad luck? You found some focus shift out of the Summilux 35/1.4 FLE too if memory serves so perhaps you're taking back or front focus for focus shift i don't know. Do you have some pics showing this effect? I mean something focused at f/2 and becoming soft at, say, f/2.8 or f/4 while keeping exactly the same focus setting? Just curious. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #29 Posted August 23, 2022 30 minutes ago, lct said: You found some focus shift out of the Summilux 35/1.4 FLE too if memory serves so perhaps you're taking back or front focus for focus shift i don't know. Do you have some pics showing this effect? I mean something focused at f/2 and becoming soft at, say, f/2.8 or f/4 while keeping exactly the same focus setting? Just curious. What I'm referring to is the focal plane moving as you change aperture - for the 35/1.4 FLE this was fairly minor, but there if you look. For the 28/2 I think it's pretty significant. I've deleted my more careful testing from a few years ago, but I'll upload some quick and dirty ones for this most recent copy. They start focused on the 8-inch mark on my ruler (this lens also front-focuses, but that's another issue) and with changing only the aperture (I did not re-focus) the *center* of the focal plane (which you see by choosing the midpoint between where it starts to go blurry on either side) moves all the way back to the 9-inch mark by f/2.8, and then even further back by f/4 and f/5.6. The 8 remains largely in focus I suppose, but the center of the focal plane moves well behind it. Apologies if it's not easy to see with the jpgs. I'm looking at them at 100% on a low-res monitor, which is much easier for this stuff than the usual high-res monitors. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #30 Posted August 23, 2022 f/2 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/335334-summicron-28-asph-bokeh-is-this-right/?do=findComment&comment=4495203'>More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #31 Posted August 23, 2022 (edited) f/2.8 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited August 23, 2022 by gotium Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/335334-summicron-28-asph-bokeh-is-this-right/?do=findComment&comment=4495205'>More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #32 Posted August 23, 2022 (edited) f/4 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited August 23, 2022 by gotium Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/335334-summicron-28-asph-bokeh-is-this-right/?do=findComment&comment=4495207'>More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #33 Posted August 23, 2022 (edited) f/5.6 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Edited August 23, 2022 by gotium Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/335334-summicron-28-asph-bokeh-is-this-right/?do=findComment&comment=4495208'>More sharing options...
Ouroboros Posted August 23, 2022 Share #34 Posted August 23, 2022 Always so exciting to see a photograph of a Westcott AT-24. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 23, 2022 Share #35 Posted August 23, 2022 (edited) I know rulers are often used but i prefer real world tests personally. 5m subject distance work well in my experience but i do also 1m or infinity. Last time i did both 5m and 1m tests and found zero focus shift at all apertures out of my Summilux 35/1.4 FLE. Not sure i will have the courage to redo it on the 28/2 v2... Edited August 23, 2022 by lct Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 23, 2022 Share #36 Posted August 23, 2022 3 hours ago, lct said: I know rulers are often used but i prefer real world tests personally. 5m subject distance work well in my experience but i do also 1m or infinity. Last time i did both 5m and 1m tests and found zero focus shift at all apertures out of my Summilux 35/1.4 FLE. Not sure i will have the courage to redo it on the 28/2 v2... If you’re happy with it, don’t look. I looked (with a ruler) because I wasn’t happy with my real-world results. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 23, 2022 Share #37 Posted August 23, 2022 4 minutes ago, gotium said: If you’re happy with it, don’t look. I looked (with a ruler) because I wasn’t happy with my real-world results. I did it in the past on v1 but not yet on v2 of the 28/2 so i took a couple of snaps at 1m to try and replicate your issue. I have not processed them yet but i did not notice problems on the LCD at first glance. Will revert when i can process them at full 60mp resolution. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 24, 2022 Share #38 Posted August 24, 2022 End of my boring test on a lawn chair . As expected, the Summicron 28/2 v2 does not suffer from focus shift at 1m subject distance as far as my copy is concerned. Focused at f/2 on M11 at 60mp (link), pics remain in focus at f/2 (link), f/2.8 (link), f/4 (link), f/5.6 (link), f/8 (link), f/11 (link) and f/16 (link). Fore more detail see exif data. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotium Posted August 24, 2022 Share #39 Posted August 24, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, lct said: End of my boring test on a lawn chair . As expected, the Summicron 28/2 v2 does not suffer from focus shift at 1m subject distance as far as my copy is concerned. Focused at f/2 on M11 at 60mp (link), pics remain in focus at f/2 (link), f/2.8 (link), f/4 (link), f/5.6 (link), f/8 (link), f/11 (link) and f/16 (link). Fore more detail see exif data. Well….you can’t really tell if there’s a focus shift with that subject - all you can tell is if the subject remains within the depth of field. The center of the focal plane could be moving around in front or behind the subject, as I found in my sample. That may be all you need to know for your use of the lens though - if your subject remains more or less sharp, you may not care where the center of the focal plane is. Edited August 24, 2022 by gotium Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted August 24, 2022 Share #40 Posted August 24, 2022 If it looks sharp on 100% crops at 60mp i don't know where it could look soft actually. On 100mp sensors you mean? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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