Leica M-A Titan GAS pictures.

[Huss]

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2 hours ago, aesop said:

 

    ...alas, all I see is an investment opportunity, not working tools.

It would have been a working tool for me if I was able to get one.  I was on the list at Leica Miami but did not get one.

Congrats on those who did!  It is a stunning piece.

[Herr Barnack]

2 hours ago, aesop said:

 

    ...alas, all I see is an investment opportunity, not working tools.

I simply can't imagine having an M-A Titan kit and letting it go it for any price that a sane person would be willing to offer for it. 

It would take an offer of $80k USD to get me to even think about it.  It's because of the inflation, you see. 😁

Edited June 20, 2022 by Herr Barnack

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[aesop]

1 hour ago, Huss said:

It would have been a working tool for me if I was able to get one.  I was on the list at Leica Miami but did not get one.

Congrats on those who did!  It is a stunning piece.

 

      ...I am flummoxed by your "working tool" comment, Huss.

I chose my words carefully: the premise here is that you are a worker and the camera + lens are your tools. As a worker, it is imperative that you do everything to make a profit - that is why you are in business.

Why then would you want to pay an absurdly huge premium for an über-deluxe version of the tool, when the standard version does exactly the same job competently? It is also worth remembering that the standard version is arguably at the top end of the tools available for the job - it is a deluxe tool.

I note you have not expressly indicated it would not be an investment, but still have to ask - what is the reason you are willing to recklessly pay extra for a competent set of working tools if there is no added benefit to the business?

It goes without saying that there is nothing wrong with acquiring the camera + lens as an investment. It just seems a bit strange to run down the potential value of that investment by using it as a working tool.

I am no accountant, but I am sure you will set me straight. Apologies for any typos, it has been a long day. Thanks.

 

 

 

[Capuccino-Muffin]

12 minutes ago, aesop said:

 

      ...I am flummoxed by your "working tool" comment, Huss.

I chose my words carefully: the premise here is that you are a worker and the camera + lens are your tools. As a worker, it is imperative that you do everything to make a profit - that is why you are in business.

Why then would you want to pay an absurdly huge premium for an über-deluxe version of the tool, when the standard version does exactly the same job competently? It is also worth remembering that the standard version is arguably at the top end of the tools available for the job - it is a deluxe tool.

I note you have not expressly indicated it would not be an investment, but still have to ask - what is the reason you are willing to recklessly pay extra for a competent set of working tools if there is no added benefit to the business?

It goes without saying that there is nothing wrong with acquiring the camera + lens as an investment. It just seems a bit strange to run down the potential value of that investment by using it as a working tool.

I am no accountant, but I am sure you will set me straight. Apologies for any typos, it has been a long day. Thanks.

 

 

 

Huss Roi is a construction worker, and a hobbyist photographer.

A Titanium camera doubles up wonderfully as a hammer.

[BigBabyEarl]

4 hours ago, aesop said:

 

    ...alas, all I see is an investment opportunity, not working tools.

It can be both and that shouldn’t be something to frown upon. How often can you buy a camera, any camera that you can use until your heart is content and then sell it for at the very least what you paid (in used condition)? To the people who ONLY see it as an investment opportunity shame on you and shame on the dealers who sold it to you. It’s a lightweight, durable, and highly functional kit that also happens to be beautiful. I hope the lion’s share of people who bought it use it. Of course there’s alway opportunists and you can’t hate on that, but be clear to not see it as a work tool is subjective. 
And by work I mean it in whatever way you want it to mean. Taking photos that I enjoy could be seen as good work once it’s framed in my house and people actually like it. 

Edited June 20, 2022 by BigBabyEarl

[aesop]

On 6/11/2022 at 10:37 AM, Matlock said:

I have to agree. Also, as Parker Pens found out, Titanium can have some very unfortunate structural problems.

 

       ...are you able to expand on the above, Matlock? I ask because I come from a mountain biking background and my much-abused titanium frame actually outlasted my MTB riding career (I have since drifted into road riding). The frame is somewhere in my basement, still 100% structurally uncompromised - which is more than I can say for myself.

 

[Matlock]

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4 minutes ago, aesop said:

 

       ...are you able to expand on the above, Matlock? I ask because I come from a mountain biking background and my much-abused titanium frame actually outlasted my MTB riding career (I have since drifted into road riding). The frame is somewhere in my basement, still 100% structurally uncompromised - which is more than I can say for myself.

 

This is what has been reported regarding Parker's T-1s, they were discontinued after less than a year. Obviously some of the problems would not be replicated with the M-A. "Titanium is not an easy material to work, and Parker never managed to get production costs down to a reasonable level.  It is probable that it was not just the reject rate that was excessive, but also the degree of wear and breakage to the tooling.  Attaching tipping material to the integral titanium nib-shell was also very difficult, as nib repair specialists have come to appreciate when attempting to retip damaged T-1s."

[Danner]

On 6/18/2022 at 3:48 PM, M10Alpine said:

Looks equally good with the Titanium 35mm Summilux - the APO with its hood is to die for. Firs pic her in the Leica store. Just a little bit excited...

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I love that strap.  Just perfect for an M-A.

[aesop]

59 minutes ago, BigBabyEarl said:

It can be both and that shouldn’t be something to frown upon. How often can you buy a camera, any camera that you can use until your heart is content and then sell it for at the very least what you paid (in used condition)? To the people who ONLY see it as an investment opportunity shame on you and shame on the dealers who sold it to you. It’s a lightweight, durable, and highly functional kit that also happens to be beautiful. I hope the lion’s share of people who bought it use it. Of course there’s alway opportunists and you can’t hate on that, but be clear to not see it as a work tool is subjective. 
And by work I mean it in whatever way you want it to mean. Taking photos that I enjoy could be seen as good work once it’s framed in my house and people actually like it. 

 

     ...I have never bought to sell but recognise that others do, BigBabyEarl. I have no idea why you consider identifying investment opportunities shameful (and opportunistic) but will fight for your right to voice your opinion. I am also of the opinion that collectors and investors are critical to the brand - ditto enthusiasts and working photographers.

Incidentally, Leica knew exactly what they were doing when they limited production of this highly desirable combo. The rest is just Economics 101.

 

 

 

[aesop]

38 minutes ago, Matlock said:

This is what has been reported regarding Parker's T-1s, they were discontinued after less than a year. Obviously some of the problems would not be replicated with the M-A. "Titanium is not an easy material to work, and Parker never managed to get production costs down to a reasonable level.  It is probable that it was not just the reject rate that was excessive, but also the degree of wear and breakage to the tooling.  Attaching tipping material to the integral titanium nib-shell was also very difficult, as nib repair specialists have come to appreciate when attempting to retip damaged T-1s."

 

     ...thanks for this, Matlock.

Yes, titanium is notoriously difficult to work but, when properly done, the resulting product is usually something to behold. I reckon that in the case of the M-A Titan, with the correct tooling and Leica's experience, CNC milling would have made light work of producing the titanium parts.

One of the key issues with titanium arises when you try to fabricate something from titanium and other metal parts via welding or some other bonding process (such as the iridium nib of the T-1). Welding titanium tubing together for bicycle frames was fraught with complexities not usually associated with other materials, but I digress. To my knowledge, there is no such problem with the M-A Titan, which has solid milled titanium parts.

On a separate but not unconnected issue, it would be interesting to hear from *users* of earlier titanium-plated iterations of Leica equipment - how durable is the titanium plating from back then?

 

 

 

[IkarusJohn]

6 hours ago, aesop said:

 

    ...alas, all I see is an investment opportunity, not working tools.

Gaslighting, don’t you think?

You present only two options - either an investment or a working tool; then when someone who bought the camera to use, not as an investment, you observe that it’s a poor or even unwise choice for a working photographer.

That leaves a keen photographer with the funds to purchase a beautiful camera to use for his hobby somewhat deflated.  How many professional photographers use a standard M-A for their professional work?  It’s a beautiful camera.  I hope the 250 lucky owners use them and enjoy them.

[aesop]

34 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

Gaslighting, don’t you think?

You present only two options - either an investment or a working tool; then when someone who bought the camera to use, not as an investment, you observe that it’s a poor or even unwise choice for a working photographer.

That leaves a keen photographer with the funds to purchase a beautiful camera to use for his hobby somewhat deflated.  How many professional photographers use a standard M-A for their professional work?  It’s a beautiful camera.  I hope the 250 lucky owners use them and enjoy them.

 

    ...surely you jest, IkarusJohn?

I don't know if you've noticed, but there is a multiplicity of opinions here, some I agree with, others I don't. And I can guarantee you not everyone agrees with me. I tend to just move on. Water off a duck's back. And then this:

      "Gaslighting?"

      "That leaves a keen photographer with the funds to purchase a beautiful camera to use for his hobby somewhat deflated."

Hilarious. Have a beer on me.

 

 

 

 

[IkarusJohn]

12 minutes ago, aesop said:

 

    ...surely you jest, IkarusJohn?

I don't know if you've noticed, but there is a multiplicity of opinions here, some I agree with, others I don't. And I can guarantee you not everyone agrees with me. I tend to just move on. Water off a duck's back. And then this:

      "Gaslighting?"

      "That leaves a keen photographer with the funds to purchase a beautiful camera to use for his hobby somewhat deflated."

Hilarious. Have a beer on me.

 

 

 

 

I most certainly shall!  It’s just a little early!

[Matlock]

11 hours ago, aesop said:

 

     ...thanks for this, Matlock.

Yes, titanium is notoriously difficult to work but, when properly done, the resulting product is usually something to behold. I reckon that in the case of the M-A Titan, with the correct tooling and Leica's experience, CNC milling would have made light work of producing the titanium parts.

One of the key issues with titanium arises when you try to fabricate something from titanium and other metal parts via welding or some other bonding process (such as the iridium nib of the T-1). Welding titanium tubing together for bicycle frames was fraught with complexities not usually associated with other materials, but I digress. To my knowledge, there is no such problem with the M-A Titan, which has solid milled titanium parts.

On a separate but not unconnected issue, it would be interesting to hear from *users* of earlier titanium-plated iterations of Leica equipment - how durable is the titanium plating from back then?

 

 

 

I have to agree with you, Titanium top and bottom plates should be of no problem and I don't think any welding problems should arise (at least I hope not 😊). Incidentally, and back to bikes, I have a Raleigh Team bike, one of the last made at their Ilkeston plant, fully equipped with Campagnolo Super Record Groupset which has a large Titanium content. I would be interested to know if the Titanium components for the M-A are produced ''in house' or outsourced.

[M10Alpine]

On 6/20/2022 at 8:02 PM, Danner said:

I love that strap.  Just perfect for an M-A.

Its a Arte di Mano custom order strap. I have a few, I use them for my MP Anthracite and my MP Hammertone. For me this will be used. I'm not selling even its at 46.000USD now.

[Flu]

The Titanium Boys… sounds like a band 😆 

image via M11 50mm 1.2 noct silver.

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[Huss]

Someone here is trying to sell their Ti M-A kit.

[mediumformula]

Does anyone know what the weight difference is between the titanium and brass body is? 

[calijax]

 

On 6/20/2022 at 12:11 PM, aesop said:

On a separate but not unconnected issue, it would be interesting to hear from *users* of earlier titanium-plated iterations of Leica equipment - how durable is the titanium plating from back then?

I've shot several rolls through mine and wow, how lovely (and light) this body is. I was rather surprised how on my 2nd or 3rd day of shooting I noticed the (maybe ceramic) coating on top of the titanium has already begun to peel/flake. It seems very thin and delicate, however, the slightly brighter titanium hue beneath looks nice. It doesn't bother me, but I doubt this was the surfaces intended wear schedule...

 

 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[logan2z]

16 minutes ago, calijax said:

 

I've shot several rolls through mine and wow, how lovely (and light) this body is. I was rather surprised how on my 2nd or 3rd day of shooting I noticed the (maybe ceramic) coating on top of the titanium has already begun to peel/flake. It seems very thin and delicate, however, the slightly brighter titanium hue beneath looks nice. It doesn't bother me, but I doubt this was the surfaces intended wear schedule...

 

 

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Stating the obvious here, but that doesn't look right.  Have you spoken to your dealer or someone at Leica about it?