SL2-S for Filmmaking?

[jonnyboy]

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I just wanted to hear your thoughts about the SL2-S for professional filmmaking - anyone in here using it?

When it comes to run-n-gun videos, I shoot with my Sony A7s 3 which sometimes I pair with my old body Sony A7 III. I'd love to bring a bit of the Leica look/workflow into my videos so my questions are:

-What's the overheating situation? Let's say I want to use it as a B-Cam for an event, can I shoot for 1 or 2h straight?

-I don't know what's the current firmware situations, I'm sure it shoots 4K at 25fps without cropping - does it have any cropping when doing slowmotion? Does it crop at 4K 60?

Thanks!

[Photoworks]

you probably should read about the supported setting. I think the slow-motion on the SL2s is only in Super35 mode. the SL2 has 4k 60p in full frame.

I use the SL2 for video and I am very happy with the results. But I don't do many long takes.

I think the Panasonic s5 is probably better for that...

 

recommendations for Leica long takes.

Use external recorder, Atomos.
bring lots of power. batterie go fast in video mode. you can attach a USB-c power adapter or power bank. but it only takes longer to discharge . Best to use a battery grip + power bank .  Panasonic camera have dummy batteries that can be attached to a V lock battery.

I really got overheating , but occasionally  using internal SD cards at 40min in I got HOT icon on the screen.

 

 

[hansvons]

The Leica SL2-S has the segment's best colour. Period. 

But when shooting L-log, it's an HDR camera that needs the Rec2020 colour space for great results. You can use it for genuine HDR projects like the Amira or Venice. Leica's L-log is based on Rec2020, which points to the assumed use case.

I've used it on a couple of jobs when a proper cinema camera is too much, or the budget is too tight. I never experienced overheating issues or any other hassles that stopped the show. On the contrary, the SL2-S is as reliable as it gets. 

AF is not worth mentioning, especially since Leica's AF-C is particularly poor. Because racking focus is part of the craft, AF is, for me, a non-issue. YMMV. There are other mirrorless cameras with better specs, but none of them comes even close to the Leica's colour. But as they say, colour is subjective.

Would I repurchase the SL2-S for its video capabilities? Yes. 

[Chris W]

Leica has never been known for film making.

A MUCH better system for film is the Sigma Fp (L mount), or stick with easier systems like Sony or Panasonic

[BernardC]

3 minutes ago, Chris W said:

Leica has never been known for film making.

They are a top-tier supplier of cinema lenses, and have been for at least 40 years (via Panavision).

I have a fp for video work, but there's nothing really wrong with the SL series, especially for smaller projects. I especially love how the SL lets you shoot video with M lenses, without any colour or corner sharpness issues.

Bigger (collaborative, multi-camera) projects will benefit from a larger ecosystem, as you will find with Panasonic and Canon products. Sony does that too, to a lesser extent. They usually have incompatibilities between their professional video cameras and their consumer lineup.

To answer the original questions:

Overheating isn't a common issue. I assume that people would complain if it was.

You may run into power issues. A USB-PD power brick will help with that.

You'll need to check Leica's site for the latest supported frame rates and formats. It changed with the recent introduction or ProRes RAW (and soon BMRaw), and maybe it also changed with the recent firmware update. You might want to ask Leica's customer support email as well, the web site isn't always up-to date.

[matted]

Not much else to be said as other covered the video capabilities well above. I would like to add that if audio is a big consideration for you the SL2-S is pretty lackluster (limited to 16 bit internally IIRC, and no good XLR adaptor); you would be best off using an external recorder or using a system that has native XLR accessories and higher bit recording. 

[jonnyboy]

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Great inputs.

Another interesting point I have to ask is low light, the 'internet' claims all these amazing capabilities in low light. Do you actually get a usable video at ISO12000? 

Just to understand how it would compare to Sony...

[Chris W]

49 minutes ago, BernardC said:

They are a top-tier supplier of cinema lenses, and have been for at least 40 years (via Panavision).

 

Sure, but I've never heard the often mentioned photographic 'Leica look' attributed to anything in film or video. That's what I meant.

I use my M lenses on there FP without issue. 

 

 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[Chris W]

27 minutes ago, jonnyboy said:

Another interesting point I have to ask is low light, the 'internet' claims all these amazing capabilities in low light. Do you actually get a usable video at ISO12000? 

 

Low light for me is ISO 1250. 

[BernardC]

17 minutes ago, Chris W said:

I use my M lenses on there FP without issue.

I've had issues with some M lenses, notably the pre-Asph 21/2.8 which is soft in the corners even in Super-35 (APS-C) with the fp. No such issues with Leica's cameras. That's unfortunate for me because my main range for Super-35 is between 16mm and 25mm. I have a Sigma 14-24 which covers that range, but I don't like it as much. It's sharp, but it's also hard to filter, huge, and has poor focus feel.

[BernardC]

38 minutes ago, Chris W said:

I've never heard the often mentioned photographic 'Leica look' attributed to anything in film or video.

The Leica look is a thing in video too. That's why R lenses are so expensive on the used market, they are hugely popular for video.

[Chris W]

There isn't a historic Leica movie look people are chasing. The R lenses are high quality, have character and are relatively cheap.

Lower budget film makers have trawled through many different vintage lens lines from Contax to Pentax and discovered how good and affordable Leica R lenses are.

I have a set of Pentax Takumar.

The widest M lens I use on my FP is 35mm. I have the Sigma 23mm.

 

[Kdnwg]

I posted quite a few SL2-S videos filmed with R lenses on YouTube. 
 

This is one of the examples with R 50mm F2.8 V1 (flares went crazy):

 

You can check out the other videos I shot including one with the iconic dream lens (Canon 50mm f0.95 LTM) and the only radioactive Leica lens (50mm f2) which is only possible on SL2-S with a M to L adapter. 
 

Without using external monitors to get 12bit RAW : these videos are native Leica colour without colour grading. I don’t know if that’s the colours you are referring to as Leica but to me I didn’t think they are that special (vs photography which is amazingly Leica!). Sure it pleases the eye without touch up but professional film makers prefers raw and colour grading. SL2-S does not have the cinematic look. 
 

As such, I actually prefer to shoot video on my BMPCC 6K pro. SL2S is an accessory to compliment my R lenses. I use it more for photos and perhaps ad hoc filming eg private  family events where I don’t have to bring my 4kg rigged up BMPCC. Their image stabilisation sucks for some focal R primes like 19mm ROM. I rather throw in a gimbal or switch the stabilisation off for some handheld artefacts. 
 

One thing I want to add that hasn’t been touched above is that I think SL2S is the best camera you can get FROM Leica which offers another dimension by added video capability to lenses like LTM / M. It is designed FOR non-SL lenses. It stores a table of all the R/M lenses and if you have ROM versions it will automatically recognise it. This is important for the image stabilisation and other calculations in both stills and video. It will be amazing to shoot a professional video off a M 50mm f0.95 ASPH with a Leica sensor : a video which has never been uploaded before from my research on YouTube up to this point. Imagine how much you can charge in production value while everyone is swinging R lenses on other bodies (most expensive is only 19mm f2.8). 
 

kdnwg 

[Slender]

On 6/3/2022 at 6:25 PM, Kdnwg said:

Without using external monitors to get 12bit RAW : these videos are native Leica colour without colour grading. I don’t know if that’s the colours you are referring to as Leica but to me I didn’t think they are that special (vs photography which is amazingly Leica!). Sure it pleases the eye without touch up but professional film makers prefers raw and colour grading. SL2-S does not have the cinematic look.

What a strange post I must say....

Why would you make a statement on Leica colors for video if not shooting in Log? It looks like you shot this with the lesser MP4 OOC, with god knows weird Leica Jpeg profile (Standard, Vivid, Natural, with or without iDR active, and if so to which setting?) also the shutter speed and stab look all over the place.

Would you seriously say this doesnt look good enough: thats the internal 10 bit log before any FW update

 

 

[Slender]

In other news for video:

https://www.8sinn.com/8sinn-cage-for-leica-sl2-sl2-s.html

 

Finally some democracy

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[hansvons]

On 6/3/2022 at 7:25 PM, Kdnwg said:

SL2-S does not have the cinematic look. 

But what is cinematic? Until recently (2009), all cinema films were shot on negative and ended up on positive film, and from there on telly. In the 90ies and up to 2009, I shot all my TV commercials on 35mm (that's supposed to be the cinematic stuff), and some of them ended up in the cinema. Back then, there was no term such as cinematic. You either shot video or film. And that WAS a big difference (not so much today). When people use the term cinematic today, I think they see deep juicy shadows, desaturated white roll-off and film-like skin tones. Today, the Alexa is closest to that ideal. Using interesting vintage glass adds to that. I shot back then mostly on Zeiss Super Speeds. Nice flares, colder skin tones, a tendency to magenta when shot wide open, even on Kodak. I sold the set in 2019. 

To my eyes, L-log on the SL2/S delivers in Rec2020 (that's its native colour space) juicy shadows, desaturated white roll-off and film-like skin tones. But hey, we are all different. And if you don't see any potential in the SL2-S other than family stuff, I'm fine. It's your stuff and not mine. But be careful with absolute statements like the above.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[Slender]

On 6/3/2022 at 6:25 PM, Kdnwg said:

M 50mm f0.95 ASPH with a Leica sensor : a video which has never been uploaded before from my research on YouTube up to this point.

You haven't looked to the right place:

 

 

Edited June 6, 2022 by Slender

[Slender]

and on the older SL601

 

 

[hansvons]

5 hours ago, Slender said:

and on the older SL601

 

That's quite a piece. Thanks for sharing!

[jonnyboy]

I haven't heard anyone filming (professionally) and not shooting in LOG for a bunch of years now - I had a look at the S-Log from Leica and it looks pretty good to me. As posted above, those reference video from Leica commercials are pretty great!

I got thrown off by the fact it doesn't shoot in body 10bit when in slow mo (50fps)? Correct me if I'm wrong!? That is a bit disappointing...

I may have to swing by the Leica store and see if I can take it out for a spin....