List prices of Leica R6 in 1989

[hepcat]

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So, I was idly curious as to why I'd never bought an R camera new.   I decided to see if I could find the original list prices of my R6.2 in 1992.  I didn't, but I did find a Popular Photography article excerpt that showed that an R6 MSRP was $3150 in 1989 and a Summilux-R carried a list price of $2250.   Adjusted for inflation, that puts the R6 at $7344.30 today, and the Summilux at $5245.93 today.   As I was making about $26,000 in 1989 I know now why I never had one!    I'm enjoying them today, however.

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[MarkP]

Nikon F4 the same year was $2500

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[TomB_tx]

Leica prices really too a sudden jump in the early 1970s, after I had bought my M4 (& 3 lenses) and SL (& 3 lenses). When the M5 came out folks who had older Leicas really complained about the M5 price - but if they looked at the increased prices of the M4 (plus Leicameter) the M5 looked appropriate. But the Leica focus was on the R series then, and the lens prices made me uncomfortable.

For something more affordable I added a Pentax MX and several of the small M lenses, and used these as my carry-around system.  Not Leica quality, but better than I expected, and I really enjoyed the smaller size.

In the 1980s I splurged on an R4 (grey market due to cost), and in 1985 a legit M6 body. Then I got married and no new Leica equipment until after the kids were grown and I retired.

[hepcat]

Courtesy of an eBay listing by Pacific Rim Camera:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/362596238414

 

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Edited May 27, 2022 by hepcat

[hepcat]

 

From Popular Photography, 1989

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Edited May 27, 2022 by hepcat

[hepcat]

Continuing... 

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[adan]

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That price list is interesting, because by 2002 an M6 TTL was selling for $1995 - that is below the dealer cost in 1992. With a 10% discount on top of that ($1799) at Leica Day store events. (And Leica was going broke.)

Introduction of the Euro, other currency variations. I wonder what an R8/R9 was selling for ($US) in 2002?

[frame-it]

15 minutes ago, Artin said:

What is interesting for me the Noctilux M cost less then the 35 Summilux Asph a thousand dollar less

but isnt that the 35mm summilux Double A version?

[adan]

The 35mm Summilux-M ASPH was not introduced until 1994 (nor was the ASPH abbreviation).

So as the 1992 price list specifically says, this was the original "ASPHERICAL" that used two hand-ground aspheric surfaces, with a high failure rate (melt it down and start over ).

Which was what drove Leica to invest a lot of R&D money (in partnership with Hoya) in the molded-ASPH technology.

https://www.leicashop.com/classic/Leica-Summilux-M-11873-1-4-35mm-ASPHERICAL/33104-2

Leica pushes the envelope, but occasionally ends up with "non-economic" lenses: original 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux (also hand-ground double-aspherical), the 35 Summilux-M Double-A, and in the R world (to get back on topic), the 35-70 f/2.8 Vario-Elmarit-R ASPH (1998), with only 150 or 300 or 1775 made (depending on source).

[Archiver]

As an aside, a Leica M9 cost about AUD $9400 in 2010, which is around AUD $11,400 in today's currency. In comparison, the Canon 1D Mark IV of 2010 retailed for $7299, which shows the difference between the flagship pro Canon body and Leica's then-latest rangefinder. Today, the M11 retails for AUD $14,499, and the Canon R3 flagship mirrorless pro body costs $8600.

I wonder when secondhand R lens prices were at their lowest. Not that it matters, but I'm wondering when the introduction of mirrorless cameras made them more desirable again.

 

[hepcat]

9 hours ago, Archiver said:

I wonder when secondhand R lens prices were at their lowest. Not that it matters, but I'm wondering when the introduction of mirrorless cameras made them more desirable again.

 

I started buying and selling used 1970s-1990s film bodies early in 2019 when they were all dirt cheap, plentiful, and there was really just starting to be a rennaisance in the film camera market.   I was buying and selling mostly Pentax, Nikon, and Konica because they could be bought in large kit lots cheaply and parted out for resale.  R lenses and bodies were still more expensive to buy than the Japanese brands, and tended not to be sold as lots,  so I didn't pay a lot of attention to them because there wasn't the profit to be had,  but the R lenses were probably about as inexpensive in 2018-2019 as you could find because Leicaflex and Leica R bodies were the only cameras they'd work on (well, besides M bodies of course.)   Sometime in 2021 the early mirrorless cine market discovered them.  By sometime earlier this year the prices for run-of-the-mill R lens prices seem to have doubled, and continue to climb.  I bought my current Leicaflex/Leica R kit with six, two-cam lenses for $3k in early March of this year.  Prices have continued to rise for R glass while availability has dropped.  I'd guess that all the mirrorless cameras being sold have contributed greatly to both the rising prices and the pending scarcity.  What's interesting is that with the rise in the prices sellers are demanding for R glass, camera body prices are coming down because of the glut of used bodies available, and the rising cost of the lenses that are being sold without bodies.

For example, I recently bought an SL2 for $199 (it needed an overhaul) and an R5 from KEH in Atlanta for $207.   Now those may be outliers in pricing, but still, that's pretty remarkable. 

[hepcat]

The 1994 Price List, once again courtesy of Pacific Rim Camera on eBay:  https://www.ebay.com/itm/143187125216

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[cpclee]

i bought the r6.2 new at the end of 2000 for around $1700. i think it was discounted from a street price of $2000 or slightly higher.  a year before that i bought a M6 TTL new at a price higher than that but don’t remember by how much. the 50 Summicrom was sold for about $850. that’s about all i can remember 

Edited November 20, 2022 by cpclee

[cpclee]

what i remember better is in 1999, the contax 645 was $3999 and lenses were about 2000-2500 each.

[hepcat]

7 hours ago, cpclee said:

what i remember better is in 1999, the contax 645 was $3999 and lenses were about 2000-2500 each.

What makes these used cameras an even better buy today is the currency value conversion.  $3,999 in 1999 is worth $7,153.36 today.

My $207 R5 was $3200 new... or $6,434.81 today...  and that makes the $207 I paid in today's dollars would have been worth $102.94 in 1994.

Amazing.

[Pyrogallol]

In 1972 I had to decide between a used Leica M3 with 50mm Summicron or a new Nikkormat with 50mm lens, both cost £150 each. I picked the Leica.

[andrew01]

On 11/20/2022 at 6:27 PM, Pyrogallol said:

In 1972 I had to decide between a used Leica M3 with 50mm Summicron or a new Nikkormat with 50mm lens, both cost £150 each. I picked the Leica.

Good choice from an investment standpoint!  The Nikkormat is still worth £150 in todays money, but the Leica with lens would be worth about £2.5k. No disrespect to the Nikkormat, these are great cameras and a bargain at the current prices. They are better cameras than the more popular FM series IMO.

£150 was a lot of money in those days. Correct me if I am wrong but I think the cost of a VW beetle then was circa £300?

 

 

Edited November 27, 2022 by andrew01

[hepcat]

2 hours ago, andrew01 said:

Good choice from an investment standpoint!  The Nikkormat is still worth £150 in todays money, but the Leica with lens would be worth about £2.5k. No disrespect to the Nikkormat, these are great cameras and a bargain at the current prices. They are better cameras than the more popular FM series IMO.

£150 was a lot of money in those days. Correct me if I am wrong but I think the cost of a VW beetle then was circa £300?
 

I don't know what the value of the GBP was against the dollar in 1972, but a Beetle's sticker price in the US was $1999.00 IIRC.    I weighed buying a 1974 VW Thing with a sticker of $3150 vs a Dodge Duster at the same price.

Edited November 27, 2022 by hepcat