Flat scanner / negative holder for making contact sheets ?

[grahamc]

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19 minutes ago, johnwolf said:

Hope It didn't sound like I was challenging your solution. I wasn't. I think the main thing is to be organized and systematic about managing our film assets, especially as rolls multiply. 

I view my contact sheets as a long term catalog and often go back to old ones and see things anew. Really enjoy that process. To be able to quickly cross-reference the LR file and the negative sheet is important to me. But that's probably another thread topic.

John

 

Thanks John, no that's OK I didn't read it that way at all 

Yes that's good advice I need to ensure that the lightroom file corresponds to how I name/file the physical Negs. 

I'm not really worried about where to put the contact sheets in Lightroom.  Usually, I create a LR folder for every shoot.  And certainly with rolls back from my lab every roll has it's own folder containing only those 36 images.  

So I don't think that will change - the contact sheet (considering we have determined that 'sheet' is more likely going to be at least 2 images, each containing a grid of multiple negs - say 18) can go in it's own folder.  hopefully to later be joined by higher-res scans of chosen/edited images from the same roll (presuming there are keepers that warrant a higher quality single scan and edit) .

I'll have to put a unique identifier in the LR folder name that corresponds to my numbering system on the archiving of physical Negative rolls.   

Will take some discipline.  

I'm only 20 rolls into my home-developing journey so perfect time to get organised from the outset.    I'm not known for my dedication to admin systems but let's see! ! 

Edited May 19, 2022 by grahamc

[250swb]

The 'traditional' way  is to think of it like your actual physical negative folder, you number, notate, and date each negative sheet with a pen ( I also note film, developer, times etc.). So create a folder with a sequential number, abbreviated description, and date. Upload your contact sheet there. Then within this folder create a sub folder called maybe 'full res scans' and keep the file numbers the same because those will be .TIFF and not JEPG as in the contact sheet. You then make a final folder called maybe 'edit' where you work on your final scans on until you are happy and save the file with the original file name but with a suffix, so maybe 'file name-version 1' , change something and call it 'version 2', etc. 

So your contact sheet and full res scan and edited scans are all contained within the master folder in a known place on your hard drive. And you can then create another sub folder that includes different size files, again keeping the root name the same but with a suffix. To call up your contact sheets and edited scans use Adobe Bridge and if you need to add tags for quick reference you can do that by using Adobe Bridge. 

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[johnwolf]

5 hours ago, grahamc said:

Thanks John, no that's OK I didn't read it that way at all 

Yes that's good advice I need to ensure that the lightroom file corresponds to how I name/file the physical Negs. 

I'm not really worried about where to put the contact sheets in Lightroom.  Usually, I create a LR folder for every shoot.  And certainly with rolls back from my lab every roll has it's own folder containing only those 36 images.  

So I don't think that will change - the contact sheet (considering we have determined that 'sheet' is more likely going to be at least 2 images, each containing a grid of multiple negs - say 18) can go in it's own folder.  hopefully to later be joined by higher-res scans of chosen/edited images from the same roll (presuming there are keepers that warrant a higher quality single scan and edit) .

I'll have to put a unique identifier in the LR folder name that corresponds to my numbering system on the archiving of physical Negative rolls.   

Will take some discipline.  

I'm only 20 rolls into my home-developing journey so perfect time to get organised from the outset.    I'm not known for my dedication to admin systems but let's see! ! 

I name my contact sheet files by date developed in the format YYYYMMDD. I store them in LR folderr for each year, with the folders sorted filename descending so they are ordered last first. I use the same filename on the plastic sheets so it's easy to cross reference. I keep the sheets in a binder with year dividers. Pretty simple.  

For scanned image filenames, I use the contact sheet filename prefix with negative number suffix; for example 20220429_03.  

Love to hear what others do....  LR keywords would be good, but I never get around to it.

Recently I started opening the contact sheets in Photoshop and typing basic info. Takes a minute but I like the neater look. FWIW, here's an example: 

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited May 19, 2022 by johnwolf

[grahamc]

11 hours ago, 250swb said:

The 'traditional' way  is to think of it like your actual physical negative folder, you number, notate, and date each negative sheet with a pen ( I also note film, developer, times etc.). So create a folder with a sequential number, abbreviated description, and date. Upload your contact sheet there. Then within this folder create a sub folder called maybe 'full res scans' and keep the file numbers the same because those will be .TIFF and not JEPG as in the contact sheet. You then make a final folder called maybe 'edit' where you work on your final scans on until you are happy and save the file with the original file name but with a suffix, so maybe 'file name-version 1' , change something and call it 'version 2', etc. 

So your contact sheet and full res scan and edited scans are all contained within the master folder in a known place on your hard drive. And you can then create another sub folder that includes different size files, again keeping the root name the same but with a suffix. To call up your contact sheets and edited scans use Adobe Bridge and if you need to add tags for quick reference you can do that by using Adobe Bridge. 

Thanks.  I was thinking something similar to this however the 'folders' are in Lightroom (which marries up to a folder on the hard-drive anyway, so same thing).  Lightroom edits are non-destructive so once you have a large file Hi-res scan you can save 'snapshots' (i.e. edit versions) but there is still only one master copy which sits on the file structure.  Other than that part I plan to do exactly as you've suggested and the name of the folder can marry up with the older name in the LR catalogue .

I tend to then use LR Keywords for lenses / film stock etc but I'm not as dedicated with it as I should be, I've also been thinking of using one of the plug ins that let's you write lens types into the EXIF data for either uncoded lenses you've shot on Digital , or of course film photos where there is no settings-related EXIF from taking the original photograph. 

[grahamc]

11 hours ago, johnwolf said:

I name my contact sheet files by date developed in the format YYYYMMDD. I store them in LR folderr for each year, with the folders sorted filename descending so they are ordered last first. I use the same filename on the plastic sheets so it's easy to cross reference. I keep the sheets in a binder with year dividers. Pretty simple.  

For scanned image filenames, I use the contact sheet filename prefix with negative number suffix; for example 20220429_03.  

Love to hear what others do....  LR keywords would be good, but I never get around to it.

Recently I started opening the contact sheets in Photoshop and typing basic info. Takes a minute but I like the neater look. FWIW, here's an example: 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

I plan to do similar - My naming convention is the same as yours (either for a folder of a digital shoot or outing) and also for rolls of film back from the lab.  For example YYYYMMDD_Bondi Beach Shoot.   And then they live under within. folder for that year.

The physical negs could just have the same pre-fix, it would be easy enough to find the negs even if there was 3 rolls from the same date 9I wouldn't be bothered to write "Bondi Beach Shoot' on physical the neg storage sheet I'm sure).     I could ditch the descriptor and just call them YYYYMMDD_001 and so on but I find having a descriptor in the folder title is handy and they still appear in LR sequentially.  As do the photos as as I have a rule set up that imports them with MySurname_YYYYMMDD_sequential image number . 

I find this works well, the only thing to add is the film stock, dev time, lenses etc etc which I currently do by Keywords but should really integrate something that manipulates the EXIF data so that tis info sits in the correct area eg lens Type, Camera, etc .   

For now I just note this in the folder name or keywords until I get around to finding an EXIF plug-in that works for me, at which point I plan to tidy it all up.  

So for now, typically for scanned images my Folder name will include Film Stock and what I rated the roll at (eg YYYYMMDD_Bondi Beach Shoot_Tri-X400_320), and then my key word will note the camera and lens used.  

Like so (obviously needs tidying up a little to be more consistent but quite easy to find things):

I don't see this use of contact sheets would really change anything there would just be a contact sheet in each folder aswell as the images.  in some cases if the roll was a dud there may just be a contact sheet.  Until such time as I discover in the future that the dud roll was in fact the work of a genius 😂

Edited May 20, 2022 by grahamc

[grahamc]

11 minutes ago, grahamc said:

I plan to do similar - My naming convention is the same as yours (either for a folder of a digital shoot or outing) and also for rolls of film back from the lab.  For example YYYYMMDD_Bondi Beach Shoot.   And then they live under within. folder for that year.

etc etc 

Quoting myself here but Steve @250swb have you ever used LR or did you not like it ?  Because all of these folders map onto a folder structure on the hard-drive as I'm sure you know, so not too different from what you explained apart from the user interface is LR  .   

Edited May 20, 2022 by grahamc

[250swb]

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57 minutes ago, grahamc said:

Quoting myself here but Steve @250swb have you ever used LR or did you not like it ?  Because all of these folders map onto a folder structure on the hard-drive as I'm sure you know, so not too different from what you explained apart from the user interface is LR  .   

I don't like Lightroom. I started filing negatives over forty years ago and the basic structure was simply transferred when I started to use Photoshop and storing scans onto hard drives. Later when Lightroom was released it wasn't what it is today, it was very much sold to busy photographers adopting digital cameras for the first time and needing an idiot proof system that didn't loose images in the bowels of their PC or allow them to overwrite files in their race for productivity. It was designed for millennials whose war cry was/is 'I haven't got the time'. So I tried Lightroom and found it limited in it's editing facilities, and also pointless because I knew where all my pictures are anyway, so kept on using Photoshop and Bridge. Over the years Lightroom has evolved and it far exceeds its original form, but its nannying about 'non-destructive editing' and such like is still irritating, almost like photographers have no common sense and need saving from themselves. I do think that if the photographer is super busy, sending images as they happen on location, downloading wedding pictures, etc. Lightroom still fits the original brief very well.

[grahamc]

48 minutes ago, 250swb said:

I don't like Lightroom. I started filing negatives over forty years ago and the basic structure was simply transferred when I started to use Photoshop and storing scans onto hard drives. Later when Lightroom was released it wasn't what it is today, it was very much sold to busy photographers adopting digital cameras for the first time and needing an idiot proof system that didn't loose images in the bowels of their PC or allow them to overwrite files in their race for productivity. It was designed for millennials whose war cry was/is 'I haven't got the time'. So I tried Lightroom and found it limited in it's editing facilities, and also pointless because I knew where all my pictures are anyway, so kept on using Photoshop and Bridge. Over the years Lightroom has evolved and it far exceeds its original form, but its nannying about 'non-destructive editing' and such like is still irritating, almost like photographers have no common sense and need saving from themselves. I do think that if the photographer is super busy, sending images as they happen on location, downloading wedding pictures, etc. Lightroom still fits the original brief very well.

Fair comment.  I also think it loses some of the convenience when I ross edit with Photoshop because then I end up with multiple Giles pertaining to the same image, which I'm still trying to get my head around - presumably the one from photoshop joins the 'non-destructed' one in the hard-drive file hierarchy.  Which kind of defeats the purpose, or at least adds some complication.  but over-all I do find it works quite well .  I can see that transferring a previously well-organised and extensive folder structure into LR would be un-necessary though, not to mention a pain 

Edited May 20, 2022 by grahamc

[grahamc]

By the way the v850 arrived so I've been watching a couple of YouTube on using the Epson software for either these 'contact sheets' or batch scans.

Looks remarkably easy for bulk scanning . 

For the final hi-res scans for editing purposes of 'keepers' .... Are we sure the Plustek is going to deliver the better quality individual 35mm scans ?  

I hope a complete migration to the v850 isn't on the cards here as I only just bought the Plustek !  

I'm sure some playing around will answer these Q's but I'm going to be a little too busy this weekend to get my teeth into it properly unfortunately.  

 

 

Edited May 20, 2022 by grahamc

[250swb]

2 hours ago, grahamc said:

By the way the v850 arrived so I've been watching a couple of YouTube on using the Epson software for either these 'contact sheets' or batch scans.

Looks remarkably easy for bulk scanning . 

For the final hi-res scans for editing purposes of 'keepers' .... Are we sure the Plustek is going to deliver the better quality individual 35mm scans ?  

I hope a complete migration to the v850 isn't on the cards here as I only just bought the Plustek !  

I'm sure some playing around will answer these Q's but I'm going to be a little too busy this weekend to get my teeth into it properly unfortunately.  

 

 

I think the Plustek is the way to go for 35mm, anything larger and the Epson definitely, but try a comparison. To my mind it's a little bit like printing a 35mm negative using a cold cathode enlarger head, the light source is soft and diffused which doesn't often suit the grain and contrast of a 35mm negative, and likewise with the V850 it's a diffuse light source. The Plustek should also have more DR and do a higher resolution without interpolation.

[Aryel]

4 hours ago, grahamc said:

Are we sure the Plustek is going to deliver the better quality individual 35mm scans ?

Best is to try. Maybe I am lousy but I definitely miss my plustek and regret selling it away… 

in a nutshell my impression is that the Epson lacks details in the shadows and recquire more sharpening. I haven’t compared side by side though. 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Aryel