Oscar Barnack's very own Leica 0-Series no.105 from the Leitz Museum in Wetzlar is being auctioned

[zeitz]

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1 hour ago, mmx_2 said:

This belongs in a museum

I have stated before my contempt for museums by calling them mausoleums.  The two largest camera collections in the world, the Smithsonian in Washington DC and George Eastman House in Rochester NY, have almost none of their vast collections on display for anyone's viewing.  Please refer to the last scene of Indiana Jones "The Raiders of the Lost Ark" where there is a vast warehouse, full of boxes with unknown contents.  Even the Charles Messer Leica collection at Miami University in Oxford OH has only about 10% of the objects on display.  Online virtual exhibits are of little value.

https://www.miamioh.edu/cca/art-museum/collections/leica-camera-collection/index.html

 

[pippy]

1 hour ago, luigi bertolotti said:

Correct, but value for collecting is driven by cultural importance AND rarity - uniqueness... there are hundreds of Stradivarius and Picasso's... much more than 0-series , and just one, or two...belonged to Barnack...

Nowhere in my post, Luigi, did I mention - nor make any reference to - "value for collecting" but I agree completely that the cameras in question - #105 and #112 - occupy a special niche in the history of 35mm photography and it follows that their peerless provenance will add to their perceived value for those with an interest in such matters.

Going slightly off-topic for a moment but as far as 'uniqueness' is concerned; whilst it is true that, taken in their individual groups (violins; violas; cellos etc.), there are a great many Stradivari instruments kicking around I (FWIW) would consider each of them to be a unique piece in its own right. Similarly whilst there are hundreds of Picasso's oil paintings lying about each, obviously, is a unique work.

Philip.

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[Matlock]

1 hour ago, zeitz said:

I have stated before my contempt for museums by calling them mausoleums.  The two largest camera collections in the world, the Smithsonian in Washington DC and George Eastman House in Rochester NY, have almost none of their vast collections on display for anyone's viewing.  Please refer to the last scene of Indiana Jones "The Raiders of the Lost Ark" where there is a vast warehouse, full of boxes with unknown contents.  Even the Charles Messer Leica collection at Miami University in Oxford OH has only about 10% of the objects on display.  Online virtual exhibits are of little value.

https://www.miamioh.edu/cca/art-museum/collections/leica-camera-collection/index.html

 

An interesting observation but what do you suggest is done? There is only so much room to display the millions of collections throughout the world.

[pedaes]

1 hour ago, zeitz said:

 Even the Charles Messer Leica collection at Miami University in Oxford OH

It is my understanding the most interesting piece, Serie O #114, is on display. A serious number of the pieces in the Leica Museum are loaned by an American collector, and I guess few of us would see them if they were not displayed there.

[luigi bertolotti]

2 hours ago, pippy said:

 

Going slightly off-topic for a moment but as far as 'uniqueness' is concerned; whilst it is true that, taken in their individual groups (violins; violas; cellos etc.), there are a great many Stradivari instruments kicking around I (FWIW) ...

Philip.

...and violas can go also for good money... and not only from Stradivari 😁 https://amati.com/maker/bertolotti-gaspar  

Edited April 27, 2022 by luigi bertolotti

[pippy]

1 hour ago, luigi bertolotti said:

...and violas can go also for good money... and not only from Stradivari...

There was a discussion over on a different forum a while back comparing differences between Amati, Guarneri and Stradivari violins. A link was posted where several of the world's top violinists, chatting about such things, agreed that the early Amati instruments, generally speaking, had slightly sweeter tones than did the later violins made by both Guarneri and Stradivari but the latter benefitted from improvements in design and construction which gave them greater volume. This was significant as the trend at that time was for concert-halls to become larger and larger and the players of the day considered 'Volume = Good'!...

Philip.

Edited April 27, 2022 by pippy

[jaapv]

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22 hours ago, willeica said:

Now back to the serious stuff, my article is here, at last:

https://www.macfilos.com/2022/04/26/oskar-one-zero-five-comes-in-loud-and-clear/#comment-52583

Any comments on my editor's concerns about the meaning of 'R' in German would be appreciated.

William 

I'm sorry, bur "Rückwand" means "back wall".  It is more likely that "R" means "Rückwärts" which means "reverse"  or “backwards “ Rückspülen“ „rewind“ is about equal; I doubt whether anybody wasted any thoughts on the difference at the time. 

[willeica]

15 minutes ago, jaapv said:

I'm sorry, bur "Rückwand" means "back wall".  It is more likely that "R" means "Rückwärts" which means "reverse"  or “backwards “ 

Also Sprach Lars Netopil

Z  Zeitaufnahme  (B)

M Momentaufnahme  (regular speeds) 

R Rückwicklung   (rewind) 

That settles it then.

 

3 hours ago, pedaes said:

It is my understanding the most interesting piece, Serie O #114, is on display. A serious number of the pieces in the Leica Museum are loaned by an American collector, and I guess few of us would see them if they were not displayed there.

Keith, this was the only 0 Series on display in the Museum on the day of the opening. I will find out about where 114 is now. 104 is in a bank vault in Europe and 105, the property of an American collector, is on its way to auction. 116 and 122 were sold at auction and are in private hands.

5 hours ago, zeitz said:

I have stated before my contempt for museums by calling them mausoleums.  The two largest camera collections in the world, the Smithsonian in Washington DC and George Eastman House in Rochester NY, have almost none of their vast collections on display for anyone's viewing.  Please refer to the last scene of Indiana Jones "The Raiders of the Lost Ark" where there is a vast warehouse, full of boxes with unknown contents.  Even the Charles Messer Leica collection at Miami University in Oxford OH has only about 10% of the objects on display.  Online virtual exhibits are of little value.

https://www.miamioh.edu/cca/art-museum/collections/leica-camera-collection/index.html

 

This doesn't just apply to old Leicas. Our National Photography Archive has over 5 million photographs, but only about 60,000 are viewable online. 

Somebody asked about slit widths. There is a 50mm setting clearly visible on the dial. This may just be the width as it travels across and, of course, a cap is necessary when winding. I have never been less than about two feet away from an original 0 Series, but I will ask some people who have handled one and report back here.

William 

[pedaes]

Nice Article William!

Edited April 27, 2022 by pedaes

[pedaes]

1 hour ago, willeica said:

I will find out about where 114 is now.

William. I was responding to the Post about the Messer Collection at Miami University which is where #114 is. A LHSA friend has had it extensively photographed by the University under the direction of Lars N for authentication (it is genuine). Jim L will be very familiar with the Messer story - basically he built the University, took up photography but couldn''t hack it so took up collecting and later gifted his collection to the University's Art Collection.

[zeitz]

2 minutes ago, pedaes said:

he built the University

Messer was an architect and general contractor in Western Ohio whose company built many of the buildings at Miami University.  He used some of his earnings to buy Leicas and then donated then donated the collection to the University.

[zeitz]

5 hours ago, Matlock said:

An interesting observation but what do you suggest is done?

In the case of the Smithsonian the answer is simple once you can answer these questions:  why are the Smithsonian Museums only in Washington, DC; why do museum buildings have to be architectural edifices, built at great expense; why are elaborate interpretive displays required; why do the Smithsonian Museums have to have free admissions?

Every medium to large city in the US should have branches of the Smithsonian.  The material displayed should be suited to the history of the city; so the camera collection would be in Rochester, NY.  Aircraft exhibits could be in St Louis, MO.  Farming equipment could be in Omaha, NB.  etc.  There are many empty and unused commercial spaces in the US that are lots of floor space and have large parking lots.  They would be excellent buildings where the contents are more important than the building.  And finally a small admission should be charged, maybe $5.  People drive $50,000 SUVs to Washington DC, spend over $300 per night in hotels, and eat at $50 a plate restaurants.  But when they want to go in a museum, they whine if they have to pay an entry fee.

[zeitz]

3 hours ago, luigi bertolotti said:

and not only from Stradivari

The only Stradivari instruments I have seen were in the Henry Ford Museum in Dearborn, MI, and in the Smithsonian in Washington, DC.  The last few times I was at the Smithsonian Museum of Science and Industry I could not find the stringed instruments.  I suspect they are no longer on display.  The tragedy for musical instruments is that they need to be played.  A local violin store once asked me to come in occasionally and play their violins just to exercise them.

My last violin teacher was Gerald Fischbach.  At the time he was a young man teaching violin at Webster University in Webster Groves, MO.  He had a Bergunzi violin made in Cremona and at about the same period as Stradivari.  He bought the violin, assisted by a grant from the National Endowment for the Arts, for $200,000 in the mid-1960s.  In today's dollars that is $1,652,321.  If my violin was out of tune when my lesson started, he would let me play the Bergunzi while he tuned my violin.  Needless to say my violin was always out of tune when I came in.  The sound of the Bergunzi was angelic.

[willeica]

51 minutes ago, pedaes said:

William. I was responding to the Post about the Messer Collection at Miami University which is where #114 is. A LHSA friend has had it extensively photographed by the University under the direction of Lars N for authentication (it is genuine). Jim L will be very familiar with the Messer story - basically he built the University, took up photography but couldn''t hack it so took up collecting and later gifted his collection to the University's Art Collection.

Thanks Keith. I had heard about that one. I may try to do a list of  known locations of 0 Series cameras, though. 

William 

[NigelG]

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Edited April 27, 2022 by NigelG
deleted

[NigelG]

Deleted post

Thanks for the interesting post. 

[Matlock]

11 hours ago, zeitz said:

" why do museum buildings have to be architectural edifices, built at great expense; why are elaborate interpretive displays required; why do the Smithsonian Museums have to have free admissions?

And finally a small admission should be charged, maybe $5.  People drive $50,000 SUVs to Washington DC, spend over $300 per night in hotels, and eat at $50 a plate restaurants.  But when they want to go in a museum, they whine if they have to pay an entry fee."

Your first point is largely about the history of museums in general. As far as charging is concerned, when charging was introduced in the UK visits to museums slumped to almost nil. A combination of charged specialist exhibitions and museum shop sales has seen attendance return, and  indeed increase since free admission was reintroduced.

[wizard]

vor 15 Stunden schrieb willeica:

R Rückwicklung   (rewind) 

William, while you may trust Lars more than me, as he is a well-known Leica expert, I am an engineer (which Lars isn't) and have been using Leica cameras and other cameras since 1973. Many cameras, instead of the lever found on many Leica cameras, have a knob which must be pressed to disengage the film winding sprocket in order to be able to rewind the film. That knob in German is called 'Rückspulknopf' (rewind knob). I have never ever heard nor read that this knob is referred to as a 'Rückwicklungsknopf'.

Moreover, the film in its canister sits on a spool, and the German word for spool is 'Spule'. That is why 'R' stands for 'Rückspulung' or 'Rückspulen'. The term Lars has proposed is not technically incorrect, but to the best of my knowledge is not the term which is commonly used in the camera industry. I'd be interested to see a document in which the rewind operation is referred to as 'Rückwicklung'.

[willeica]

1 hour ago, wizard said:

William, while you may trust Lars more than me, as he is a well-known Leica expert, I am an engineer (which Lars isn't) and have been using Leica cameras and other cameras since 1973. Many cameras, instead of the lever found on many Leica cameras, have a knob which must be pressed to disengage the film winding sprocket in order to be able to rewind the film. That knob in German is called 'Rückspulknopf' (rewind knob). I have never ever heard nor read that this knob is referred to as a 'Rückwicklungsknopf'.

Moreover, the film in its canister sits on a spool, and the German word for spool is 'Spule'. That is why 'R' stands for 'Rückspulung' or 'Rückspulen'. The term Lars has proposed is not technically incorrect, but to the best of my knowledge is not the term which is commonly used in the camera industry. I'd be interested to see a document in which the rewind operation is referred to as 'Rückwicklung'.

I often say to myself that I should have learnt some German to go with my interest in Leicas and other German vintage cameras. This point only arose because my editor, Mike Evans, who can speak some German, had started to become concerned about this. For me it was and is a side issue as the article is largely concerned with an important historical camera and an upcoming auction and we all know what the ‘R’ means in our own languages. Your words are, in fact, close to what Mike Evans suggested to me before publication. These words also came from a German speaking writer on cameras. In the article I was, of course, quoting what Jim Lager had said 30 years ago. I’m not going to bother Jim or Lars about this. 

I’ll leave it at that 

William 

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Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[nf3996]

A fascinating camera, and well out of my price range!

My two penn'orth on the 'R' debate: Section 2 of the German text in the small credit-card size instruction leaflet for the 0-Series replica refers to a 'Ruckspulknopf'. And German-language instructions for at least some early Leicas refer to a 'Ruckwickelknopf'. Neither specifically states which the 'R' by the lever stands for.

Alan