90mm f/4 Macro-Elmar-M --- getting to 1:1 repro

[Winedemonium]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I'm wondering if I can get this lens to a 1:1 repro on my M10-R and M10-M for negative scanning on a Negative Supply copy stand / light source / negative holder set up.

My copy is the older type with the Macro Adaptor-M goggles (14409) and finder. Those goggles extend the repro from 1:6:7 to 1:3.

There is also the newer type Macro Adaptor M (14652), and with that repro is 1:2.

There is also the Novoflex LEMVIS III - a series of stacked extension rings. I'm not sure how close that would get me, and whether the results would be good.

Has anyone tried the LEMVIS III with this lens in this way, or worked out another lens / adaptor / tube, etc set up?

 

[LocalHero1953]

In the spirit of the internet forum, that answers a question you haven't asked..............

You could switch to the Apo-Macro-Elmarit-R 100mm and ELPRO, which goes to 1:1 without having to stretch the design parameters. I use it on the SL2-S for negative scanning (from a tripod), but it should work on the M with the EVF or LCD.

[a.noctilux]

In my digital M scanning experiences, some observations :

- weird problems occured when I use focal length longer than 60mm

• a - with more rings to go full 1:1 - in 90mm ( more or less 90mm "long" rings), the set up is long and vibration prone
• b - with the Apo-Macro-Elmarit-R 2.8/100mm + Elpro 1.1:1,  quite good in nature, the best optical I have, the weight can be too much
• c - flare from the lighting device can be a problem to avoid with very long hood

- I've tried 50 to 60 mm lenses on Beoon (this device ) and the setup is more practical for me : compact and good enough as we can see grains of slow film,

no need of apo or macro lenses.

[Winedemonium]

27 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

You could switch to the Apo-Macro-Elmarit-R 100mm and ELPRO

Yes, thank you for that suggestion. It's on my list of options - a beautiful lens that I have used in the past. Yes, with the ELPRO designed for this lens, it would be 1:1 and a good solution. I don't currently own the R>M adaptor, the 2.8/100 or the ELPRO, so I'm checking to see first if some here have had experience with the 4/90 MEM + LEMVIS III (or other tube / extension setup). But your suggestion is a frontrunner behind that. Thank you. 

[Winedemonium]

2 minutes ago, a.noctilux said:

some observations

Thanks for these a.noctilux - I will take a look at that. Thanks for sharing your experiences. 

[a.noctilux]

Out of curiosity, I had no idea of the weight of A.M.E.R. 100 + Elpro.

Just weighted : the combo is 950g needing the R-M adapter 164g to put on M 😉.

[Winedemonium]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

12 minutes ago, a.noctilux said:

the combo is 950g needing the R-M adapter 164g to put on M 😉.

yes, not ideal for the m mount, a collar would be better. The 90mm MEM is so diminutive in comparison. But as you say, vibration may be an issue. 🤔

[a.noctilux]

Just in case, I use for repro my films/slides many enlarger lenses (the best I use is Focotar 4.5/50mm), some SLR lenses as Micro-Nikkor 3.5/55, Macro-SMC-Takumar 4/50, Macro-Zuiko 3.5/50, Makro-Planar S 60mm, Macro-Elmarit-R 60mm.

Some are very cheap but all are very good and easy to use with Beoon + right adapter to M.

[LocalHero1953]

Yes, the 100R is heavy. Mine came with a tripod foot, and this balances better than mounting from the body. I use a small Gitzo tripod inverted, with the combo slung from a ballhead on the centre column beneath the tripod apex. I have to take care with levelling, but it is fairly stable - I still use a 12s delayed release.

With this lens at maximum extension for 1:1 at or near minimum focus , the exact starting height of the lens is critical - a few mm either way and either it won't focus, or it is back at 1:2. I'm starting to yearn for a dedicated stand with rack adjustment!

[mmradman]

Consider SLR Macro Bellows with Slide copier and appropriate macro Lens, plus add required SLR-M adaptor and you are in business for a price less than of any of Leica M or R lenses mentioned above. 

It shouldn't be difficult to find suitable set on S/H market, specially if living in HK i would imagine, there is even Leica R bellows with 100mm R Macro Elmar (not as good as APO Elmarit R 100mm but not bad either).  Only problem as i see it i am not aware of Leica bellow compatible slide copier so may have to use light box with negative/slide on it. 

In it's time macro bellows kits with slide copiers were made by almost all SLR makers.  For digitising slides & negatives I use Nikon PB6 bellows and dedicated slide copy attachment with Micro Nikkor 50mm f.2.8.  I have done it combining Nikon macro set with SL and M240, also M246 to digitise B&W negatives.  For fun I also use Leica R bellows with Macro Elmar 100mm.   

[Jean-Michel]

Checkout Mark Segal’s recent article (January 13 or 14) on photopxl.com

In that article he explains how he digitizes film using a camera.
I personally use a dedicated Nikon film scanner, so I have not read Mark’s article, but he is a very reliable source when it come to scanning and printing

[Winedemonium]

1 hour ago, Jean-Michel said:

Checkout Mark Segal’s recent article

Wow! That's one very well thought out deeeeeeeeeep dive. Thank you.

[a.noctilux]

Link to this article :

https://photopxl.com/digitizing-negatives-with-a-camera-revisited/

[rcusick]

My two cents.   The macro elmar and close focus adapter arnt the right tools.   I've gone to an Leica sl plus laowa 85mm macro lens which gives 2:1 reproduction on an apo lens.  

[nilsen]

I've digitized hundred of rolls with an 90mm elmarit and the elpro52, technically its not a 1:1, but its close. Im very happy with those scans. You could put a elpro 52 on the macro elmar and probably get a 1:1.

[4art]

I have the M 90 Macro Elmar with the M bellow ii on an M11 digitizing negs. I bought the Nikon digitizer attachment just to het the head that holds the filmstrip and the filmstrip holders.

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

[f8low]

The original discussion here covered a lot of interesting alternatives to the 90mm, especially the R 100mm.

I‘d be also still interested in the best quality route to get 1:1 with the (newest) Macro Elmar 90mm.

In particular:

1) How far does the macro adapter M plus the 52 Elpro get me in terms of magnification and what is the quality loss from the added optical element?

 

2) Which additional extension rings to use to reach 1:1 with the macro adapter M (now without elpro) and what are disadvantages of this setting (losing light/stability?)

[a.noctilux]

2 hours ago, rho said:

2) Which additional extension rings to use to reach 1:1 with the macro adapter M (now without elpro) and what are disadvantages of this setting (losing light/stability?)

As I wrote in my post #3,

90mm lenses to reach 1:1 need more or less 90mm extension (rings or bellows),

stability can be enhanced with the combo set vertically and using flash or B and selftimer/cable.

Edited August 24, 2023 by a.noctilux

[tsleica]

I'd use an enlarging lens w/extention tubes instead as it will be better in the corners than a regular camera lens.

Focotar 2 50mm is nice and can be used 1/2 stop down for the best results.

Edited August 24, 2023 by tsleica

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M