Survey: Are you planning to buy the new Leica M11?

[aksclix]

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I hope I’ll be around when they make a Leica M43… would be fun to see a Leica sporting an M43 sensor 🤓

[Leica Land]

Yes, will consider only if perspective control is included.

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[dkmoore]

7 minutes ago, Leica Land said:

Yes, will consider only if perspective control is included.

Lol 

[mike3996]

5 hours ago, aksclix said:

I hope I’ll be around when they make a Leica M43… would be fun to see a Leica sporting an M43 sensor 🤓

I would love a M43 camera with a real rangefinder. Consider the size of Olympus Pen-F and consider how Fujifilm fit a window finder in X100. I am a fan of the system but can't stand how difficult it is to achieve a good focus with the EVF and autofocus of their (Olympus/Panasonic) cameras.

Leica made that 4/3 DSLR in Panasonic collaboration.

 

As to the poll,

I'm still waiting for reviews and first hand experiences. I have my reservations about things such as shutter lag and shutter feel and how those sRAW/mRAW files look in action. In all likelihood I will stick with my loved silver chrome MP240 (and its brother, black MP240). Reading these very critical issues about M10R or M11 make me consider these expensive cameras very carefully, and M10P is not enough upgrade. I guess I am stuck!

[Guest BlackBarn]

9 hours ago, Artin said:

It’s the same story all over every time a new M comes out, those that can’t swing it, will always find something to complain  about

Possibly…although also a little bit of the bias of ‘Self Justification’ playing out on both sides….may be?

What’s for sure is the M11 enhances usability but the added convenience doesn’t measure highly on my radar so, although admiring the achievement,  it’s a no. What would gain my interest would be if the B/W output from the M11 matches/ comes close to my M10M. The thought of having just one M camera which combines the M10r and M10M capabilities would be ideal with the enhanced usability of the M11 a bonus.

[Stevejack]

10 hours ago, Artin said:

It’s the same story all over every time a new M comes out, those that can’t swing it, will always find something to complain  about and and park themselves in the so called purist camp. The Math is simple it is the best digital rangefinder they have made and it costs a lot of money.  

Everyone had a different wish list for the next M (excluding those who think the M9/M240/M10 is already the pinnacle of perfection).  It’s understandable some people would feel let down after years of anticipation if they didn’t get what they hoped for.

I really don’t think it’s about whether someone can swing it, and more about whether the improvements are worth the changeover cost and balancing any downsides. 
 

 

Edited January 15, 2022 by Stevejack

[harmen]

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My wife has been asking repeatedly over the past few days if I would buy one.  She also kept suggesting suitable times to swing by the nearby Leica store.  Then yesterday she expressed surprise I had not yet purchased it.  I finally caved in today, walked over, and placed an order.

[tom0511]

vor 44 Minuten schrieb harmen:

My wife has been asking repeatedly over the past few days if I would buy one.  She also kept suggesting suitable times to swing by the nearby Leica store.  Then yesterday she expressed surprise I had not yet purchased it.  I finally caved in today, walked over, and placed an order.

Maybe she wants to get her hands on your previous M body ?

 

[Al Brown]

With the majority of voters decidnig not to buy in the minute results it seems to me that Leica built a damn good camera with the M10 + its iterations.

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[mfiorentino]

22 hours ago, Reciprocity said:

And that is ok, those of us who are actual photojournalists can indeed see using it in high stakes / high stress situations. 

Well, I might have been a bit on the edge with that commentary there, I admit – yet my point being that Leica is slowly moving towards being "up to speed" with the competition, rather than sticking to its heritage. And by that I mean this paired-down, ruggedness in combination with excellent quality. They have their other lines of cameras which can perfectly cover the whole nitty-gritty technical specs, such as immediate access via smartphone etc. The M series has a history stemming form the analogue, photojournalism era. And that is not implying that it should abandon technological progress, rather than it should embrace this more "no-need-to-cover-all-bases" approach…

[Al Brown]

15 hours ago, Artin said:

It’s the same story all over every time a new M comes out

I disagree. I hated the M240 for reasons I listed in several places on this forum, but LOVE the M11.

[adan]

1 hour ago, Al Brown said:

With the majority of voters decidnig not to buy in the minute results it seems to me that Leica built a damn good camera with the M10 + its iterations.

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Technically, 34.83% is a "plurality." The largest segment when there are more than two choices.

A "majority" means ">50%."

Nevertheless I agree the M10 (even the plain-vanilla version) is a pretty powerful machine.

I could stick with the plain M10s forever - IF Leica came out with a 135mm f/2.0 Summicron-M that the rangefinder could focus - APO optional

Until then, well I like to shoot 135 closeups of musicians at work in dark ratskellers, or fast-moving riots at night, and so on and so forth. Can't be limited to what "the masses" want or need.

Need a little more light-gathering capability, whether through aperture or ISO. Ideally without "wasting" drive space (no matter how cheap it is).

The M10 can handle that sometimes - but it is right on the ragged edge.

Police & Teargas, 2020, M10, 135 Tele-Elmar f/4.0, ISO 10000, ~half-frame crop from horizontal image

 

[Al Brown]

1 minute ago, adan said:

Technically, 34.83% is a "plurality." The largest segment when there are more than two choices.

A "majority" means ">50%."

Thanks for the clarification. English is not my first language and I do appreciate constructive input towards learning it better.

[pgk]

For me the question is twofold (and coloured entirely by my status as a full-time frrelance phtographer).

Firstly, do I really need any advantages that a new camera offers?

Secondly, what is the cost of ownership over the predicted lifespan which I would anticipate the camera to have (for me)? Which ties in to the first in many ways.

About the only real advantage the M11 genuinely offers me is the increased MPixels, but I already have a camera of 40+ MPixels and rarely need to take advantage of even these, so the second has to be sufficiently low to make the advantage reasonavly cost-effective. At the price I'm afraid that the M11 simply does not make enough sense to be viable. It would make much more sense for me to invest in a lightly used M10 model.

 

[adan]

12 minutes ago, pgk said:

Secondly, what is the cost of ownership over the predicted lifespan which I would anticipate the camera to have (for me)? Which ties in to the first in many ways.

Quite right. I  budget for about $1000 per camera per year of service, and an assumed service life of up to 10 years.

My M9s just about met that standard ($6995 each at time of purchase: served for 7+ years, late 2009 to early 2017) - even despite the corrosion issue.

The M10s certainly could (surprisingly, just $6600 at time of purchase, since I adopted early).

I'm pretty sure each M11 I might get could serve 9 years - still waiting to see what it can get away with, ISO-wise, and at the various resolutions/file-sizes (I count having to buy additional storage as part of the "cost of ownership." ).

Edited January 15, 2022 by adan

[HPFM]

Just ordered the M11 from a local dealer who has 1 M11 (black) in his showroom.... after reading feedbacks, watching youtube and the attempt to persuade me that the M10R is all i need :-))  After all i decided to want the newest  version..... Leica-Marketing convinced me :-)))  My bank account will suffer 😬

[adan]

There is a factor that tends to get ignored on a forum of current Leica users.

It is not just about "upgrading" by people who already own an M10/9/240.

How important is it for Leica to appeal to non-Leica users? Against the competition? How does Leica grow their market, not simply maintain it?

[Jeff S]

49 minutes ago, adan said:

There is a factor that tends to get ignored on a forum of current Leica users.

It is not just about "upgrading" by people who already own an M10/9/240.

How important is it for Leica to appeal to non-Leica users? Against the competition? How does Leica grow their market, not simply maintain it?

Agreed. The M9 may have been the most successful case for growing the digital M market outside the Leica user base, at least based on my casual readings. But the price of entry (for new M releases) has soared since then (as well as the cost of new Leica branded M lenses).  It seems Leica has relied more on other product line expansion, i.e., the SL and Q lines, to broaden its market share , rather than depending as much on the M line, at least for the more typical consumer price point.  But of course I could be wrong; only Leica knows.

Jeff

Edited January 15, 2022 by Jeff S

[pgk]

1 hour ago, adan said:

Quite right. I  budget for about $1000 per camera per year of service, and an assumed service life of up to 10 years.

My M9s just about met that standard ($6995 each at time of purchase: served for 7+ years, late 2009 to early 2017) - even despite the corrosion issue.

The M10s certainly could (surprisingly, just $6600 at time of purchase, since I adopted early).

I'm pretty sure each M11 I might get could serve 9 years - still waiting to see what it can get away with, ISO-wise, and at the various resolutions/file-sizes (I count having to buy additional storage as part of the "cost of ownership." ).

My problem is that I cannot shoot everything on Leica Ms so I have to have another system. This significantly increases my costs. Factor in a second body and the M11 is looking like too much of an expensive luxury to be a 'pro' camera unfortunately. My M9s are still going strong anyway, and as I'm a low ISO shooter most of the time, and as their files print well enough for 99.99% of my needs, I have been loath to upgrade them. I like the CCD characteristics too. If I do buy another M it will probably be to a lightly used M10 which makes a great deal more sense in business terms.

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[pgk]

1 hour ago, adan said:

How does Leica grow their market, not simply maintain it?

By offering a cheaper version - as all other makers do. Tried and tested. Cheaper body (with 'lower' specifications), same lenses and lots of upgrade potential.