Summicron 35/2 8-element vs. Light Lens Lab 35/2 - a direct comparison

[shirubadanieru]

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22 minutes ago, pippy said:

Just for a bit of fun here is a pair of snaps showing my new arrival. Each has been posted elsewhere but this does seem to be the most fitting thread for the thing and I did suggest I might show some pics here back in post #12 so here she is;

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I'm really hoping the weather will clear up over the weekend as I'm rather keen to get out and about with the little gem.

Philip.

Nice! Goes amazingly well with the Black paint body. Enjoy! Let me know your thoughts once you’ve spent some time with it!

[pippy]

50 minutes ago, shirubadanieru said:

Nice! Goes amazingly well with the Black paint body. Enjoy! Let me know your thoughts once you’ve spent some time with it!

Thank you, Shirubadanieru; I will!

Its arrival has shaken things up a bit, though. I had been expecting to use my v2 35mm Summilux primarily on the M-D but my thoughts now are to use the 8E on that body and use the Summilux on the M Monochrom. In many ways this makes a lot of sense; from what I've seen from both yours and Al Brown's posts (as well as the few test-snaps I've managed to rattle off myself), it would seem that the Summilux when used wide-open will better suit the Monochrom and the marginally 'improved' qualities of the 8E will better suit the characteristics of the M-D.

'Time Will Tell' of course and although I'm keen to get out to be using them 'in tandem' - just to get some snapping in - at the same time in no huge rush to resolve the conundrum. I'm also acutely aware that this is very much a First World Problem...

Philip.

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[Huss]

I lucked out being a first adopter at the $500 price.

 

 

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Edited January 27, 2022 by Huss

[tsleica]

I got the LLL 8E and more recently the LLL Elcan.

All these lenses are great if you get a nice one as they need to be double checked by dealer for QC issues before shipping.

[stefanusj]

from the first time i got this lens (August 21), it always sticks with my MP...  Here is the lens wide open with Kodak Pro100

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[ynp]

Ordered a silver one at https://shopee.co.th/geekster

a bit more expensive here in Thailand than in HK. Thanks to a local rep, it’s delivered to the door. 

Edited February 13, 2022 by ynp

[Life By Stills]

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I keep seeing this lens being brought up, and seeing the side by side photos from this thread makes me really want to get one! Thinking about whether to swap out the Summarit-M 35mm f/2.5 for one of these of have it as on top of my Summarit.

But the more pressing question I have is: does anyone know how I get hold of one of these Light Lens Labs 35mm f/2 lenses please? I'm based in the UK.

Many thanks!

[James24]

19 hours ago, Life By Stills said:

 

But the more pressing question I have is: does anyone know how I get hold of one of these Light Lens Labs 35mm f/2 lenses please? I'm based in the UK.

Many thanks!

Try Ebay.  There are a couple for sale in the UK, as well as others from China and Hong Kong.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313&_nkw=Light+Lens+Lab&_sacat=0

[Life By Stills]

4 hours ago, James24 said:

Try Ebay.  There are a couple for sale in the UK, as well as others from China and Hong Kong.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m570.l1313&_nkw=Light+Lens+Lab&_sacat=0

Ahh thanks @James24. Had totally forgot about eBay for new stuff too. Have found a couple of UK based listings.

Do you or anyone else happen to know if there are any brick and mortar shops which will sell the LLL 35mm? Probably a long shot, but thought I'd ask.

[pippy]

1 hour ago, Life By Stills said:

...Have found a couple of UK based listings....Do you or anyone else happen to know if there are any brick and mortar shops which will sell the LLL 35mm? Probably a long shot, but thought I'd ask.

Be aware that for a UK resident buying from anywhere outside the UK it is almost certain that there will be taxes and duty payable before the lens is released by the postal service.

You've probably already seen this one but if not;

https://www.apertureuk.com/light-lens-lab-35mm-f2-v1lc-silver-a2032104.html

Very reliable dealership. Coincidentally it's where I found my copy.

I have not seen any mention of LLL trying to find an outlet in Continental Europe far less in the UK and with the post-Brexit tariffs in place I can't see that situation changing anytime soon.

Philip.

[Life By Stills]

2 hours ago, pippy said:

Be aware that for a UK resident buying from anywhere outside the UK it is almost certain that there will be taxes and duty payable before the lens is released by the postal service.

You've probably already seen this one but if not;

https://www.apertureuk.com/light-lens-lab-35mm-f2-v1lc-silver-a2032104.html

Very reliable dealership. Coincidentally it's where I found my copy.

I have not seen any mention of LLL trying to find an outlet in Continental Europe far less in the UK and with the post-Brexit tariffs in place I can't see that situation changing anytime soon.

Philip.

Thanks Philip. Do you happen to know what's the difference between V1LC and some which I've seen on eBay following @James24's suggestion being labelled V6LC.

[pippy]

1 hour ago, Life By Stills said:

Thanks Philip. Do you happen to know what's the difference between V1LC and some which I've seen on eBay following @James24's suggestion being labelled V6LC.

Yes. Sort-of......My memory is a bit vague on the details but, FWIW, I'll try to give a very rough outline.

The LLL 8 Element had an interesting development period. Some members here are more informed than myself but, in essence, the lens went through a few design changes between the very first batch produced and the ones which are currently available on the 'New' market. AFAIK the original series - which were issued to the 'Early Adopters' who had placed orders / paid for the lenses in advance - seem to have been almost prototypes in purpose and carried no V(x)LC designation. I believe these were 500 in number and the lenses were numbered as such.

The first 'General Release' batch seems to have been the V1LC lenses (numbering up to 998?) which were followed by V2LC...and so on. I'm not 100% sure all numbers up to V6 have been utilised; I've seen V1, V2, V3, V4(?) and V6. Lens batches when I bought my copy seem to have been limited to 998.

Having received feedback from the Early-Adopters (and the V1 owners?) the 8 Element appears to have gone through a few subtle design tweaks. Reports are that the earliest lenses left a lot to be desired in IQ and other areas (rendering?). The V1 batch seems to have addressed most - but not all - of the problems and it seems to be the case that the V2 series was when things settled-down to being more like the Summicron it was trying to honour.

I have read comments from V2 owners who were stil not 100% happy with the LLL but, at the same time, there are also owners of the V2 batch who are perfectly happy. One point worth noting is that many of the complainants also owned an original with which they were able to complare their new lens but, again, there is at least one member here who has tested a V2 with an original and found their rendering etc. to be identical.

Sorry I can't be more conclusive nor more certain of my mutterings noted above but the general gist of the thing is pretty much in the right ball-park.

There is quite a lot of info out there on the www but much of it is uninformed heresay and rumour; actual facts are more difficult to find. There were many early adopters amongst the members of the Rangefinder Forum so if you would like to get some informed viewpoints then that might be a very good place to start.

It so happens that mine is a V6 but I didn't know any of the complex back-story before I made my choice; it was simply the only example available in the UK when I decided to acquire one. Had it been a V2 or, probably, a V1 then I'm not sure I'd be any happier than I am....and I am extremely happy with the lens.

I wish you good fortune if you, too, decide that one would be nice to track-down.

Philip.

EDIT : Just for fun when you have a moment spare you might enjoy this thread on another LLL offering;

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/327789-light-lens-lab-elcan-50mm-f2-review/#comment-4338564

 

Edited June 8, 2022 by pippy

[James24]

The example for sale in Aperture looks like your best bet at the moment. It is competitively priced and you will get a dealer warranty as well.

I missed out on the Rangefinder Forum deal too, but picked up a V2LC version from Hong Kong which has no issues. It was said that only the earliest lenses would benefit from flint glass as supply was limited, but I don't know any details about that. If you want to wade through some 300 pages of the relevant Rangefinder Forum thread, you'll find out a lot more info.

https://www.rangefinderforum.com/node/172245#post4762556

[Life By Stills]

Brilliant! Thanks so much for your replies and info, @pippy@James24! Really helpful read... Didn't quite make it through all 300 odd pages of rangefinder forum thread though haha.

[Dennis]

A few shots of the LLL 35/2 V6LC on an M10

Ensenada, BC, Mexico

It's a lovely lens... Glad I bought it!

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Edited June 22, 2022 by Dennis

[Ccoppola82]

I have an early v1lc from the rangefinderforum early orders for $500 w custom engraving.  My particular copy was checked by the guy named Kevin who sorta kicked off the thing on there. 2 things were mentioned in the v1 batch was that I KNOW the coating was changed.  It went from  purple/blue to amber or vice versa. Can’t remember which and tbh mine has a yg filter on it so I don’t notice it’s color. More significantly (maybe) was that the v1 was marketed as using the very limited supply of leaded flint glass which Kevin said was in low supply. Mine has this.  Not sure about the later lenses, but were they altered to account for running out of flint glass? Maybe?  All in all, mine is beautiful and I use it all the time. It’s so far nicer in build than some of my Leica glass and easily on par with modern voigtlander.  That being said, I got mine for $500.  I don’t think I would select this lens over something like the CV ultron v2 for the money due to the fact that I don’t know much about LLL customer service and some of their early dealings w the forum members were…..questionable whereas I know Steven Gandy at camera quest has excellent customer service. Hope that helps. 

[Huss]

On 6/8/2022 at 10:03 AM, pippy said:

..AFAIK the original series - which were issued to the 'Early Adopters' who had placed orders / paid for the lenses in advance - seem to have been almost prototypes in purpose and carried no V(x)LC designation. I believe these were 500 in number and the lenses were numbered as such.

 

I was an early adopter and mine has no V designation.  It just has the serial # 500183, which I assume it means it is #183 out of the first 500.  No issues with mine, the build quality is superb.

[Huss]

Trying to get as much flare out of this lens as possible!  This is the kind of flare I love!  Not that horrible veiling haziness.

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[pippy]

5 hours ago, Ccoppola82 said:

...More significantly (maybe) was that the v1 was marketed as using the very limited supply of leaded flint glass which Kevin said was in low supply. Mine has this.  Not sure about the later lenses, but were they altered to account for running out of flint glass?...

From what I've read - and which echoes what Shirubadanieru says in post #14 on the previous page - it has been confirmed by someone involved with LLL that the lenses up to V6 (at least) still utilise Flint Glass as they did manage to find further suppliers. The V*LC engraving denotes batch V(ersion + number) / Lead (aka Flint) Glass / Coated. The last I read on the matter - which was a few months ago now - was that they ARE runnng low on existing stocks and were trying to source new supplies.

I don't know the current situation.

Philip.

Edited June 25, 2022 by pippy

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[Huss]

Yeah I got mine for $500 too.  Totally worth it now, but at the time it was a serious gamble as basically we handed over money to an unknown company that then had issues delivering!  But thankfully in the end they did.

Would I buy one now at the current price of about $1200?  Doubtful seeing the options out there.  For example I also use the CV 35 1.4 v2 and that 'only' is $650.  I picked one up used for $400.  Yeah it's not the same thing but honestly for me it was the novelty of getting the LLL with engraving of our choice in the finish of our choice that made me get one in the first place.