cpclee Posted November 19, 2021 Share #321 Posted November 19, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) 16 minutes ago, Enrique Santa said: I think that you don't understand me. If Leica do what you say, this will be the end of Q and SL line for sure. I did understand you actually, but I still think the Q and SL lines serve very different purposes. My hypothetical FF L mount body would not be a good candidate for mounting the big SL zooms and neither will it be as good for cine; likewise, my hypothetical body plus a 28 Summilux-M or 28 Summicron SL will cost nearly twice as much as a Q. At the margin, there may be some migration of customers between product lines but that is a net zero proposition for Leica. Better cannibalize your own product than waiting for someone else to cannibalize it for you is the adage. If I were Leica's management, I'd think my biggest fear would be for Zeiss to begin selling an interchangeable mount version of their ZX camera capable of using their FF and APS-C AF lenses and (Z)M lenses via an adapter. As I said before, such a camera is inevitable and I'd think Leica understands that. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted November 19, 2021 Posted November 19, 2021 Hi cpclee, Take a look here OhOh, future of CL?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted November 19, 2021 Share #322 Posted November 19, 2021 I think that the ZX is the last camera we will ever see from Zeiss... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cpclee Posted November 19, 2021 Share #323 Posted November 19, 2021 6 minutes ago, jaapv said: I think that the ZX is the last camera we will ever see from Zeiss... The first iteration of the ZX is laughably bad so I might have picked a bad example, I see. But I'm not sure if Zeiss will never get it right. Leica managed to ship their first in-house digital camera getting the IR filtration wrong. Everyone has to start from somewhere. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted November 19, 2021 Share #324 Posted November 19, 2021 Yes, but they gave up the film line, they gave up the development of an M digital competitor, their ZM lens line never overtook Leica. I think they see the real future of their photographic department with Zeiss lenses on Sony cameras. The ZX was an aberration or somebody's hobby-horse I think, not to waste the R&D they put into digital in the first decade of the century. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cpclee Posted November 19, 2021 Share #325 Posted November 19, 2021 15 minutes ago, jaapv said: Yes, but they gave up the film line, they gave up the development of an M digital competitor, their ZM lens line never overtook Leica. I think they see the real future of their photographic department with Zeiss lenses on Sony cameras. The ZX was an aberration or somebody's hobby-horse I think, not to waste the R&D they put into digital in the first decade of the century. Interesting. I don't know their more recent history even though I liked their products from the Contax/Kyocera days. I have however noticed that the latest premium lenses for Sony's mirrorless line have been their own G Master lenses as opposed to Zeiss offerings. I'd have assumed Sony finally feels ready to be on their own. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted November 19, 2021 Share #326 Posted November 19, 2021 2 hours ago, cpclee said: … we know a FF L mount body of that size is possible … No we don’t. The Q camera has no mount and the shutter is built into the lens … Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted November 19, 2021 Share #327 Posted November 19, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) Indeed a compact FF camera would not be as compact as the CL most probably, unless buyers accept an accessory EVF a la Sigma. Some good people here don't want that or even a bump as if FF did not take more room than APS. They could well get a baby monster a la Panasonic S5 instead... . Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cboy Posted November 19, 2021 Share #328 Posted November 19, 2021 25 minutes ago, lct said: Indeed a compact FF camera would not be as compact as the CL most probably, unless buyers accept an accessory EVF a la Sigma. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Its not too hard too imagine a FF CL in comparison to the already out sony 7c https://www.apotelyt.com/compare-camera/leica-cl-vs-sony-a7c 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Its not too hard too imagine a FF CL in comparison to the already out sony 7c https://www.apotelyt.com/compare-camera/leica-cl-vs-sony-a7c ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326136-ohoh-future-of-cl/?do=findComment&comment=4316269'>More sharing options...
cpclee Posted November 19, 2021 Share #329 Posted November 19, 2021 1 hour ago, IkarusJohn said: No we don’t. The Q camera has no mount and the shutter is built into the lens … You're right the leaf shutter is no more and a focal plane shutter will need to be inserted. But I think that's more to do with a slight increase in thickness. Above I was more referring to the heat dissipation and extra image processing circuitry for FF with which the Q/Q2 has shown Leica is able to pack into a size much the same as the CL's. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frame-it Posted November 19, 2021 Share #330 Posted November 19, 2021 am sure more new cameras are coming Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326136-ohoh-future-of-cl/?do=findComment&comment=4316306'>More sharing options...
Simone_DF Posted November 19, 2021 Share #331 Posted November 19, 2021 3 hours ago, dkCambridgeshire said: given that FF L mount lenses are larger than APS-C ICLs ... How many Leica enthusiasts actually use their relatively very large FF L mount lenses on their CL and TL bodies? but the new Sigma lenses are all incredibly compact, and designed to be used on the FP. The ones I have are just a few mm bigger than the average M lens 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simone_DF Posted November 19, 2021 Share #332 Posted November 19, 2021 3 hours ago, Enrique Santa said: I think that you don't understand me. If Leica do what you say, this will be the end of Q and SL line for sure. No, the SL line can continue in a smaller form factor, while the Q will always keep their loyal fanbase, because the body with an integrated lens will always be cheaper and have other advantages like the leaf shutter and probably a smaller footprint. It's no secret that the Panasonic S serie got some traction only when the S5 was released, because people were not buying the bigger bodies. The S1R is already discontinued, for example. I think Panasonic will release only S5 sized successors in the future, and if the SL3 will keep its current form factor, Leica will bleed even more customers. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted November 19, 2021 Share #333 Posted November 19, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, cboy said: Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Its not too hard too imagine a FF CL in comparison to the already out sony 7c https://www.apotelyt.com/compare-camera/leica-cl-vs-sony-a7c Sure but Leica is not Sony. As far as TTL cameras are concerned, Leica has never been able to compete size wise w/o some Japanese help coming from companies like Minolta for R4 to R7 cameras. FF SLRs made by Leica alone (Leicaflex, R8, R9) have always been larger and current SL bodies make no exception. For now, the only help available would come from the L alliance i.e. Sigma or Panasonic i guess but as a Sony user myself i would not mind an A7C copy. I don't hold my breath though . Edited November 19, 2021 by lct Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LocalHero1953 Posted November 19, 2021 Share #334 Posted November 19, 2021 26 minutes ago, frame-it said: am sure more new cameras are coming Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Source? What do the two middle columns mean - some with numbers, some with "Leica". The dates look a bit random as days of the week? 16 October 2022 is a Sunday, so I guess they are not launch dates. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cboy Posted November 19, 2021 Share #335 Posted November 19, 2021 (edited) Yes just as in past when panasonic collaborated with leica to churn out compact aspc cameras, which were identical to each other except for cosmetic tweaks, they can do the same with a smaller FF L mount camera comparable with others already in the market. However i wouldnt mind the cheaper panasonic version though 😉. Rebrands im ok with lol Edited November 19, 2021 by cboy Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cirke Posted November 19, 2021 Share #336 Posted November 19, 2021 3 hours ago, jaapv said: I think that the ZX is the last camera we will ever see from Zeiss... many good ideas and many mistakes , a digital Zeiss Ikon would be perfect Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted November 19, 2021 Share #337 Posted November 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, cboy said: Yes just as in past when panasonic collaborated with leica to churn out compact aspc cameras, which were identical to each other except for cosmetic tweaks, they can do the same with a smaller FF L mount camera comparable with others already in the market. However i wouldnt mind the cheaper panasonic version though 😉. Rebrands im ok with lol Problem is this compact FF L mount does not exist at Panasonic yet. Unless you consider the S5 as compact of course. Would you like it to replace your CL? Just curious as my Sony A7's have a similar size as the Pana S5 already so it is not my idea of compactness personally but YMMV. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frame-it Posted November 19, 2021 Share #338 Posted November 19, 2021 (edited) 41 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said: Source? What do the two middle columns mean - some with numbers, some with "Leica". The dates look a bit random as days of the week? 16 October 2022 is a Sunday, so I guess they are not launch dates. the number is the model number of the camera i think 6376 is an M series...the dates are license/registration dates similar sites like this one exist for most countries > https://fccid.io/N5A https://fccid.io/N5A6376 >>> https://fccid.io/N5A6376/External-Photos/External-photos-4605459 Edited November 19, 2021 by frame-it 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Posted November 19, 2021 Share #339 Posted November 19, 2021 (edited) It would be great if all you experts could get together and take over the Leica AG to create a new camera with a switch that could go between APS-C and FF. I think the right name would be Hopeflex! Edited November 19, 2021 by Louis 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruskkyle Posted November 19, 2021 Share #340 Posted November 19, 2021 Just spotted this. I think we all know the TL line is finished but it's the first time I've seen the 'flagship' Made in Germany lenses bundled into anything... Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/326136-ohoh-future-of-cl/?do=findComment&comment=4316346'>More sharing options...
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