pippy Posted July 12, 2021 Share #41 Posted July 12, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) 44 minutes ago, jaapv said: ......We only have to go to this forum to pick out the photographers who really know how to use it. And those who mistakenly see it as a standard 50 mm lens...... Nit-picking of me Jaap, I know, but whilst I agree with the first part of the above I also suspect that those photographers who really understand - and frequently portray - the unique qualities of the 50mm Noctilux might also consider - correctly IMO - these lenses to be a standard 50mm lens as well and use them as such. I don't have a Noctilux but I do have - and use - the 7Artisans 50mm f1.1 for both its own individualistic rendering wide-open but also with an appreciation that it can still perform perfectly well when stopped-down and can, therefore, cover both 'somewhat special' and 'perfectly normal' duties with aplomb. Philip. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted July 12, 2021 Posted July 12, 2021 Hi pippy, Take a look here What is the ideal 35/50 lens pairing with the M10R and M10M?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
jaapv Posted July 12, 2021 Share #42 Posted July 12, 2021 I never said that it could not function perfectly well as a standard lens but I question the rationale of buying it for that purpose. I can do my shopping in a Ferrari without problem but it would be a huge waste and a silly thing to do. I would need a bumper sticker “ my other car is a Dacia”. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted July 12, 2021 Share #43 Posted July 12, 2021 4 minutes ago, jaapv said: I never said that it could not function perfectly well as a standard lens but I question the rationale of buying it for that purpose... Yes; I understood that Jaap - which is why I said straight away that I was nit-picking a bit. My post was made in a response which was partly down to my own misunderstanding ('in olden days') of the way a Noctilux could be used. I didn't quite see the attraction of these things; "Why buy a big, heavy, very expensive f0.95 / f1.0 / f1.2 50mm lens if one is going to shoot at f5.6?". Now, through examples posted here by users such as Farns, I know better. Philip. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted July 12, 2021 Share #44 Posted July 12, 2021 10 hours ago, fotografr said: Tripods are necessary for macro, landscapes, I can honestly say that I haven't used a tripod for landscapes since the days I used Kodak HIE. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 12, 2021 Share #45 Posted July 12, 2021 3 hours ago, jaapv said: I find that IBIS only improves image quality at (very) long shutter times and/or focal lengths, and cannot approach the results from a stable tripod. IBIS improves image quality at all shutter speeds inferior to the focal length how i feel it. I am fortunate to have steady hands so i won't claim that IBIS is a game changer but i don't feel the need to use any tripod since i have it i must say. YMMV. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted July 12, 2021 Share #46 Posted July 12, 2021 22 minutes ago, ianman said: I can honestly say that I haven't used a tripod for landscapes since the days I used Kodak HIE. Literally the only time I have is when I shot a series of long exposure images on the west coast in 2013. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted July 12, 2021 Share #47 Posted July 12, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) 12 minutes ago, fotografr said: Literally the only time I have is when I shot a series of long exposure images on the west coast in 2013. I don't follow. You wrote that a tripod is necessary for landscapes. Or did I misunderstand? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted July 12, 2021 Share #48 Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, ianman said: I don't follow. You wrote that a tripod is necessary for landscapes. Or did I misunderstand? That's what I was shooting during that period. I'm not normally a landscape photographer. Typically, people who do high end landscape work use tripods because they also shoot at low ISO and small apertures. I suppose I should have been more specific and said that tripods are necessary for optimum results when shooting landscapes. Edited July 12, 2021 by fotografr 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2021 Share #49 Posted July 12, 2021 1 hour ago, lct said: IBIS improves image quality at all shutter speeds inferior to the focal length how i feel it. I am fortunate to have steady hands so i won't claim that IBIS is a game changer but i don't feel the need to use any tripod since i have it i must say. YMMV. Not my experience as I have quite stable hands (and trained to be such ), but I suspect that we do not differ much in our methods. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lct Posted July 12, 2021 Share #50 Posted July 12, 2021 10 minutes ago, jaapv said: Not my experience as I have quite stable hands (and trained to be such ) My dentist says that he has tremor and it allows him to treat two teeth at a time 6 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted July 12, 2021 Share #51 Posted July 12, 2021 I never understand the belief that tripods are to be decried which all too often crops up on the forum. I get the impression that there is a belief iamongst some that real "Leica rf photographers don't use tripods". When relevant tripods are relevant. No image stabilisation system negates their use. I use tripods with all my cameras when I need to, M Leicas included. I also handhold at low shutter speeds if I have to. Can we move on from this erroneous belief please? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2021 Share #52 Posted July 12, 2021 I did not see anybody saying that tripods were not needed... 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted July 12, 2021 Share #53 Posted July 12, 2021 45 minutes ago, jaapv said: I did not see anybody saying that tripods were not needed... It is usually intimated ..... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
fotografr Posted July 12, 2021 Share #54 Posted July 12, 2021 51 minutes ago, pgk said: When relevant tripods are relevant. Now that's really going out on a limb. 😉 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted July 12, 2021 Share #55 Posted July 12, 2021 51 minutes ago, pgk said: It is usually intimated ..... Not by me. Although I am by nature a hand-held shooter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted July 12, 2021 Share #56 Posted July 12, 2021 17 hours ago, 250swb said: I take your point, but if image quality was a major consideration in any of these lens discussions the first question would be 'what tripod do you use?' We've laughably had people bobbing up and down on boats and saying how wonderfully the 50 Apo performs. Well, I shoot a lot from boats, and with my Leicas too. Assuming that it is not possible to produce a really detailed image from an unstable platform is incorrect; it is quite possible. I know photographers using long lenses (300/2.8 and the like) from boats and getting excellent results. The 50 Apo will no doubt perform within its abilities as well as any other lens. The real world is rather different to the theoretical one. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
IkarusJohn Posted July 12, 2021 Share #57 Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) Returning to @KateStarr, cost no concern, 35 and 50, the obvious recommendation will be the 35 & 50 APO Summicrons. And you will be very happy, I’m sure. There will be differences if you pixel peep, but in the end your photography will be the deciding factor in your images. Both are small, light and state of the art. I don’t have the new APO 35 Summicron, but I do have more other lenses than I should have. My choice would be slightly different to yours (sticking with current Leica lenses), I would take the 28 Summilux, for the reasons set out above, with the 50 Noctilux. Size and weight don’t bother me much, and both have wonderful image quality and greater options being faster than the Summicrons wide open.. I don’t like the 35mm field of view, but if that floats your boat you can either move your feet a little or crop with the 28mm. I prefer it as it has more drama, and more options than the 35. I also really like this lens. As for the Noctilux, I like it in my hands on an M camera, and I like the option of the extra stops, but it is very heavy. I also have the 50 Summillux ASPH and the APO 50 Summicron, and love both. To be honest, if you took the same image with all three, all at the same aperture, I’d be surprised if you could pick which was which viewed in isolation. With a little practice, I have no doubt you could in a side by side comparison, pixel peeping. But, is that really what you want to spend you photography time doing? I certainly don’t. I like the idea of choosing two current lenses of the focal lengths you like and then getting on with taking photos. Don’t browse the gear threads on this forum - just get your lenses, learn to love them and post in the photo sections of the forum. Availability of faster apertures gives you more photographic options - but they can be tricky if you always and only shoot wide open. That is one option but it isn’t the photography that interests me. Good luck! Edited July 12, 2021 by IkarusJohn 7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianman Posted July 12, 2021 Share #58 Posted July 12, 2021 4 hours ago, jaapv said: Not by me. Although I am by nature a hand-held shooter. Me neither. I have 3 of them. I used tripods a lot in the past when I was shooting b&w infrared film and making 360 deg panos (on film) for my work. I just don’t agree that they are a necessity for all landscape work. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250swb Posted July 12, 2021 Share #59 Posted July 12, 2021 (edited) 5 hours ago, pgk said: Well, I shoot a lot from boats, and with my Leicas too. Assuming that it is not possible to produce a really detailed image from an unstable platform is incorrect; it is quite possible. I know photographers using long lenses (300/2.8 and the like) from boats and getting excellent results. The 50 Apo will no doubt perform within its abilities as well as any other lens. The real world is rather different to the theoretical one. I presume you use a 300mm lens for long shots, not close ups, in which case the effect of movement is minimised the further away from the subject you are. You are talking about theoretical sweet spots, something a photographer can use to their advantage, but often rather different to the real world. I've photographed from boats bobbing on the sea, my technique was to wait until my boat reached the top of the wave. Either way it doesn't answer the question, if hand holding is so great tell me why there is no advantage in either a stable platform or IBIS regarding getting the best from a lens? Edited July 12, 2021 by 250swb Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted July 12, 2021 Share #60 Posted July 12, 2021 4 hours ago, IkarusJohn said: ...I like the idea of choosing two current lenses of the focal lengths you like and then getting on with taking photos. Don’t browse the gear threads on this forum - just get your lenses, learn to love them and post in the photo sections of the forum... Agreed. Excellent advice. Philip. 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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