Superb new camera profiles and camera & film emulation presets (Cobalt-Image)

[jaapv]

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32 minutes ago, Adam Bonn said:

That’s good because it’s basically impossible! An Elvis impersonator can sing an Elvis song but not write songs as if he was Elvis 😅

Generically speaking making camera A look like camera B involves making both cameras look like look C

But you can get  very close - and it is needed when you use different cameras on one shoot or trip. Profiling both cameras in the same light works quite well.

As for bought profiles - to me they are takeaway food. I like my own results in the kitchen better.

[Adam Bonn]

18 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Profiling both cameras in the same light works quite well.

Is synonymous with

Quote

making camera A look like camera B involves making both cameras look like look C

 

24 minutes ago, jaapv said:

needed when you use different cameras on one shoot or trip

A whibal card (or similar) would work well here too

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[Olaf_ZG]

23 minutes ago, jaapv said:

As for bought profiles - to me they are takeaway food. I like my own results in the kitchen better.

May be you tried the wrong restaurants.

Joking aside, if you can cook and have the will to cook, you are right. Regarding profiles I don’t have the will to (learn to) cook, hence the need for takeaway.

Having a full time job, mostly sitting behind a computer, I somehow rarely want to sit behind a computer in the evening or weekend, especially when the weather is nice.

therefore the less I spend on getting the right color (= the color I like), the better. Once I have this done, I basically only need dodging and burning for 95% of my images.

@Adam Bonnthank you for your in depth explanations

[jaapv]

Up to three stars, my friend.  Some folks are completely happy with MacDonalds, other prefer something more. I was at Ross Lovell last week. My friends were over th moon but albeit decent it tasted like my mother’s cooking. That is not a compliment. 

[jaapv]

14 minutes ago, Adam Bonn said:

Is synonymous with

 

A whibal card (or similar) would work well here too

No, that is too generic. As is an Expodisk.   A Greta-Macbeth card is the way to go. Whitebalance is something quite different from a profile. 
Using pre-cooked profiles is using somebody else’s interpretation. 

[Adam Bonn]

@Olaf_ZG

I wouldn’t like to work out how many hours I spent in front of the computer reading about, learning about, trial building, testing profiles, learning software etc. (Triple figures, maybe one complete lockdown!)

Of course now I feel I have a decent base understanding of it all and more importantly (as Jaap says) I can cook food I like to eat

 

[Adam Bonn]

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9 minutes ago, jaapv said:

No, that is too generic. As is an Expodisk.   A Greta-Macbeth card is the way to go. Whitebalance is something quite different from a profile. 
Using pre-cooked profiles is using somebody else’s interpretation. 

Yeah.. but…

when we shoot a leica DNG we get a very important tag in the  file

’AsShotNeutral’ (ASN)

 which is a kinda pseudo XYZ value and the clue is in the name! (Neutral)

To get white balance a calculation is performed from the inverse of the color matrices (I have the full formulae if you want it) that gives the XYZ wb value for the shot.

When you use a CC24 (or similar) you’re making a new Color Matrix, this CM is more accurate for you camera in that particular light. (Compared to the one size fits all adobe/leica one)

But if you use the whibal card, you are making a new ASN

so

ASN x CM = default camera colours

and 

ASN x newCM = better camera colours

then it follows that

newASN x CM = better camera  colours

much like how 9 x 3 = 27 and 3 x 9 = 27 🙂

The problem with CC24 profiles (made using the free software they come with) is that they lack forward matrices 

The forward matrix is the backbone of the profile. 

Without an instruction to tell it how to perform the D50 chromatic adaptation, LR/ACR will basically have to guess… this works well with light around D50, but can be terrible away from that.

If one is able to use a CC24 (or similar) for every scene one encounters (or close enough) then one will get great results. But in lieu of that accurately setting the WB in camera is a decent workable substitute. 

 

 

[jaapv]

You are correct but that is only needed for product shots and similar I would say. If Natural shots have more viewer tolerance. An eyeball tweak in the further postprocessing will do for me  

l. At least for me, I would not like to profile each shot individually  

 BTW my wife tends to keep track of my computer time. She is not always pleased. 🧐

[Adam Bonn]

7 minutes ago, jaapv said:

You are correct but that is only needed for product shots and similar I would sayNatural shots

 have more viewer tolerance. An eyeball tweak in the further postprocessing will do for me  

l. At least for me, I would not like to profile each shot individually  

 

Yes I agree. The irony is that profiling is actually about accurate colours, but really we all mainly like non accurate pleasing colours!

There’s no right or wrong here, what works for us is fine for us.

 

11 minutes ago, jaapv said:

BTW my wife tends to keep track of my computer time. She is not always pleased. 🧐

There were days learning all of this that I spent double shifts on the computer and she (my wife not yours 😅) was far from pleased… and that’s before we factor in all those times that I kept her waiting while I said I’m just going to go photograph that red thing or that time I set up a test scene with several of her colourful belongings (and a CC24 of course)

[jaapv]

And we should realize that having a decent camera profile is just one step in the process of creating an image ( and not even the most important one) starting  with the editing place: good calibrated monitor, subdued light of good quality-my colours took a leap for the better when I installed a 5500K continuous spectrum bulb behind my screen - a completely colour managed workflow-including printer and paper- is the thing to aim for. 

[Luke_Miller]

I just purchased the Cobalt camera profile for the Leica SL.  I'm a Capture One user and prefer their ProStandard camera profiles, but unlike the SL2 and SL2-S they do not have one for the SL.  The Cobalt profile gives me skin tones I like better than the Capture One generic SL profile and much better than the ones I created by color editing the generic one.

[Dennis]

I pulled the trigger too. I bought the basic back plus the Fuji film digital pack. My first impressions:

• I like the Cobalt standard/neutral/modular profiles better than Adobe standard/color and the M10 one. The latter especially is too yellow in distinguishing situations. Only for this, it is worth the investment, I guess
• I wanted to try (I was curious about) the Fujifilm digital, Kodachrome, CCD fever, and CCD monochrome. But of course, it was a lot of money. So after a while of thinking (guessing) was the best fit was, I decided on the Fuji pack (not film). I'm happy to say that I enjoyed the Astia/Velvia profiles. I already created my own preset based on this. I think it's a reasonable commitment between the classic slide look and a modern digital output. 
• Cobalt profiles are really worth it, but it's a lot of money with multiple camera systems if one wants consistency. I would like to suggest that the owners provide some coupon codes or preferred rates if the cart is full. I don't want to wait until next Black Friday 

Two samples of old pictures, re-edited w/ Cobalt… Testing 1-2-3

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[Cobram]

9 hours ago, Dennis said:

I pulled the trigger too. I bought the basic back plus the Fuji film digital pack. My first impressions:

• I like the Cobalt standard/neutral/modular profiles better than Adobe standard/color and the M10 one. The latter especially is too yellow in distinguishing situations. Only for this, it is worth the investment, I guess
• I wanted to try (I was curious about) the Fujifilm digital, Kodachrome, CCD fever, and CCD monochrome. But of course, it was a lot of money. So after a while of thinking (guessing) was the best fit was, I decided on the Fuji pack (not film). I'm happy to say that I enjoyed the Astia/Velvia profiles. I already created my own preset based on this. I think it's a reasonable commitment between the classic slide look and a modern digital output. 
• Cobalt profiles are really worth it, but it's a lot of money with multiple camera systems if one wants consistency. I would like to suggest that the owners provide some coupon codes or preferred rates if the cart is full. I don't want to wait until next Black Friday 

Two samples of old pictures, re-edited w/ Cobalt… Testing 1-2-3

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Great. Thank you for your feedback. I'm wondering about your C1 vs Adobe situation. I was thinking you use C1 but from the post above it seems you got Cobalt profiles for Lightroom. Did you move from C1 to Adobe?

 

[Dennis]

2 hours ago, Cobram said:

Did you move from C1 to Adobe?

Yes sir. Move from C1 to LR CC on October, then to LR Classic two months ago. 

[Olaf_ZG]

I photographed some people in the same surroundings: my office, black bg, stripbox on one side, reflector at the other side. One with the mm, the other with the sl. Both edited in c1, but the one from the sl with profile settings of cobalt ccd monochrome. To me it is a good match. 
 

meet Tamara and Renee.

mm with 50cron v3, sl with vl75/1.5
 

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[Olaf_ZG]

And below some portraits with the portra preset. As it is over 15 years ago I shot my last roll of portra, I honestly could not say how portra looks like, the digital wannabe simulations ruined it for me.

That said, the cobalt preset I like till now for usage outside and or with flash. Does it look like portra. Don’t know.

 

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[Guest]

Cobalt are releasing a new series of 'Elite' profiles, presumably measurably closer to the original film stock. I don't care about that, as I am not shooting film, but like what I am seeing so far - regardless. Examples below are all with the 'Velvia 50 - NB' preset from the new 'Elite Fuji Pos.' pack that came out today. Lightroom Classic, no editing besides small global exposure changes.

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Edited June 21, 2023 by mzbe

[Guest]

Comparison Adobe Standard profile and Cobalt Elite Fuji Velvia50 NB:

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[Guest]

Something I like about the new 'Elite' profiles is that even at '100% strength' applied in Lightroom, the changes are not over the top (Velvia example above has more impact than most, due to the nature of the 'emulated' film).

E.g. one of my physical film favorites for people photography is Provia 400X. Here is an example with the Cobalt Elite version. You can debate for this shot if you prefer it over the Adobe profile; my point is that the profile clearly is not a gimmick, but aims to be useful for professional use. Comparison, Adobe first, Cobalt second:

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Hallo,

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[Guest]

Cobalt released a new 'Elite Niche' black & white pack today.

With the Elite packs, they are currently my favorite solution for Lightroom 3rd party 'film' profiles. For all the B&W profiles, they also provide linear (= flat contrast) and color filter versions (red, yellow, ...).

Comparison (Cobalt PanF 50 on top, Adobe Monochrome at the bottom):

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