Show Us Your Mad Skills: M10 B&W Conversions

[Erato]

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Another 8-Elements reference shot on the M10M, FYR.

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Edited May 2, 2021 by Erato

[Guest Nowhereman]

Morning tropical light at 7:30. As an experiment, I used the Mastin Labs Tri-X preset for the image below (as a strarting point), and to simplify the composition through tonality. You can see a color version, here.

M9-P | Summicron 35v4 | ISO 640 | f/5.6 | 1/30 sec | Wiang Pa Pai, Chiang Rai Province | Thailand

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[anickpick]

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[Gelatino]

M10  Summilux 50 ASPH

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[Guest Nowhereman]

M10 | DR Summicron 50 | ISO 200 | f/5.6 | 1/350 sec | Wiang Pa Pao, Chiang Rai, Thailand

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[Harvard Kiwi]

Thank you to everyone posting on this thread. I felt like a bit of a twat as I bought my M10 for the Leica colours, and while they are amazing, most of my photography now is B&W. 

Your photos are inspirational!

[gtownby]

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7 hours ago, Harvard Kiwi said:

Thank you to everyone posting on this thread. I felt like a bit of a twat as I bought my M10 for the Leica colours, and while they are amazing, most of my photography now is B&W. 

Your photos are inspirational!

Thanks for that, HK. I'm honored with all the postings to this topic after my OP. There really are pros and cons on the Monochrom versus full-color sensor when aiming for B&W final images. Here's a Silver Efex Pro conversion from my M9 with the APO-Cron 50.

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Edited May 14, 2021 by gtownby

[250swb]

Ok it's a small sample compared with the M10M thread, but on the whole these are much better. The difference being the M10 conversions are less about demonstrating the sensor but about demonstrating what you can do with it by converting colour into B&W. All to often the M10M photos are a demonstration of the B&W sensor and not daring to steer away from the plug ugly results.

[Guest Nowhereman]

In this image of planted teak trees, in an early morning fog I was concerned about highlight rendition and fall-off.

M10 | Summaron-M 1:5.6/28 | ISO 200 | f/5.6 | 1/60 sec | Wiang Pa Pao, Thailand

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[OR120]

On 5/2/2021 at 10:06 AM, Rick in CO said:

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My White Bicycle

[Guest Nowhereman]

Actually, the conversion from the M10 that I like the best is the one below, which I've posted before elsewhere. Same plantation as in post #29, also in early morning fog, with lamyai (longan) trees.

M10 | DR Summicron 50 | ISO 200 | f/4.0 | 1/350 sec | Wiang Pa Pao, Chiang Rai Province | Thailand

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[david strachan]

Some super conversions here.  Every bit as good as Leica Monochromes, and often better than film.  Film often has grain, which, for me is, and was always a fault.

 

Lets see some more conversions.

[Harvard Kiwi]

It really comes down more to the photographer more than the camera as usual.

Having an eye and understanding of what an image will look like in black and white or monochrome (they aren't necessarily the same thing from what I have learned).

Identifying lines, shapes, dramatic lighting and textures is key without the distraction of bright colours that draw your eye and cause you to miss a lot of the more interesting details.

Saturation and hue have no bearing, but being able to identify the brightess of objects and their colours (which is different to hue) to get a nice contrasty look. There's a fascinating B+H seminar on YouTube that demonstrates this.

Then if required, making an effort in post beyond clicking on 'convert to black and white' or sliding saturation all the way down. Adjustments of exposure, highlights, shadows, contrast, dodging and burning etc to really make an image stand out. 

As much as I'd love to have a Monochrom, and cedtainly see why some have chosen to purchase one, I simply cannot see a personal justification for going down that path at this stage, and that is as a primarily B&W photographer. 

I'll look at converting some of my images to meet the 2.44mb size restriction as I feel bad just sharing words and not images. My images are no better than anyone else's here but I love being part of this community and want to play my part. 

[gtownby]

2 hours ago, Harvard Kiwi said:

It really comes down more to the photographer more than the camera as usual.

Having an eye and understanding of what an image will look like in black and white or monochrome (they aren't necessarily the same thing from what I have learned).

Identifying lines, shapes, dramatic lighting and textures is key without the distraction of bright colours that draw your eye and cause you to miss a lot of the more interesting details.

Saturation and hue have no bearing, but being able to identify the brightess of objects and their colours (which is different to hue) to get a nice contrasty look. There's a fascinating B+H seminar on YouTube that demonstrates this.

Then if required, making an effort in post beyond clicking on 'convert to black and white' or sliding saturation all the way down. Adjustments of exposure, highlights, shadows, contrast, dodging and burning etc to really make an image stand out. 

As much as I'd love to have a Monochrom, and cedtainly see why some have chosen to purchase one, I simply cannot see a personal justification for going down that path at this stage, and that is as a primarily B&W photographer. 

I'll look at converting some of my images to meet the 2.44mb size restriction as I feel bad just sharing words and not images. My images are no better than anyone else's here but I love being part of this community and want to play my part. 

MK - Just export your DNG to jpg with a “long side” around 1200 and your file size should work.

[Guest Nowhereman]

I thought I'd repeat a post that I made in another thread:
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...I think that current digital cameras are good enough to stay away from consumerism and the type of continuous upgrade path that was almost necessary in the earlier days of digital cameras; in the sense that it's better for one's photography to stay with one camera longer and avoid having to keep on learning how to shoot with new cameras and process their files.

This is one of the reasons I have not been interested in replacing my M10 by the M10-R or M10-M. A future M11 could tempt me if it could render highlights more like negative film does, so that, when shooting into the light or with strong sidelight, you don't have to underexpose (expose to for the highlights) and lift shadows as much as you have to with the M10. However, my feeling is that Leica could achieve much of this by an M10 firmware upgrade — by applying a different curve to the DNG files that would distribute the available dynamic range more evenly between highlights and shadows: currently more of the dynamic range goes to the shadows than to the highlights. This would produce a lower contrast, flatter file. For people who want straight out of camera images, Leica could provide JPGs like those of the Ricoh GR III (like "Hi-Contrast B&W" and "Positive Film"): also, these JPG presets are are highly adjustable in-camera by the user, providing great flexibility, somewhat like having your own version of a film.

To put all this into context, consider that Daido Moriyama — who regularly, exhibits large prints of 150x100cm (60x40 inches) — currently shoots, according to Japanese websites, with a Nikon Coolpix, a discontinued P&S camera with a 1/ 2.3 inch sensor, 16 MP,  and a 25-500mm EFOV zoom lens that produces only JPGs. Here is a quote from a January 2021 article on a Japanese website: "I once interviewed Daido Moriyama about the Ricoh GR. The last thing he said to me was "Akagi-san, when you meet someone from Ricoh, tell them to put a zoom lens on the GR". I asked him, 'What?'.  Then, when I asked him why he said with a wry smile, "Because a zoom lens is convenient." Well, there was no way I could argue with a legend of the photography world...By the way, Daido Moriyama's favorite camera now is the COOLPIX S7000. If you are interested in it, please look it up [laugh]." — Incidentally, one of the things that Moriyama likes about digital cameras is the possibility of using both color and B&W versions of shots,
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[Harvard Kiwi]

There are plenty of images taken with lesser cameras that will be considered great even when the M20 is out. While I kind of get pixel peeping in some scenarios, it's the least important factor in what makes an image great. 

Having said that, I just watched a YouTube video by the mathphotographer on comparisons between colour and monochrom cameras in B&W (with colours being converted). The images compared were with the Q2 but the overall point should remain with the Ms. 

At base ISO, the differences were negligible. At 3 stops underexposed, then brought back up in post, the Monochrom performed slightly better.  The biggest difference was in shooting with ISO 12,500 where the Monochrom produced significantly sharper images with a lot less noise. As someone who does a lot of night street work, I see this as being of value to me. 

I would have liked to have seen the effects of noise reduction in post, just out of curiosity.

Having said all that, I'm not completely against noise (some cameras have better shaped noise than others which can be a little film-grain like) as I like character in an image.

There are some times where I may want a clinical sharp look for a particular subject so I may consider this to be an option in years to come. I'm certainly not looking at abandoning my M10 for B&W photography anytime in the forseeable future. 

I also think it's awesome that Daido Moriyama uses the S7000 and clearly proves that it is more to do with the person than the gear (I'm not saying there is anything wrong with an S7000). In fact, I may do a project for fun, trying to find a "crappy" early digital camera, and spend a weekend walking around to see what I'm really capable of as a B&W photographer.

[Guest Nowhereman]

Ultimately, it seems to me that  @250swb above, is saying it's all about the look and, by extension, the emotion, rather than showing of the resolution or the alleged dynamic range of the sensor. Shooting into bright light is a challenge. With negative film, one exposed for the shadows and let the highlights fall where they may; with slide film one shot for the highlights and let the shadows go black, if necessary. These are two very different looks, but preferable to trying to get everything to show that the sensor can capture — all of which wouldn't show in a print anyway.

The three images below are about dealing with the highlights. The first one is shot from deep shade into noonday, tropical light that hurts your eyes if you don't wear sunglasses. The second is similar but with more details showing in the highlights. The third one is shot under an overcast, but luminous, sky; the "bleeding of the light of the fluorescent lights happens especially in high humidity.

M10 | Summaron-M 1:5.6/28 | ISO 3200 | f/5.6 | 1/250 sec | Bangkok

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M10 | Summaron-M 1:5.6/28 | ISO 800 | f/5.6 | 1/350 sec | Bangkok

M10 | Summaron-M 1:5.6/28 | ISO 6400 | f/5.6 | 1/160 sec | Bangkok________________________
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[250swb]

I think you only need to look at the work of Magnum photographer Trent Parke to see that highlights aren't something to fear, in many cases blown highlights are an intrinsic and artistic element of his images. It's good to see Nowehereman working with the language of photography which is something above and beyond the technique, but you can't generally use one without knowing the other.

Edited May 16, 2021 by 250swb

[Harvard Kiwi]

My images are certainly not up to the same high standard as those that have posted before me. I still have a lot to learn about lighting and am still practicing my rangefinder focusing being new to the system. I'll share what I have taken in my first few weeks because you are all so inspirational and I look forward to making progress. In fact, photography has always been personal to me and this is the first time I have ever shared online.

I like this because it contrasts the freedom in the mural with the constraints of COVID.

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Edited May 18, 2021 by Harvard Kiwi

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[Harvard Kiwi]

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