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Summicron 50mm f2 vs Summarit 50mm f2.5


Loomis77

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12 hours ago, wda said:

Unfortunately, you have left it a bit late to seek redress from the vendor. But the performance of both lenses should be very similar. Frankly, I am not sure why you replicated this focal length. Half a stop is nothing with modern software to play with. As you have proved, the Summarit is no slouch.

Thanks. I agree, the Summarit is no slouch. No particular reason for wanting this lens but I always read great things about the Summicrons and frankly the built in hood also tempted me since I find the square hood bulky;-) It also has a bluish color cast when shooting in certain angles without it.

I do like 50mm and that's another reason for getting it;-)

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11 hours ago, lct said:

I own both lenses. Both are similarly sharp at f/2.8 and on but, to me at least, the charm of the Summicron lies at f/2 where it is a bit softer. Perfect for gentle portraits so f/2 is my favorite aperture on this lens. Now if you're after a sharper lens at all apertures better keep the Summarit as suggested by @wda

It's nice to know that the softness is a characteristica of this lens. I do like sharp images and also like to shoot wide open. I'll probably keep both lenses since it is a favorite focal length. 

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2 hours ago, iau said:

It's nice to know that the softness is a characteristica of this lens. I do like sharp images and also like to shoot wide open. I'll probably keep both lenses since it is a favorite focal length. 

Softness is relative. Remains a sharp lens anyway, on the centre of the frame at least. It has just less micro contrast than more modern designs, the same way as other Mandler lenses generally. If you find your lens too soft it may be that it needs some calibration, especially if it comes from the pre-digital era. Sending it for 6-bit coding may suffice to get such a calibration.

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5 hours ago, lct said:

Softness is relative. Remains a sharp lens anyway, on the centre of the frame at least. It has just less micro contrast than more modern designs, the same way as other Mandler lenses generally. If you find your lens too soft it may be that it needs some calibration, especially if it comes from the pre-digital era. Sending it for 6-bit coding may suffice to get such a calibration.

Thanks. I guess what made me wonder was reading about back focusing and front focusing, and if my lens needed calibration. My M10 just got back from CLA this Summer, and none of my other lenses has felt soft or miss focused. It's just that for calibration I have to send it to Germany;-) It is 6-bit coded and I believe not that many years old (not pre digital).

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4 minutes ago, iau said:

Thanks. I guess what made me wonder was reading about back focusing and front focusing, and if my lens needed calibration. My M10 just got back from CLA this Summer, and none of my other lenses has felt soft or miss focused. It's just that for calibration I have to send it to Germany;-) It is 6-bit coded and I believe not that many years old (not pre digital).

Easy way to check back or front focus is to to use an EVF if you have one. Otherwise you may wish to show us a photo (a dng file if possible) that you feel is too soft and we can tell you if it is normal for a 50/2 v5.

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  • 1 month later...

I've almost decided to stay with the Summarit and sell the Summicron. Partly because I prefer 35mm and don't need two 50s. To illustrate my example I have attached a Lightroom screengrab at 100% comparing the Summicron and Summarit. I know it's not a DNG but I think it shows what I mean. 

The focus is on the reflection in the eye. ISO is 1600 and full apperture (2 and 2.5). The Summicron shutterspeed is 1/125 while the Summarit is 1/90, according to the EXIF. There's always a chance that I didn't focus correctly, but is the softness typical for this lens? I live in a dry climate and the lens is in mint condition with no signs of fongus or anything on the lens. I used a UV-filter on both, not the same, but they both looks "clean" (B+W). I believe some of the fur around the eye should have been sharp if it was a slight back focus or miss focus. All my test shots with the Summicron were like this (soft, rounded reflection). If this is a characteristica of this lens, I'd feel more comfortable when selling it:-)

 

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If I may say so, not exactly a scientific or realistic test. This is not a subject I would shoot at the fastest aperture. But you have convinced yourself, and that is a valid enough reason.  Both lenses are excellent. I am a great believer in rotating my lenses, so each one experiences practical use, and stimulates my interest.

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2 hours ago, iau said:

I've almost decided to stay with the Summarit and sell the Summicron. Partly because I prefer 35mm and don't need two 50s. To illustrate my example I have attached a Lightroom screengrab at 100% comparing the Summicron and Summarit. I know it's not a DNG but I think it shows what I mean. 

The focus is on the reflection in the eye. ISO is 1600 and full apperture (2 and 2.5). The Summicron shutterspeed is 1/125 while the Summarit is 1/90, according to the EXIF. There's always a chance that I didn't focus correctly, but is the softness typical for this lens? I live in a dry climate and the lens is in mint condition with no signs of fongus or anything on the lens. I used a UV-filter on both, not the same, but they both looks "clean" (B+W). I believe some of the fur around the eye should have been sharp if it was a slight back focus or miss focus. All my test shots with the Summicron were like this (soft, rounded reflection). If this is a characteristica of this lens, I'd feel more comfortable when selling it:-)

 

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Little sense to compare one lens at f/2.5 to another one at f/2 with respect. You may wish ro redo your test at the same aperture to be fair. 

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1 hour ago, lct said:

Little sense to compare one lens at f/2.5 to another one at f/2 with respect. You may wish ro redo your test at the same aperture to be fair. 

Thanks, I understand what you mean and agree:-). I did take some with the Summicron at the same aperture, but still very much the same result - that I don't manage to get the focus area sharp even when I appeared to get the focus right. If I hadn't seen other very sharp shots with this lens, I would just have thought of it as a lens characteristica, but guess my lens somehow needs calibration for focus accuracy. 

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2 hours ago, wda said:

If I may say so, not exactly a scientific or realistic test. This is not a subject I would shoot at the fastest aperture. But you have convinced yourself, and that is a valid enough reason.  Both lenses are excellent. I am a great believer in rotating my lenses, so each one experiences practical use, and stimulates my interest.

I know it's just a quick comparison, but this is the only lens that I feel let down by. I believe after extensive "real world" use and tests my lens is in need of calibration or a CLA. Other shots I have seen with this lens have been sharp wide open. I can't believe I constantly miss-focus with just this lens;-) 

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16 hours ago, iau said:

I know it's just a quick comparison, but this is the only lens that I feel let down by. I believe after extensive "real world" use and tests my lens is in need of calibration or a CLA. Other shots I have seen with this lens have been sharp wide open. I can't believe I constantly miss-focus with just this lens;-) 

Have you established whether your lens is just lack lustre at f/2 or whether it has a consistent back or front focus? Perhaps you could shoot an easy to focus target with enough detail in front and behind it to determine if there is any font/back focus. Perhaps even post a link to these DNG file/s.

The Summicron-M 50mm does have stronger focus shift (rearwards) when stopping down. More than the CV 50/1.5 II. It's enough to loose focus on the subject. I don't think the Summarit has this issue, but I can't confirm since I have no experience with this lens. 

 

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