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James Nachtwey

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Is selling prints of human suffering for $10,000 part of this "style"? Isn't there an inkling of exploitation there? Or is criticism of the guns n' starvation school of journalism entirely unwelcome and off limits? Never mind, I already know the answer....

 

The man has to eat. Also don't forget that after the initial sale, the prices for prints go up as they re resold etc.

 

Nachtwey has done an enormous amount of good for all sorts of people and causes. He's about as far away from an explotive vulture as you could be. After the crap he's been through he deserves some financial security. He's also not getting any younger (not that, that appears to be slowing him down). Give the man a break.

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thrid, maybe we were sitting next to each other, but then were 500 or so other people!

 

My biggest problem with the BBC is the anti-Semitism (and I'm not a Semite of any kind.) By American journalistic standards (which I know are not world-wide standards) the BBC is extraordinarily left-wing and arrogant, but their point-of-view is easily accounted for, and that makes their news casts usually entertaining and amusing and informative.

JC

 

the BBC is actually regarded not only widely, but widely internationally, as being one of the most even handed news organisations. Your comment says more about american standards than it does about the bbc.

As for anti-semitism, sorry but you are failing to distinguish between anti-semitism and legitimate criticism of israel.The failure to distinguish between these two fundamentally different things is IMHO the single biggest thing preventing progress in the middle east.

 

 

By the way, Nachtwey is running a workshop in Bangkok in November

Welcome to Harvey Nachtwey Photo Workshops

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Hank, With all due respect, the American media go out of their way to provide the public with the most negative reporting not only about Iraq but any story that might challenge the current Establishment. It may be a perception in the ROW that we are being fed propaganda but I assure you that is not the case.

 

 

I'm sorry, but that's wrong. In fact the situation is a lot worse than most people think it is.

Talk to some journalists who have been over there and have them show you some of their footage or shots. It's off the scale bad.

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I don't even know where to begin..so I won't I'll just get my guns and chewin tobacco and go to the house.

 

I'm sorry we hijacked a thread about a remarkable photographer.

 

You didn't hijack the thread at all. It is simply not possible to view and discuss the work of James Nachtwey without discussing politics and the impact of political actions on people of the world. To discuss his work in a vacuum and not include the political ramifications would be a disservice. After all, he is not trying to produce pretty pictures. He is making very strong statements with his cameras.

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...but you have to understand that as an American, you don't see the impact Bush has had on the world in the same way as when you live in another country.

 

Carsten--Don't underestimate us. Many people in this country see clearly the negative impact of the Bush policies and actions and we are incredibly frustrated about the situation. Many of the people who voted for him (and I was not one of them) now acknowledge they made a horrible mistake. A few days ago I visited a close friend who has always been one of the most conservative, right-wing Republicans I know and he admitted to me that he can't even stand to look at Bush anymore. He hates listening to him, reading about him and seeing him on the news because of the damage he has done in the middle east and to the reputation of this country. He has damn little support left here and most of us can't wait to send him back to Texas permanently--not just for one of his many vacations.

 

I wish someone would sit Bush down and make him watch a documentary about Nachtwey and his work. We all know he doesn't read, but perhaps just looking at pictures is within the man's mental grasp. Then again, there is the comprehension factor. I don't suppose Bush would look at any Iraq photos by Nachtwey or anyone else and make a conncection to his own actions.

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The only issue I have with Nachtwey was the size of his prints at a Fahey Klein show I saw a couple years ago in LA. I had the same problem with a Eugene Richards show at the Leica gallery in NY as well. I felt that blowing these disturbing images up to mural size doesn't make them any more impactful and left me with a foul taste in my mouth (and not because of the subject matter). It's an art world thing, I know, to want everything bigger, but a picture of a Pakistani drug addict in the gutter or a Vietnamese girl suffering from Agent Orange defects didn't need to be 4 foot by 6 foot. A 16x20 (or less) would allow for the suffering to be on a more intimate scale and not reek of art world exploitation.

 

That said certain images did work large, but they tended to be the more iconic large groups of people, landscape etc. The more stylised images.

 

Anyway, that's my only beef with this great man. I certainly don't have a problem with his print prices if that's what the market bears. What he does doesn't come cheap, both in financial and personal terms. Not many of us with our precious 30K of Leica camera gear have to deal with grenades being thrown in our vehicles. A bit different than being upset about not getting a 5K Noctilux to focus properly wide open.

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I second "War Photographer." I saw it at the Art Institute in Chicago and then purchased the DVD. Very powerful and inspiring. It really makes you question what you're doing with your own photography.

 

It looks to me like he uses primes, because he's frequently changing lenses.

 

I looked into buying his print of the Afgan woman in the graveyard. The going rate for a 16x20 was $10,000 USD.

 

John

 

John,

the going rate from where? I dont see much evidence of Nachtwey selling prints directly, or via VII.

For those wanting to buy prints, you could always spend 10, or even 100 times as much on a Gursky print of an empty carpark. Much higher price, MUCH lower value..??

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I second "War Photographer." I saw it at the Art Institute in Chicago and then purchased the DVD. Very powerful and inspiring. It really makes you question what you're doing with your own photography.

 

It looks to me like he uses primes, because he's frequently changing lenses.

 

I looked into buying his print of the Afgan woman in the graveyard. The going rate for a 16x20 was $10,000 USD.

 

John

 

Just a note, he still shoots Leicas from time to time as far as I know. The shot you are talking about was taken on Tri-X. I know because his printer, Brian Young, was my darkroom instructor at ICP. He used several Nachtwey prints as examples during the class. They are incredible in person.

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Hank, With all due respect, the American media go out of their way to provide the public with the most negative reporting not only about Iraq but any story that might challenge the current Establishment. It may be a perception in the ROW that we are being fed propaganda but I assure you that is not the case.

 

Mike--Please define for us exactly who are "the American media." Are they not our sons and daughters, friends and acquaintences who go through journalism schools all over the country, then get jobs at newspapers and television & radio news groups? Last time I looked, there were no political, social or ethnic tests for people to get into journalism schools here. You speak of "the American media" as if it were some amalgam of muck hell bent on giving the rest of us dopes a one-sided description of events they report on.

 

In this country, at least, the media are US!

 

Best Regards,

Brent (a J-school grad)

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My biggest problem with the BBC is the anti-Semitism (and I'm not a Semite of any kind.)

 

You just cannot make a truly outrageous statement like that without backing it up. Please provide a definition of anti-semitism, and an incontrovertible example of the BBC's anti-semitism.

 

By American journalistic standards (which I know are not world-wide standards) the BBC is extraordinarily left-wing and arrogant, but their point-of-view is easily accounted for, and that makes their news casts usually entertaining and amusing and informative.

 

The BBC is known world-wide for being politically centered and almost neutral to a fault. I cannot imagine what world you live in to make the kinds of statements you do. Do you find Bush leaning a little too far to the left for your taste?

 

Except for the anti-Semitism, which is clear to anyone who has spent any time in the Middle East.

 

I have spent some time in the middle east, and absolutely do not agree with what you say. An ex-girlfriend of mine was Israeli, and she did not either. It is quite valid to criticise Israel's handling of the Palestinian population as being overly heavy-handed. Israel relies quite heavily on its military might.

 

Perhaps the fastest way to turn around the never-ending cycle of violence in the middle east would be for the U.S.A. to stop selling weapons to everyone involved. Pretty soon all the various nations would be so paranoid about their loss of a steady stream of weapons that they would start looking for a more stable peace and workable compromises. There are just too many weapons down there.

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Carsten--Don't underestimate us.

 

Yeah, I phrased that badly. Obviously anyone in the States who wants to dig a bit and can keep their preconceived notions in check can find out what is going on. Almost everyone I know in the States is intelligent and compassionate, and some are even Republicans

It is clearly not necessary to support Bush, even as a republican. He has done more damage to international relations and internal politics than anyone else will in a long time (hopefully).

 

To the republicans here, I am not beyond respecting a decent republican president, but Bush and his government are not good examples here. His father was fine, if too conservative for my taste, but this one is a disaster.

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John,

the going rate from where? I dont see much evidence of Nachtwey selling prints directly, or via VII.

For those wanting to buy prints, you could always spend 10, or even 100 times as much on a Gursky print of an empty carpark. Much higher price, MUCH lower value..??

 

You're right, Guy. Poorly worded on my part. Just to be clear, that was the gallery price, and I don't know if they represent Nachtwey or are selling on the after-market.

 

I was not impuning the price or Nachtwey's integrity, but was just sharing what I thought would be interesting to the group. Sorry if it appeared critical. That wasn't my intention at all. I admire Nachtwey and his work so much.

 

John

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You just cannot make a truly outrageous statement like that without backing it up. Please provide a definition of anti-semitism, and an incontrovertible example of the BBC's anti-semitism.

The BBC is known world-wide for being politically centered and almost neutral to a fault. I cannot imagine what world you live in to make the kinds of statements you do. Do you find Bush leaning a little too far to the left for your taste?

 

I'm actually a liberal Democrat and have little time for Bush. Your regard for the BBC apparently exceeds that even of Parliament, which not too long ago was calling for investigations on serious charges of bias and misrepresentation.

 

I don't have time for a long discussion of anti-Semitism on a thread on James Nachtwey, but if you really want chapter and verse, read a book titled "The Other War," and sub-titled, "Israelis, Palestinians, and the Struggle for Media Supremacy." It's written by Stephanie Gutmann, a graduate of Columbia University and a former reporter for the LA Times, neither of which is known as a bastion of conservatism. Perhaps it will open your mind a bit, about BBC reporting. I'm a former journalist, and was quite a serious one, in fact, and my problems with the BBC and other sources like it (Reuters) have more to do with a sense of professionalism that any political allegiance. I sat in a hotel in Jersulaem once, on the way out of the country from an archaeological dig, and watched the BBC and CNN stir up a riot which otherwise wouldn't have taken place...took them four days, and in the end, it wasn't much of a riot, but they got film at 10...(This was the so-called Har Homa crisis.)

 

JC

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Mike--Please define for us exactly who are "the American media." Are they not our sons and daughters, friends and acquaintences who go through journalism schools all over the country, then get jobs at newspapers and television & radio news groups? Last time I looked, there were no political, social or ethnic tests for people to get into journalism schools here. You speak of "the American media" as if it were some amalgam of muck hell bent on giving the rest of us dopes a one-sided description of events they report on.

 

In this country, at least, the media are US!

 

Best Regards,

Brent (a J-school grad)

 

I think he's referring to the likes of Rupert Murdoch and the other 5 or 6 people that control the majority of news outlets in the US and use them as propaganda outlets for their own personal positions. That or they dump everything down, because hard news is more expensive to do than reporting about the latest Paris Hilton scandal.

 

Most journalists that I know are sick of that nonsense, but they don't call the shots. The people at the top do. Who knows, some day we may see an uprising of the journalists.

 

Personally I think the government should go back to limiting how many news outlets an individual or company can control. Basically the way it was up until the 80's. Things are out of control and it's a harm to the country. We need an independent 4th branch.

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I don't have time for a long discussion of anti-Semitism on a thread on James Nachtwey, but if you really want chapter and verse, read a book titled "The Other War," and sub-titled, "Israelis, Palestinians, and the Struggle for Media Supremacy." It's written by Stephanie Gutmann, a graduate of Columbia University and a former reporter for the LA Times, neither of which is known as a bastion of conservatism.

 

I have just read three summaries and reviews of the book, and can instantly see that she is writing with an agenda. Amazon, Barnes&Noble and a place called tikkun.org. Her phrasing is highly polarising.

 

For the record, I think that what the PLO, Hamas, Hisbollah and so on are doing is absolutely disgusting. I will never raise my voice in support of terrorism of any kind. However, the Israeli government goes overboard in the opposite direction, and uses massive force again and again, which is no less disgusting. Trapped in the middle are very many regular Israeli citizens as well as Arabs who simply wish for a country to live in which belongs to them, and peace. The hardliners are running both sides, and for someone like Gutmann to consistently take the one side versus the other (at least in all the excerpts I could find), is inexcusable, and poor journalism.

 

Anyway, I can hardly think of an issue more polarising or devoid of common sense than this conflict (except possibly abortion), so that will be my last word on this matter. Be careful who you call a racist though.

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I think he's referring to the likes of Rupert Murdoch and the other 5 or 6 people that control the majority of news outlets in the US and use them as propaganda outlets for their own personal positions. That or they dump everything down, because hard news is more expensive to do than reporting about the latest Paris Hilton scandal.

 

Most journalists that I know are sick of that nonsense, but they don't call the shots. The people at the top do. Who knows, some day we may see an uprising of the journalists.

 

Personally I think the government should go back to limiting how many news outlets an individual or company can control. Basically the way it was up until the 80's. Things are out of control and it's a harm to the country. We need an independent 4th branch.

 

 

You and I are in complete agreement here.

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I think he's referring to the likes of Rupert Murdoch and the other 5 or 6 people that control the majority of news outlets in the US and use them as propaganda outlets for their own personal positions. That or they dump everything down, because hard news is more expensive to do than reporting about the latest Paris Hilton scandal.

 

Most journalists that I know are sick of that nonsense, but they don't call the shots. The people at the top do. Who knows, some day we may see an uprising of the journalists.

 

Personally I think the government should go back to limiting how many news outlets an individual or company can control. Basically the way it was up until the 80's. Things are out of control and it's a harm to the country. We need an independent 4th branch.

 

Boy, I couldn't disagree more...the last thing we need is to have the government involved in policing the media.

Why is it that most artists (music, actors, painters, ect) are so liberal, some real liberal? (not that theres anything wrong with that), and don't say because the're smarter :-)

I'm I the only conservative republican on this forum?

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Why is it that most artists (music, actors, painters, ect) are so liberal, some real liberal? (not that theres anything wrong with that), and don't say because the're smarter :-)

 

Because art by it's nature tends towards change and replacing the current. Conservatives by their nature want the opposite and keep things as they are, or replace things with 'the way they were', which normally corresponds to their late adolescence/early 20s. The _great_ artists whether they be from the visual arts or the field of music, or any other field for that matter, are great because they 'pushed the envelope'.

 

Artistically conservatives are generally dinosaurs.

 

A generalisation of course, but with more than a strong element of universality to it IMHO.

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I'm I the only conservative republican on this forum?

 

Mike you can't be a conservative and a Republican. Aren't conservatives for small government, fiscal responsibility, personal liberty and against nation building and Wilsonian adventures overseas?

 

Sorry I couldn't resist:)

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Mike you can't be a conservative and a Republican. Aren't conservatives for small government, fiscal responsibility, personal liberty and against nation building and Wilsonian adventures overseas?

 

Sorry I couldn't resist:)

 

I'm out of the closet...I'll have to go alias

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