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35mm summicron APO M vs 35mm summilux FLE


BrettW

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Hi,

I’m a Leica newbie and I’m genuinely curious what the overall difference is between these two lenses, is there a noticeable difference? I understand they are two different focal lengths and the APO allows close focusing. Is the APO just better controlled and sharper than the Summilux? Or is it a completely different rendering?

 

 Thanks,

 Brett

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Would be great to know if they managed to fix the chromatic aberrations of the FLE. 

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12 hours ago, BrettW said:

Hi,

I’m a Leica newbie and I’m genuinely curious what the overall difference is between these two lenses, is there a noticeable difference? I understand they are two different focal lengths and the APO allows close focusing. Is the APO just better controlled and sharper than the Summilux? Or is it a completely different rendering?

 

 Thanks,

 Brett

Summilux 35 FLE is 1 full stop faster, where the CA can be corrected in post editing.  The 50 APO has more CA then the summilux in one of the post here, so it's not legendary nor bulletproof.  Sharpness? when both are on f/2, they should be about the same.  I think the most noticeable is the size and weight? 

When 35 FLE just came out, the reviews were God like.  It's all marketing so does this APO, just go with your need.  If you don't shoot in dark nor huge backlit, then any old Leica 35mm (or even VM) work mostly the same. 

Edited by jaeger
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1 hour ago, jaeger said:

Summilux 35 FLE is 1 full stop faster, where the CA can be corrected in post editing.  The 50 APO has more CA then the summilux in one of the post here, so it's not legendary nor bulletproof.  Sharpness? when both are on f/2, they should be about the same.  I think the most noticeable is the size and weight? 

When 35 FLE just came out, the reviews were God like.  It's all marketing so does this APO, just go with your need.  If you don't shoot in dark nor huge backlit, then any old Leica 35mm (or even VM) work mostly the same. 

HI There Jaeger

I'm interested to know where you've seen CA in a post here from the 50 APO - I spent a month trying to get any and completely failed? 

sharpness is different - I would say that the APO shows more detail but is less 'edgy'- and so is the bokeh - the look of the lenses really is quite different

I think the 35 APO - like all of Leica's recent APO standard length lenses has a significantly different look - more pop and more 3d looking. . . whether it matters is another thing!

2 hours ago, sebben said:

Would be great to know if they managed to fix the chromatic aberrations of the FLE. 

As far as I'm concerned there is no CA visible in the 35 APO - at least I've not been able to generate any which isn't quite the same thing!.

 

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I really like the FLE for both film and digital, my only complaint in the (almost ) 10 years I’ve had the lens is the veiling flare it’s prone to. If the APO proves to be significantly better at handling the lighting situations that the FLE can’t, I’d gladly give up the stop of speed and switch. 

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42 minutes ago, jonoslack said:

I'm interested to know where you've seen CA in a post here from the 50 APO - I spent a month trying to get any and completely failed? 

Probably this post? A few posts later he revealed that the second picture was the APO:

 

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One may have a look at Reid Reviews https://www.reidreviews.com

Sean Reid shows comparisons between the new Apo Summicon asph, the Summicron asph. and the Summilux FLE

Having the Summilux FLE I think I shall not go for the new Apo Summicron. Yes, I don‘t often use f/1.4, and yes, the new lens shows more resolution (if you put it on a tripod and eliminate all other individual faults when you take a photo). Yes, the new lens shows less chromatical aberrations - Sean Reid backs Jono’s experience that you wont be able to find any. Though I never happened to find any which bother me with the Summilux. I am sure the new Apo Summicron is the better lens - as I am sure a 1:2.8/35 Apo-Summaron asph. would be even better. 

The „old“ Summicron asph. or the Summilux FLE are the working horses for 35mm in the present Leica lens line; the new Apo-Summicron is the lens for Sundays. 
 

Caveat P.S: There is a general rule that Leica products - lenses as well as cameras - immediately get better when a new model is on the market. Who would say that his camera or lens was worse when he wants to sell it?
 

I follow the second rule: never sell a Leica lens. 

 

 

Edited by UliWer
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I think it honestly depends on how you use your lenses. In my own use, I tend to either be shooting wide open, or stopped down to at least f4. On the 35mm FLE, the 1.4 open aperture gives you better subject isolation and greater light gathering. You are able to shoot in slightly darker conditions, and set off the subject matter a bit more, if that is your desire. When stopped down past f4, the FLE is extremely sharp, and performs very well, even on a 47mp SL2. The CA is certainly there wide open, but in my experience, it has not been too bad, but I imagine it can catch you out in certain compositions.

The 35mm f2 APO will be sharper, most likely at every aperture, even up to 5.6 or f8. F11 or 16 will likely be less sharp due to diffraction. While I have not seen the rendering yet, I do have the 50mm APO SL lens, and my suspicion is that it will have those characteristics: extremely sharp, very smooth, neutral bokeh and a very "clean" rendering. The 35mm FLE is more of a bridge lens between the Mandler rendering and the Karbe rendering. It's formula is quite old at this point (being a opto-mechanical upgrade of the original 35mm Summilux ASPH, which is from 1994).  I think they are both valid choices. Personally, I think the FLE is the more useful lens overall, since it is faster and still had fantastic performance and compact size, while also being less expensive. If absolute maximum resolution is the priority, I think there are better platforms than the M...like the SL2 or medium format cameras. Either lens will outresolve the M10R or M10 Monochrome when past f4 or so. If absolute edge to edge performance is paramount, the 35mm APO is the one to go for.

Edited by Stuart Richardson
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2 hours ago, jonoslack said:

I'm interested to know where you've seen CA in a post here from the 50 APO [...]

I must have posted this a couple years ago but i don't remember where.

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2 hours ago, lct said:

I must have posted this a couple years ago but i don't remember where.

 

 

Wowzers! I've owned mine for many years at this point and I don't recall seeing anything this bad. Any chance there was something else at play with the lens?

I'll have to look back through landscape images to see if I can find anything like this. 

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54 minutes ago, dkmoore said:

Wowzers! I've owned mine for many years at this point and I don't recall seeing anything this bad. Any chance there was something else at play with the lens?

All my apo lenses do the same more or less in case of overexposure. I did it on purpose there and can reproduce it at will. Don't ask me what kind of fringing it may be though. I would vote for LoCa given the purple and green fringes but i may be vastly wrong.

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3 hours ago, lct said:

I must have posted this a couple years ago but i don't remember where.

 

 

You mean you don't need to spend Noctilux Money to make pics like these? I've been robbed!

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  • Minimum Focus Distance, MFD: 0.3m with long focus stroke from 0.3m to 0.7m(APO) versus 0.7m(FLE)
  • 10 Elements in 5 Groups, with three Aspherical Elements(APO) versus 9 Elements in 5 Groups, with one Aspherical Elements
  • 11 aperture blades(APO) versus 9 blades(FLE)
  • Number of aspherical surfaces 4(APO) versus 1(FLE)
  • Hood size and the viewfinder blockage is different
  • Aperture Stop 2.0(APO) outperform Aperture Stop 5.6(FLE), please refer to MTF
  • Size, wight and Dimensions(Length/Diameter) difference
  • Peaceful rendition, neat and clean versus 2nd best choice relatively
  • APO comes with better chromatic aberrations, edge to edge, conner to conner sharpness, while the vignetting control and distortions(Relative/Effective) are similar
  • Apochromatic design employs six anomalous partial color dispersion glass elements while FLE employs three if my memory is correct
  • E39 versus E46 filter thread

Short summaries, technically, FYR.

Please correct me if anything needs to revise.

Edited by Erato
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