Review: The New Leica APO-Summicron-M 35mm F2 ASPH.

[farnz]

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19 minutes ago, Dao De Leitz said:

Actually, the now perfect rangefinder function is the most important thing to me, small particles behind the front lens have no photographic effect, or have they?

Well they're showing up coloured green right along the bottom of your picture so they're having some effect.

Pete. 

[MarkP]

6 hours ago, Fedro said:

it's  stunning lens, you won't regret it

I hope so

i recall that when I first bought the 50 APO-Summicron and ran some comparisons with my other 50s I thought I had made a big mistake buying such an expensive lens with such a small benefit of IQ.  Within a short period of time I realised how good it was.

I was also encouraged to get it when I read Sean Reid’s review of how well it performed on the SL2, virtually indistinguishable from the SL 35 APO-Summicron. So I get the same virtually the same performance on both M and SL2, compact, albeit manual focus.

🙂

Edited September 18, 2021 by MarkP

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[MarkP]

Just now, MarkP said:

I hope so

i recall that when I first bought the 50 APO-Summicron and ran some comparisons with my other 50s I thought I had made a big mistake buying such an expensive lens with such a small benefit of IQ.  Within a short period of time I realised how good it was.

I was also encouraged to get it when I read Sean Reid’s review of how well it performed on the SL2, virtually indistinguishable from the SL 35 APO-Summicron. So I get the same virtually the same performance on both M and SL2, compact, albeit manual focus.

🙂

 

[Jeff S]

14 hours ago, MarkP said:

I was also encouraged to get it when I read Sean Reid’s review of how well it performed on the SL2, virtually indistinguishable from the SL 35 APO-Summicron. So I get the same virtually the same performance on both M and SL2, compact, albeit manual focus.

 

The Leica Miami guys demonstrated the technical superiority of the SL 35 APO with regards to ‘sharpness’ (contrast and details) when shot wide open, particularly at the edges.  
 

See from1:01:30 below…

 

Whether this represents a practical difference in one’s (print) results is a longer discussion.

edit… at 51:30 they also show a difference in shape of bokeh balls between the two lenses. Again, a personal matter whether this is meaningful.

Jeff

Edited September 19, 2021 by Jeff S

[Ouroboros]

On 9/18/2021 at 7:35 PM, Dao De Leitz said:

I had thought a while ago that this lens could be a good addition to my very first lens Summicron-C 2/40mm and therefore also my first 35mm.
Thanks to a hint from a friendly forum member, I simply bought the lens directly from a 'Leica Shop'. I guess single lenses turn out to be non-seller. (;-) 

The lens was completely and totally out of depth of field in the rangefinder function.   (so only play around with M8 IR and new strap)
With much backfocus it was not usable with the rangefinder. Cameras and lens were then taken to Wetzlar for a cure. The lens problem was corrected in a relatively short time. According to Leica, the two cameras were and are within the factory tolerances. Now the rangefinder works and fits perfectly with one camera.

 

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2/35mm, cure visit (two more photos)

 

Unfortunately, it is only now that I have it back in my hands that I have discovered two small particles or fluff behind one of the front lenses. Now that the rangefinder works perfectly with one camera, I  have to decide whether I should have this fixed.

 

You spend £6.7k on a 35mm f2 lens with fluff floating around inside it and you're trying to decide whether 'to get it fixed'........such a difficult one to answer.....

[wlaidlaw]

34 minutes ago, Ouroboros said:

You spend £6.7k on a 35mm f2 lens with fluff floating around inside it and you're trying to decide whether 'to get it fixed'........such a difficult one to answer.....

At that price, when I get back to the UK on Oct 13th, I shall be going over my 35 APO-M with a fine tooth comb (like I did with my 50/0.95 Noctilux, when its focus was found to be a long way out). The tiniest of faults and it will be straight back to Leica UK. With Live view, it is so easy to check RF focus now, no messing about with taking images of the Nikon focus chart like I use to do. 

I do have one lens which currently, needs minor attention: The aperture ring detent spring on my LTM 50 Summilux III e46-S.E. has become very weak, so it is just too easy to change the aperture accidentally by brushing against a sleeve etc. However I don't think that is one for an €800 Wetzlar service but for an £80 job at Camera-works-UK. 

Wilson

[earleygallery]

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On 9/17/2021 at 7:03 PM, mmradman said:

Fingers crossed it was not QC-ed by Mr Magoo.

Mr Magoo seems to be working as normal...........

 

[MarkP]

On 9/19/2021 at 10:43 PM, Jeff S said:

The Leica Miami guys demonstrated the technical superiority of the SL 35 APO with regards to ‘sharpness’ (contrast and details) when shot wide open, particularly at the edges.  
 

See from1:01:30 below…

 

Whether this represents a practical difference in one’s (print) results is a longer discussion.

edit… at 51:30 they also show a difference in shape of bokeh balls between the two lenses. Again, a personal matter whether this is meaningful.

Jeff

Thavks for that link Jeff. Interesting, but too long.  I’m surprised that they were so enamoured with the Sumilux FLE.

Bojeh balls were t a deal breaker for why I wanted this lens. If I want ‘character,’ I go to the older lenses, but I do agree with them that  the 50 Summilux is indeed a lovely lens, and why I’ve not parted with it.

On Sean Reid’s review I found no significant difference in ‘character’ between the 35 APO-M and APO-SL, centre resolution was similar, but slightly in favour of the SL at the periphery.  
 

I can’t use an SL lens on an M camera but I can use an M lens on an M and an SL.

regards

Mark 🙂

 

[Jeff S]

The 35 Summilux FLE has been one of their favorites for a long time (more long videos available). 

We each have different styles and approaches.  I’m happy to only shoot M lenses on my M bodies using RF, while using only SL lenses on the SL2.  All are sufficient for my IQ/print needs; differences are more related to other user aspects. I watch/read reviews more for entertainment, relying on personal use to make my assessments.

Jeff

[darylgo]

On 9/19/2021 at 5:43 AM, Jeff S said:

The Leica Miami guys demonstrated the technical superiority of the SL 35 APO with regards to ‘sharpness’ (contrast and details) when shot wide open, particularly at the edges.  

On a flat wall chart at one distance iirc, perhaps they did a bear test also.  Jeff, I would love to shoot this lens in a real world situation to see if there's field curvature, often times a lens that tests less well on a chart in the corners could be used to advantage with curvature of field moving inward at the edges, especially with a wide angle where objects at distance are so small as to be negligible and the closer objects are rendered sharper because of the curvature.  The 24mm Summilux is a great example of this.  

Edited September 20, 2021 by darylgo

[Herr Barnack]

On 9/13/2021 at 8:55 PM, m410 said:

...

Hi jDD
Thank you for reaching out. I do not have any updates for you at this time. Supply of this lens has been nearly nonexistent since its launch in March, and we are estimating the wait time for individuals will be years, not months, unfortunately. I do not know why these lenses have proven so hard for us to come by either.   I would not factor the lens into any near-future purchasing logistics if I'm to be honest.

...

That's extremely disheartening news for those of us who hope to acquire a copy of the APO 35 Summicron. 

I understand that there were production issues and that the pandemic are factors.  Still, though - the idea of having to wait 4-5 years or longer to get a lens that was released on 3-4-2021 and was supposedly available to buyers leaves a bitter taste - particularly when there will likely be a 5-10% price jump before the lens can actually be purchased and delivered to the buyer.  Who will be left holding the bag on that price increase? 

With a current list price of $8200 USD, a 5-10% price jump inflicted on buyers due to lens unavailability at the time of desired purchase will only serve to heap insult on top of injury. 

Edited September 20, 2021 by Herr Barnack

[Jeff S]

1 hour ago, darylgo said:

On a flat wall chart at one distance iirc, perhaps they did a bear test also.  Jeff, I would love to shoot this lens in a real world situation to see if there's field curvature, often times a lens that tests less well on a chart in the corners could be used to advantage with curvature of field moving inward at the edges, especially with a wide angle where objects at distance are so small as to be negligible and the closer objects are rendered sharper because of the curvature.  The 24mm Summilux is a great example of this.  

As noted, I don’t rely on these types of tests. I just use gear as I normally would, edit and make prints, and make purchase/sale decisions based on that. I don’t print extremely large, nor do I pixel peep at picture edges.  Others’ mileage may vary.  Even then, sample variations can alter results, and of course there are multiple other related gear and processing choices and decisions that can have significant impact on print results.  The link was just FYI for those who want to scrutinize or challenge.

Jeff
 

 

[darylgo]

24 minutes ago, Jeff S said:

 The link was just FYI for those who want to scrutinize or challenge.

Or fodder for forum discussions of minutiae.  

[wlaidlaw]

I doubt if the wait for the 35 APO-M is going to be as long as folks fear. Once Leica recognised that I had lost out over their decision to supply only via Leica owned stores, after a lens had originally been allocated to my dealer in April, then withdrawn after I had paid in full, they reacted very quickly. A lens was produced in only around 10 days, when I fully expected to wait until the end of November or into December and I am duly grateful.

I suspect Leica also recognise that people for whom the lens currently seems very desirable, will get bored with the waiting and transfer their affections (and money) elsewhere, maybe the to new M11. There is therefore a limited window to ramp up production before they start losing out on sales. 

Wilson

Edited September 20, 2021 by wlaidlaw

[Ktsa5239]

Hopefully they dont make any more mistakes while ramping up sales since I've had dust problems 2 out of 2 times..... Fortunately the focus seems to be spot on for both. 

[Herr Barnack]

4 hours ago, wlaidlaw said:

...I suspect Leica also recognise that people for whom the lens currently seems very desirable, will get bored with the waiting and transfer their affections (and money) elsewhere, maybe the to new M11. There is therefore a limited window to ramp up production before they start losing out on sales. 

Wilson

...or maybe to Voigtlander.

[gotium]

Yo, anyone else just notice the *price* on this thing?!?!? Thought maybe it was a typo. 

Edited September 21, 2021 by gotium

[Herr Barnack]

16 minutes ago, gotium said:

Yo, anyone else just notice the *price* on this thing?!?!? Thought maybe it was a typo. 

@gotium Welcome to the Leica Matrix.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited September 21, 2021 by Herr Barnack

[gotium]

38 minutes ago, Herr Barnack said:

@gotium Welcome to the Leica Matrix.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

That would have to be the red pill. Hard one to swallow!

Edited September 21, 2021 by gotium

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[Gelatino]

16 hours ago, Herr Barnack said:

That's extremely disheartening news for those of us who hope to acquire a copy of the APO 35 Summicron. 

I understand that there were production issues and that the pandemic are factors.  Still, though - the idea of having to wait 4-5 years or longer to get a lens that was released on 3-4-2021 and was supposedly available to buyers leaves a bitter taste - particularly when there will likely be a 5-10% price jump before the lens can actually be purchased and delivered to the buyer.  Who will be left holding the bag on that price increase? 

With a current list price of $8200 USD, a 5-10% price jump inflicted on buyers due to lens unavailability at the time of desired purchase will only serve to heap insult on top of injury. 

I am on a pre order list since march. Knowing a price "adjustment" was scheduled in April I had asked if the price would be "adjusted" or not. The answer was that the price would be the initial one, and in the case of increase, there would be a compensation in Leica products.  More than seven months later I don't know if that will be still possible.