Remote flash

[elroustom]

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Hi all - new to R system. Absolutely loving it. I’m looking for a flash trigger to use with R5 or R7. Anything there that will also work with TTL? Thanks. 

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[wlaidlaw]

You can use Nikon extension cables, SC-18 or similar on Leicas or alternatively use a flash with an optical slave trigger system and a small triggering flash on the camera. There may also be something available in the Metz system. Leicas use the SCA3502 module which comes from memory, in 5 different generations M1 to M5 (nothing to do or linked to Leica M camera numbers). If you search on the internet, you might be able to find a chart which lists the functionality for each generation of module and which module you need for successive generations of R, M and digital cameras. In general the functionality with digital Leicas is limited and TTL very basic. In general the generations of SCA3502 modules are backwards compatible, so if you were to get one to use with SCA Metz flashes, the 3502-M5 would be the best buy. 

Wilson

[masjah]

Wilson and OP, you've got to be a bit careful here. There are two different Metz SCA system series, namely the 300 series and the 3000 series, and I understand that they are very different, the latter being a digital protocol (digital flash electronics that is to say). The R8 and R9 use the 3000 series. Specifically the 3501 was originally specified for the R8 at the camera's first introduction, and 3502 for the R9, though I'm sure that the later 3502 will be backwards compatible with the R8, because it's main difference is additional support for HSS on the R9. This is apart from the subsidiary M1-M5 iterations on the 3502, which provide additional support for some digital and Leica M cameras. Also I think that some of the Panasonic clone Leica badged digital cameras are different yet again, and use the SCA employed by Panasonic, and not the 3501/3502; (this might also be the Olympus one, but don't quote me here!).

But the appropriate SCA for the earlier R cameras (I think R4 to R7) is the 300 series, and not the 3000 series. The specific adapter, if I recall correctly, is the SCA351. It's all a bit of a minefield.

[wlaidlaw]

John, 

In the last few months I have had to delve into the innards of a Rollei SCA 356 right angle mount module (the accessory shoe on the 2000/3000/6000 Rollei's is on the side of the camera) to make it couple to an 40MZ-2 flash which wants to couple to a later SCA-3XXX series modules. I had to modify the rails in the adapter and glue it all together with a hot glue gun and black glue sticks. I am not convinced it is working properly TTL with my Rolleiflex 3003 but it is working auto and telling the camera a flash is connected, which is good enough. As I already had both the SCA356 and the 40MZ-2, it was not going to cost me anything if it all did not work but I am pleased to say it does. I am not sure which Metz flashes couple to the earlier SCA-3XX modules. I think it might only be the hammerheads 45CL-4 and 60CT-1 and camera mount 40-MZ. The mounting rails for the SCA-3XXX modules are as I say above, different to the SCA 3XX. 

The Panasonic Leicas use the Panasonic/Olympus adapters but even they are a bit odd. I have a Metz 36-AF40 dedicated flash for Panasonic and Olympus cameras, where the flash AF illuminator worked on my wife's now dead Panaleica but does not light up on my EP-5 Olympus but only the camera's quite feeble AF illuminator. I think that Metz rather lost their way over the last 8 years or so before their receivership and were producing less than epic products. The SF58 and SF64 flashes made by Metz for Leica were not great products and the later Nissin built SF40 and 60 are far better.

I had a run in with Metz who told me that the SCA 3502-M5 coupled fully with the M8 and an SCA-54MZ flash, so I bought them. They did not couple properly and it was not possible to alter flash intensity, either on the camera or on the flash. I took mine to Photokino and showed them. They said they must be faulty units and if I came back the next day, they would supply me with replacement working units and borrow a different M8 from the Leica stand to demo. Next day - red faces and apologies from the Metz folk, followed by a full refund from the UK agents, Intro 2020. 

Wilson

 

[masjah]

Wilson, that is very interesting. I've got a 54MZ-3 with an SCA3502 M3 adapter. I often wondered whether you could attach just the later M4 or M5 adapter to my -3 gun and get the additional features, such as being able to do a pseudo TTL pre-flash with my M240. In the end I decided against risking it, partly because the 54MZ was such a big brute, rather top-heavy on any M camera, and partly because my little SF20 worked very well in its own A mode on the few occasions when I needed a flash.(Of course, you have to synchronise the aperture settings.) On an R9 my 54MZ-3 works very well, HSS and all.

In the light of your experience, I'm rather glad I settled for that!

[elroustom]

Great answers everyone - the takeaway comment is « minefield ! »

I’m successfully using a 32CT3 with 351 adapter. Does anyone know if the 551 will work as well? I’m very confused by this Metz system. I once found a chart that broke it all down, but cannot find it again. 
 

So no idea if Metz made a remote trigger? That’s surprising. 
 

Thank you for this discussion.