ELAN Posted January 17, 2021 Share #61 Posted January 17, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) About 15 months ago I bought a like-new 35AA from a collector and made it a user lens. It has since been mounted on my M10 about 75% of the time, replacing the 35 FLE that was my primary lens until then. I much prefer the rendering of the AA to the FLE. Every once in awhile I mount the FLE for a few days just to see if I could tell the difference, and yes, the difference is clear to my eye. Softer, more natural, and the focal plane falloff creates a beautiful 3D effect at close focusing distances. My copy does focus shift ever so slightly between f/2 and f/3.4. I ignore it because my breathing shifts more than that 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted January 17, 2021 Posted January 17, 2021 Hi ELAN, Take a look here Tell me about the 35 Lux AA ?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
evikne Posted January 17, 2021 Share #62 Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 8 hours ago, pippy said: But all lenses have 'character' and "image quality" (n'impotre quoi) is objective. So we're not really going to get anywhere unless you give us a hint as to what you, personally, prefer from your shooting experiences. We have all seen a great may beautiful photographs which you have posted here but can you explain / describe what it is that would influence your specific choice of lens? Rendering? Boke? I'd love to hear your thoughts. Philip. It was probably just poorly expressed, sorry. I just meant that I don't care much about good image quality in the usual sense (sharpest possible from corner to corner, etc.). I have a couple of modern lenses, but I almost exclusively use them wide open, because stopped down I think they are too sharp and characterless. What I like about my older Mandler lenses is not so easy to explain. I probably don't even know it completely myself, but I know it when I see it in a picture. I think it's partly a combination of the gentle rendering, a little nervous and unpredictable bokeh, a texture with a kind of crispness, and the slightly cooler color tones. And when I say "lenses I enjoy to use", I mostly think of size and weight (small and light), design and tactile feel. When I buy lenses, I always let emotions decide, rather than reason (within my financial limits). 😉 Edited January 17, 2021 by evikne 5 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #63 Posted January 17, 2021 10 hours ago, willeica said: Tequila is not essential to deciding on this issue. if you are going to buy vintage Leica lenses, you have to learn about which lenses are priced according to collectibility and those which are priced according to performance. It is as essential as learning about car controls before you learn to drive. A lens like this will very often be bought by people who have no intention of using it. They just want to own it. There is no law anywhere which requires them to use it, however much others may disapprove of this. A glance at this will show that the value of this lens has been increasing as it becomes more difficult to obtain, not because people value the image quality it gives. That said, those who own the lens speak well of it, but there are cheaper options if the image quality is all that you are after. https://collectiblend.com/Lenses/Leitz/35mm-f1.4-Summilux-M-(BM,-black,-aspherical,-1989).html This is an issue which arises at least once a month on this forum. William I suppose you're right. In the case of the lens im trying to buy now (Silver 28 lux), its not so much a collectible. Just a rare lens. And my internal debate is not whether I should get a 28 lux or not, its just wether to get the black version for retail price, or the rare silver one for 1K more, hoping that in the future it will not only retain its value, but also appreciate itself. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #64 Posted January 17, 2021 @evikne I remember that you have a pre aspherical that you love. How does you lens compare to the AA or the Silver Rim? Still struggling to make the difference between all these. The wiki Leica link a member posted above was really useful but didn't mention the "nicknames" of the lens so I couldn't tell which one is which. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
evikne Posted January 17, 2021 Share #65 Posted January 17, 2021 15 minutes ago, Steven said: @evikne I remember that you have a pre aspherical that you love. How does you lens compare to the AA or the Silver Rim? Still struggling to make the difference between all these. The wiki Leica link a member posted above was really useful but didn't mention the "nicknames" of the lens so I couldn't tell which one is which. I'm sorry, I don't know the other two very well. But I'm sure others here can tell you more about them. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted January 17, 2021 Share #66 Posted January 17, 2021 1 hour ago, evikne said: What I like about my older Mandler lenses is not so easy to explain. I'm starting to think of lenses as having a 'signature' which is in some ways rather like a fingerprint. Modern lenses reproduce almost to perfection with excellent performance throughout aperture and focus ranges, producing crisp, detailed images with little trace of aberrations. Older lenses can vary in performance throughout their aperture ranges, often performance drops wide open, and at closer focus, but not always. A good example in the Super-Angulon which has a very sharp, detailed central performance but softens noticeable towards edges and corners. It retains this image quality at closer focus (a more symmetrical design) but has an odd bokeh due to its square aperture diaphragm. It also vignettes. It is a polar opposite to the modern SEM but I find both have their place. Comparison shots on these two ARE distinctly different due to their varied 'signatures'. 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pippy Posted January 17, 2021 Share #67 Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) 1 hour ago, pgk said: I'm starting to think of lenses as having a 'signature' which is in some ways rather like a fingerprint....A good example in the Super-Angulon which has a very sharp, detailed central performance but softens noticeable towards edges and corners. It retains this image quality at closer focus (a more symmetrical design) but has an odd bokeh due to its square aperture diaphragm. It also vignettes... I agree completely. I have the earlier f4 S-A and, like the f3.4, its non-retrofucus design leads to images which, when used with a digital sensor, are not without certain character traits! The 'boke' is different, less 'busy', on account of the f4 having a 9 blade diaphragm. In terms of a lens' 'fingerprint' I'm eagerly awaiting delivery of a 50mm f1.5 Summarit-M which, by most accounts, has a particular way of rendering which sounds really unique. It should complement my Summicron very nicely. Philip. Edited January 17, 2021 by pippy 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted January 17, 2021 Share #68 Posted January 17, 2021 12 hours ago, Steven said: can we see that image you’re referring to ? In the Header, click on 'Favourite images'. Favourite = most liked. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted January 17, 2021 Share #69 Posted January 17, 2021 2 hours ago, Steven said: @evikne I remember that you have a pre aspherical that you love. How does you lens compare to the AA or the Silver Rim? Still struggling to make the difference between all these. The wiki Leica link a member posted above was really useful but didn't mention the "nicknames" of the lens so I couldn't tell which one is which. Huge subject concerning "nicknames" of Leitz/Leica lenses. Just to begin ... "I" Steel Rim first (1960-1966) Steel rim can accept E41 filters then "II" only pre-asph no filter thread Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #70 Posted January 17, 2021 3 hours ago, pedaes said: In the Header, click on 'Favourite images'. Favourite = most liked. Thanks, its actually a beautiful image indeed. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #71 Posted January 17, 2021 (edited) 3 hours ago, pedaes said: In the Header, click on 'Favourite images'. Favourite = most liked. . Edited January 17, 2021 by Steven Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #72 Posted January 17, 2021 2 hours ago, a.noctilux said: Huge subject concerning "nicknames" of Leitz/Leica lenses. Just to begin ... "I" Steel Rim first (1960-1966) Steel rim can accept E41 filters then "II" only pre-asph no filter thread Thank you. This is very useful. So besides the fact than II doesn't accept filters, how is it different from the Steel rim and why does it cost a quarter of the price on the used market? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgk Posted January 17, 2021 Share #73 Posted January 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Steven said: So besides the fact than II doesn't accept filters, how is it different from the Steel rim and why does it cost a quarter of the price on the used market? Not sure that I can answer this other than saying the obvious bit about being more of a collectible, but I would say that if you buy any 35/1.4 pre-aspheric do try to get one with a hood included. The hood which takes Series 7 filters can be difficult to find at a reasonable price and in 'working' condition - by which I mean it isn't distorted so that the two parts won't easily unscrew and screw together again (mine's 'iffy'). I think there are now new replacement versions available from far eastern makers which might solve the problem, but original hoods can go for high prices. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
willeica Posted January 17, 2021 Share #74 Posted January 17, 2021 56 minutes ago, Steven said: So besides the fact than II doesn't accept filters, how is it different from the Steel rim and why does it cost a quarter of the price on the used market? I answered this already above. Just go onto this list and when you are finished counting the number of different 35mm Summilux variants, then go into the individual listings and you will see prices listed under each variant. These are all auction results, reflecting 'good old supply and demand' , which results, in most cases, have been determined according to that criterion rather than whether the lens is 'good' or better'. https://collectiblend.com/Lenses/Leitz/ You keep asking the same question, but you have try to understand the basic message here. William Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kwesi Posted January 17, 2021 Share #75 Posted January 17, 2021 6 hours ago, Steven said: I suppose you're right. In the case of the lens im trying to buy now (Silver 28 lux), its not so much a collectible. Just a rare lens. And my internal debate is not whether I should get a 28 lux or not, its just wether to get the black version for retail price, or the rare silver one for 1K more, hoping that in the future it will not only retain its value, but also appreciate itself. Hi Steven, My sense is that the only silver 28/1.4 lens that is worth buying as an investment - at least in the short term - is the one included in the 100th Anniversary set. Link below. https://lavidaleica.com/content/100th-anniversary-m-sets-and-more Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #76 Posted January 17, 2021 49 minutes ago, willeica said: I answered this already above. Just go onto this list and when you are finished counting the number of different 35mm Summilux variants, then go into the individual listings and you will see prices listed under each variant. These are all auction results, reflecting 'good old supply and demand' , which results, in most cases, have been determined according to that criterion rather than whether the lens is 'good' or better'. https://collectiblend.com/Lenses/Leitz/ You keep asking the same question, but you have try to understand the basic message here. William No need to get worked up mate. Im not asking the same question. I understood that the rarity of a lens makes it more expensive besides its optical quality. I understand the laws of supply and demand. My questions is, beyond the difference in filter thread and the amount of copies produced, is there anything else with the Steel rim that justifies that it costs 4x more? If you still don't understand my questions, will I get the same image quality + character + flaws with the v 1 and v2 or will there be a difference. You don't have to answer to me if you don't want. Im sure someone will ! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #77 Posted January 17, 2021 29 minutes ago, Kwesi said: Hi Steven, My sense is that the only silver 28/1.4 lens that is worth buying as an investment - at least in the short term - is the one included in the 100th Anniversary set. Link below. https://lavidaleica.com/content/100th-anniversary-m-sets-and-more Beautiful lens. Cant find it for sale anywhere. I respectfully disagree though. I think the 28 1.4 Silver anodised made in 300 copies will be worth a lot one day. Prices are already going up. Its a superb lens and I believe it has everything to become a big part of the Leica history. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #78 Posted January 17, 2021 Didn't buy the ebay copy yet because I noticed I would have to pay 2K of import taxes on top since it comes from HK. So sad. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedaes Posted January 17, 2021 Share #79 Posted January 17, 2021 2 minutes ago, Steven said: 28 1.4 Silver anodised made in 300 copies Don't take 300 as finite. Like 500 black chrome 50mm Summilux, Leica will release more if there is demand. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steven Posted January 17, 2021 Author Share #80 Posted January 17, 2021 7 minutes ago, pedaes said: Don't take 300 as finite. Like 500 black chrome 50mm Summilux, Leica will release more if there is demand. That's what I feared too. They have done that in the past with the 50 lux ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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