High ISO SL2-S, α7III, S1, S5

[Chaemono]

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I used the same lens now to ensure same T-stop and I may have to correct an earlier statement that the SL2-S understates the ISO vs. the S5. It's actually the opposite. At ISO 800 with the APO Summicron-M, the same shutter speed and aperture, the S5's picture is darker, the S1 the darkest, followed by the SL2-S, and finally the α7III which produced the brightest picture but also shows the most noise. At these here, the SL2S has lowest, most pleasing noise to my eyes.

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 800 f/4 @1/6 sec.

S1

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S5

 

SL2S

 

a7III

 

 

Edited January 1, 2021 by Chaemono

[lct]

Interesting thank you. Did you plan to do the same at 6400 iso? Just curious.

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[Chaemono]

vor 8 Minuten schrieb lct:

Interesting thank you. Did you plan to do the same at 6400 iso? Just curious.

Yes, up to ISO 50000/51200. Will post later.

[Chaemono]

At ISO 1600 the S1 has the most noise and is the darkest followed by the S5. The Sony shows more noise than the Leica which has the best and most pleasing noise but adjusted for the ISO scale, SL2S and α7III could be on par. Also, note that the Sony doesn't seem to show vignetting like the S1 and S5 do but that's an illusion because its picture is much brighter. The most even exposure across the frame with the APO 50 has the SL2S. I can post a darker Sony picture and the vignetting will then be evident.  

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 1600 f/4 @1/6 sec.

S1

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S5

 

SL2S

 

α7III

Edited January 1, 2021 by Chaemono

[Chaemono]

ISO 3200 is where the SL2S starts to pull slightly ahead and it's not just a difference in brightness at the same exposure and ISO to the α7III any longer, I think. The others have slightly more noise and they are darker, too.

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 3200 f/4 @1/13 sec.

S1

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S5

 

SL2S

 

α7III

[Chaemono]

As ISO rises, it's better to use the SL2S rather than any of the other three cameras with M lenses, IMO, because of vignetting and what I perceive to be color shift in the corners. Plus, the Leica has better ISO 6400 noise.

 

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 6400 f/4 @1/25 sec.

S1

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S5

 

SL2S

 

α7III

Edited January 1, 2021 by Chaemono

[Chaemono]

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At ISO 12500/12800 the SL2S wins for noise and detail, IMO.

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 12500/12800 f/4 @1/50 sec.

S1

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S5

 

SL2S

 

α7III

Edited January 1, 2021 by Chaemono

[Chaemono]

And in case some are wondering what an ISO 12500 file at 1/50 sec. with an M lens on the SL2S looks like that has been processed in LR and then round-tripped to Topaz DeNoise, here it is.

Less compressed JPEG here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/i-fzbkf3J/A

SL2S + APO 50 Summicron-M processed in LR and Topaz DeNoise

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ISO 12500 f/4 @1/50 sec.

[Chaemono]

ISO 25000/25600 now. The Sony loses it on detail resolution. It cannot resolve "Depuis 1936" on top of my dinner. S1 and S5 pictures are darker and, therefore, perhaps more contrasty. SL2S wins, again.

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 25000/25600 f/4 @1/125 sec.

S1

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S5

 

SL2S

 

α7III

[ajmarton1]

The results are quite nuanced.  Especially, when you consider that you can almost fix any raw image in post.  I know the Sony 7SIII is amazing in low light as my son uses it (primarily for video as it is the premiere video camera right not for the Y generation).  He took the alley image at ISO 1250 and 1/40 hand held.  And the girl is at ISO 12800.  Very little noise. 

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[Chaemono]

vor 17 Minuten schrieb ajmarton1:

The results are quite nuanced.  Especially, when you consider that you can almost fix any raw image in post.  I know the Sony 7SIII is amazing in low light as my son uses it (primarily for video as it is the premiere video camera right not for the Y generation).  He took the alley image at ISO 1250 and 1/40 hand held.  And the girl is at ISO 12800.  Very little noise.  

As it should be for noise. It's 12 MPx only. I was comparing 24 MPx BSI sensors. I could have thrown in the Z7 which does worse than any of the cameras shown here.

[OR120]

7 hours ago, Chaemono said:

ISO 25000/25600 now. The Sony loses it on detail resolution. It cannot resolve "Depuis 1936" on top of my dinner. S1 and S5 pictures are darker and, therefore, perhaps more contrasty. SL2S wins, again.

 

No gray card used, AWB by the camera and tried to match in LR, Sharpening 40, zero NR. Less compressed JPEGs here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-pFTMHP/

APO Summicron-M ISO 25000/25600 f/4 @1/125 sec.

S1

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

S5

 

SL2S

 

α7III

Chaemono - thank you very much for these various  ISO camera shots. Most helpful. Do you think the S5 can perform at high ISO as well as the Leica SL2-S - USING ONLY NON-CODED OLDER LEICA M LENSES - such as 35mm M Lux ver2 and 75mm M Lux 1.4?? These would be my two primary M lenses that I will use. 

[Chaemono]

vor einer Stunde schrieb OR120:

Chaemono - thank you very much for these various  ISO camera shots. Most helpful. Do you think the S5 can perform at high ISO as well as the Leica SL2-S - USING ONLY NON-CODED OLDER LEICA M LENSES - such as 35mm M Lux ver2 and 75mm M Lux 1.4?? These would be my two primary M lenses that I will use. 

Noise-wise they are close. There is something going on in the corners with the S5 and M lenses even with the 75 Summicron-M. It looks like color shift. See here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-GChFpc/i-FKkLDvp/A

[Cattoo]

Wow.  Thanks for posting. This is really helpful.

[OR120]

6 hours ago, Chaemono said:

Noise-wise they are close. There is something going on in the corners with the S5 and M lenses even with the 75 Summicron-M. It looks like color shift. See here: https://www.smugmug.com/gallery/n-GChFpc/i-FKkLDvp/A

Thank you Chaemono - it looks like the Panasonic S1 might match up better with the Leica SL2-S - again for me who will only be using older non-coded M lenses. Specifically - my older 35 and 75 f/1.4 lux lenses. I just keep wondering if the SL2-S is worth another 2,400 USD. It seems like the Panasonic S1 edges out the S5 image wise and certainly in the viewfinder. The S1 viewfinder matches the SL2. Me - older eyes - will really benefit right there.

Edited January 3, 2021 by OR120
sp

[Chaemono]

vor 7 Stunden schrieb OR120:

Thank you Chaemono - it looks like the Panasonic S1 might match up better with the Leica SL2-S - again for me who will only be using older non-coded M lenses. Specifically - my older 35 and 75 f/1.4 lux lenses. I just keep wondering if the SL2-S is worth another 2,400 USD. It seems like the Panasonic S1 edges out the S5 image wise and certainly in the viewfinder. The S1 viewfinder matches the SL2. Me - older eyes - will really benefit right there.

Add 400 USD for Kolari UTF conversion. This will reduce smearing in the corners but not vignetting and color shift. So you'll have to spend some time with CornerFix to correct these. Also, consider loss of warranty and ugly as hell combo and you may be better off with the SL2-S, particularly since it has even less noise than the S1 adjusted for the difference in ISO scale.

[lct]

3 hours ago, Chaemono said:

Add 400 USD for Kolari UTF conversion. This will reduce smearing in the corners but not vignetting and color shift. So you'll have to spend some time with CornerFix to correct these. Also, consider loss of warranty and ugly as hell combo and you may be better off with the SL2-S, particularly since it has even less noise than the S1 adjusted for the difference in ISO scale.

I don't need Cornerfix to adjust color shift or vignetting with my Kolari mod A7s. Same with the Kolari mod A73 AFAIK but i have no experience with it. Now i'd prefer the SL2-S if cameras that bulky were my cup of tea. A Kolari mod S5 could possibly be the solution among compact cameras besides Sony but i don't know if Kolari makes a mod for it.

[Chaemono]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb lct:

I don't need Cornerfix to adjust color shift or vignetting with my Kolari mod A7s. Same with the Kolari mod A73 AFAIK but i have no experience with it. Now i'd prefer the SL2-S if cameras that bulky were my cup of tea. A Kolari mod S5 could possibly be the solution among compact cameras besides Sony but i don't know if Kolari makes a mod for it.

Not, yet, but they likely will. I tested it today for corners vs. the SL2-S but it was raining most if the time. Will post in another thread.

[Chaemono]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb lct:

I don't need Cornerfix to adjust color shift or vignetting with my Kolari mod A7s. Same with the Kolari mod A73 AFAIK but i have no experience with it. Now i'd prefer the SL2-S if cameras that bulky were my cup of tea. A Kolari mod S5 could possibly be the solution among compact cameras besides Sony but i don't know if Kolari makes a mod for it.

Posted the first example.

 

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Hallo,

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[OR120]

9 hours ago, Chaemono said:

Add 400 USD for Kolari UTF conversion. This will reduce smearing in the corners but not vignetting and color shift. So you'll have to spend some time with CornerFix to correct these. Also, consider loss of warranty and ugly as hell combo and you may be better off with the SL2-S, particularly since it has even less noise than the S1 adjusted for the difference in ISO scale.

Good points. They gave me a call from my local Leica Store. Have SL2-S's in stock so I go and check it out this week. Reading our Leica Forum - some questions about battery draining to fast - not lasting on the SL2-S. I'll check it out at the store. Chaemono thank you again for all your very helpful insight.