Can we expect an updated lens road map from Leica

[nicci78]

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16 hours ago, Steven said:

As a matter of fact, I have been told that a 28-70 f2.8 SL lens is coming sooner than you think (I am told as soon as mid January), before the 21/24/28, and that it will be nearly half the size of the 24-90. If this is true, it will become an instant best seller. The source of this is the same person who told me 1 month before that the SL2-S was going to be announced on 10.12, when all the internet had no idea until just two days before. Let's see. 

If true it is a good news.  Thanks. 
Leica needs to release smaller zooms, more akin to APO-Summicron-SL size. 
Using same E67 filter thread would be awesome.   
I never consider 24-90mm f/2.8-4 due to its sheer size. Actually I will never consider any of the four SL lenses with E82 filter thread. As excellent they can be, they are too big and too heavy for me. 

Smaller 28-70mm f/2.8 can be done  just look at Tamron 28-75mm f/2.8

 

 

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Edited December 17, 2020 by nicci78

[Simone_DF]

8 hours ago, Jeff S said:

The increasingly bitter Mr. Puts now considers the whole L mount a mistake...

I don't agree with Puts, but he has a point. L lenses are too big and heavy. Both Panasonic and Sigma got the message and are releasing smaller/lighter lenses. 

Maybe Leica slowed down the release of the new primes to at least take into consideration new design goals? 

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[Steven]

Just got confirmation of the info I gave yesterday. 

The next announcement will be in early 2021, it will be a 28-70 zoom with a constant aperture of 2.8. Smaller size than the 24-90 as well. 

We will get the 28 Summicron in the second half of 2021. 

We should not expect the 21/24 crons in 2021. Paused for now. 

[helged]

22 minutes ago, Steven said:

Just got confirmation of the info I gave yesterday. 

The next announcement will be in early 2021, it will be a 28-70 zoom with a constant aperture of 2.8. Smaller size than the 24-90 as well. 

We will get the 28 Summicron in the second half of 2021. 

We should not expect the 21/24 crons in 2021. Paused for now. 

My main interest is in the SL21Cron - but I can wait (and I am used to wait), no problem...

[dsalamena]

I don’t get what’s the point with a 28-70 mm full frame zoom. It’s neither enough wide nor it offers a good tele option. The 24-90 is just perfect as it is, in may opinion. 
When I need something small and light for a walk I just use the TL 18-55 which offers the equivalent of a 28-70 but in an really small package. 
 

[Steven]

1 hour ago, dsalamena said:

I don’t get what’s the point with a 28-70 mm full frame zoom. It’s neither enough wide nor it offers a good tele option. The 24-90 is just perfect as it is, in may opinion. 
When I need something small and light for a walk I just use the TL 18-55 which offers the equivalent of a 28-70 but in an really small package. 
 

I had a brief experience with the Canon RF 28-70 and I loved it. It's the most popular focal length: 28 - 35 - 50 and it also gives you quite a good reach at 70mm if you compare it to 28mm. If you get prime quality like on the RF and a constant aperture, it's worth the reach sacrifice in my opinion. On a video camera like the SL2S, the constant aperture is great and the APSC mode in video will make it a 28 -140. If on top of that its half the size of a 24-90, sounds like an all time best seller to me. Im really surprised too that its not obvious to a lot of people. 

[Simone_DF]

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1 hour ago, dsalamena said:

I don’t get what’s the point with a 28-70 mm full frame zoom. It’s neither enough wide nor it offers a good tele option. The 24-90 is just perfect as it is, in may opinion. 
When I need something small and light for a walk I just use the TL 18-55 which offers the equivalent of a 28-70 but in an really small package. 
 

If the size is indeed reasonably small, it would be a great travel option. You could bring the 28-70 and maybe a manual M wide like those nice Voigtlanders 21mm if you need one.

[Simone_DF]

2 hours ago, Steven said:

We will get the 28 Summicron in the second half of 2021. 

We should not expect the 21/24 crons in 2021. Paused for now. 

I don't get the choice of pushing the 28 first. For that price you can buy a Q2, which is roughly the same weight/size as the Crons, and as a bonus they share even the battery.

A wider lens would be better, imho

[RBB]

2 hours ago, Steven said:

Just got confirmation of the info I gave yesterday. 

The next announcement will be in early 2021, it will be a 28-70 zoom with a constant aperture of 2.8. Smaller size than the 24-90 as well. 

We will get the 28 Summicron in the second half of 2021. 

We should not expect the 21/24 crons in 2021. Paused for now. 

Great!

[Steven]

34 minutes ago, Simone_DF said:

I don't get the choice of pushing the 28 first. For that price you can buy a Q2, which is roughly the same weight/size as the Crons, and as a bonus they share even the battery.

A wider lens would be better, imho

An SL with a 28 cron, is not the same thing as a Q2, nor the same thing as an M with a 28 cron/lux. Different segment, to be treated separately. 28 is more popular FL than 24 or 21. And a preferred Leica FL as history showed us. 

[Jeff S]

2 hours ago, Steven said:

I had a brief experience with the Canon RF 28-70 and I loved it. It's the most popular focal length: 28 - 35 - 50 and it also gives you quite a good reach at 70mm if you compare it to 28mm. If you get prime quality like on the RF and a constant aperture, it's worth the reach sacrifice in my opinion. On a video camera like the SL2S, the constant aperture is great and the APSC mode in video will make it a 28 -140. If on top of that its half the size of a 24-90, sounds like an all time best seller to me. Im really surprised too that its not obvious to a lot of people. 

I’ve commented before about my wish for a set of smaller SL zooms with more restricted focal lengths, including one around 28-70 (with non-telescoping zoom).  Now all they need to do is complete the trio with 70-150-ish and another around 18/21-28. Tell your source to get to work. 😊

Jeff

Edited December 17, 2020 by Jeff S

[Steven]

20 minutes ago, Jeff S said:

including one around 28-70

A little more than a month to wait and your wish (and mine) will come true. 

[Jeff S]

19 minutes ago, Steven said:

A little more than a month to wait and your wish (and mine) will come true. 

Do you know if it will have internal zoom?

Jeff

[Slender]

70 x 1.5 is 105 in aps-c... but more than good enough . Surprised Leica worked on this without anybody noticing/anticipating/ leave it out of the roadmap.... will it be made in japan like the summicron Cine lenses and many cool R zooms of the past?

Arguably the 21 f2 with L-mount standarts of results will be the most challenging lens to make in the line-up yet.

As someone else said earlier, it would be my pick above the utterly utterly useless 75 f1.2M and 90 1.5M... but heh, those chinese folks who buy those and other limited edition of albinos crocodile leather M cameras make the SL2s at this price a reality...

Edited December 17, 2020 by Slender

[nicci78]

5 hours ago, dsalamena said:

When I need something small and light for a walk I just use the TL 18-55 which offers the equivalent of a 28-70 but in an really small package. 

I think that it would be nice to have an excellent middle ground between huge full frame 24-90mm f/2.8-4.0 and small but APS-C 18-56mm f/3.5-5.6 = 28-85mm f/5.0-8.0 equivalent light flux. With only 10MP (SL2-S) or 20MP (SL2) 
 

So reasonably sized full frame 28-70mm f/2.8 would be awesome. 

[Simone_DF]

3 hours ago, Steven said:

An SL with a 28 cron, is not the same thing as a Q2, nor the same thing as an M with a 28 cron/lux. Different segment, to be treated separately. 28 is more popular FL than 24 or 21. And a preferred Leica FL as history showed us. 

You are right, in particular for video. But for stills, I don't find the difference that big between the Q and the SL. The Q2 and the SL2 even share the same sensors. Considering size, weight, cost, and even rendering, I'd buy a Q2 over the SL 28mm Summicron any day.

[BernardC]

On 12/16/2020 at 8:23 AM, Steven said:

With all due respect, this is in my opinion completely wrong. On the contrary: the announcement of an SL2-S makes a 24-70 2.8 even more relevant. You see, while the 24-90 is an excellent lens for stills, a variable aperture is not ideal for video, despite the implementation of floating ISO. With the SL2S aimed at videographer and cinematographer, a zoom lens with constant aperture makes more sense than ever. 

Question 1: will this lens provide acceptable manual focus? As far as I am concerned, the SL lenses are useless for video because there is no way to focus them with any sort of accuracy or consistency. AF is useful for some things, like slow dolly moves, but for almost everything else it's a signifier, the same way that on-camera-flash is used to signify "snapshot", or camera shake is used to signify "documentary/first person."

I have seen AF used to signify two looks: the vlog look, where people talk to the camera, and occasionally hold something up-close to the lens, waiting for the AF to catch-up; and the "diegetic camera," where a character is holding a camera or phone, and we cut to that footage. In the second case, film-makers often de-saturate, and add noise, to complete the visual effect. It is similar to books that switch from third-person to first-person narration.

I am not trying to disparage these looks, just to put them in context. You certainly can't argue with success: most YouTube content uses one or both versions of the AF look, and it will be a formative visual signature for generations of viewers.

I would be interested in knowing if I've missed another major visual signature that takes advantage AF.

[Jeff S]

4 minutes ago, BernardC said:

Question 1: will this lens provide acceptable manual focus? As far as I am concerned, the SL lenses are useless for video because there is no way to focus them with any sort of accuracy or consistency. AF is useful for some things, like slow dolly moves, but for almost everything else it's a signifier, the same way that on-camera-flash is used to signify "snapshot", or camera shake is used to signify "documentary/first person."

I have seen AF used to signify two looks: the vlog look, where people talk to the camera, and occasionally hold something up-close to the lens, waiting for the AF to catch-up; and the "diegetic camera," where a character is holding a camera or phone, and we cut to that footage. In the second case, film-makers often de-saturate, and add noise, to complete the visual effect. It is similar to books that switch from third-person to first-person narration.

I am not trying to disparage these looks, just to put them in context. You certainly can't argue with success: most YouTube content uses one or both versions of the AF look, and it will be a formative visual signature for generations of viewers.

I would be interested in knowing if I've missed another major visual signature that takes advantage AF.

It seems the latest FW release (linear focus and 90-360 degree focus turn option) will significantly improve manual focus for many SL lenses.

Jeff

[Stuart Richardson]

Oof. I wish they would prioritize the 21mm summicron over the 28-70 zoom, which seems redundant. There are currently no Leica quality primes in the very wide range, and 28, while useful, is already very close to the 35mm and catered to in both zooms and a number of M and third party lenses). A 21mm f2 with SL summicron quality would be incredibly useful for architecture and landscape...zooms are fine for some things, but not if you care about edge to edge uniformity or distortion (there is almost always residual complex distortion in my experience, even after “correction”). It would give the L mount a true no compromise wide angle prime, which it is lacking. What L mount is certainly not lacking is any number of general purpose zooms...there are several already from Leica, Sigma and Panasonic, let alone the cheaper adapted models. 

Edited December 17, 2020 by Stuart Richardson

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[Jeff S]

16 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said:

Oof. I wish they would prioritize the 21mm summicron over the 28-70 zoom, which seems redundant. There are currently no Leica quality primes in the very wide range, and 28, while useful, is already very close to the 35mm and catered to in both zooms and a number of M and third party lenses). A 21mm f2 with SL summicron quality would be incredibly useful for architecture and landscape...zooms are fine for some things, but not if you care about edge to edge uniformity or distortion (there is almost always residual complex distortion in my experience, even after “correction”). It would give the L mount a true no compromise wide angle prime, which it is lacking. What L mount is certainly not lacking is any number of general purpose zooms...there are several already from Leica, Sigma and Panasonic, let alone the cheaper adapted models. 

Without any info whatsoever, I would bet more on design/production issues than prioritization. The long Karbe presentation on SL lenses stressed the great difficulty involved.  If so, best to do it right than do it soon. But of course this could be completely wrong.

Jeff