Leica Q2 Monochrom -- Filters?

[piran]

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Did you need the yellow filter for the clouds? Could similar or same be achieved post? Having specified a Q2M I wonder whether I should be looking out to fit yellow or orange glass in front of all that nice Q2M design?

Edited November 21, 2020 by piran

[jonoslack]

3 hours ago, piran said:

Did you need the yellow filter for the clouds? Could similar or same be achieved post? Having specified a Q2M I wonder whether I should be looking out to fit yellow or orange glass in front of all that nice Q2M design?

I think you don't need it - I did put a yellow filter on today, but pretty sure it was unnecessary

 

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[jonoslack]

On 11/21/2020 at 6:41 PM, piran said:

Did you need the yellow filter for the clouds? Could similar or same be achieved post? Having specified a Q2M I wonder whether I should be looking out to fit yellow or orange glass in front of all that nice Q2M design?

I have been playing with a yellow filter (that shot) but I'm pretty sure that you could achieve that in post processing

 

[jaapv]

If the image demands it by all means. You still change the tonal balance. 

[piran]

15 minutes ago, jaapv said:

If the image demands it by all means. You still change the tonal balance. 

I'd prefer to leave off anything in the way of light transmission to the sensor pixels, particularly if the same/similar effect is achievable post.

[jaapv]

Yes, but my point is that it is not. There is no way that you can create precisely the same tonal values in post on a monochrome image. A filter modifies the response to colours of the sensor - and there are no colour channels. You cannot do it in post on a monochrome image. Exactly the same as on B&W film.

Of course you can change the contrast and dynamic range, do local dodging and burning and arrive at a satisfactory image (as Jono implies) but it can never be the same as the effect of a colour filter - well, maybe if you take an hour or so to work on an individual image detail by detail, and even then. As filters get more intense, from light yellow to red, the effect gets more pronounced. (or a green or blue filter)

[piran]

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47 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Yes, but my point is that it is not. There is no way that you can create precisely the same tonal values in post on a monochrome image. A filter modifies the response to colours of the sensor - and there are no colour channels. You cannot do it in post on a monochrome image. Exactly the same as on B&W film.

Of course you can change the contrast and dynamic range, do local dodging and burning and arrive at a satisfactory image (as Jono implies) but it can never be the same as the effect of a colour filter - well, maybe if you take an hour or so to work on an individual image detail by detail, and even then. As filters get more intense, from light yellow to red, the effect gets more pronounced. (or a green or blue filter)

I've come to a broadly similar conclusion:-)

The mono sensor saves no information describing the particular part of the colour spectrum captured. Only the yellow filter has this awareness - so to speak. So post's level and tone curves can only broadly approximate. I think, like Jono, some experiments will be in order.

Still my initial point subsists... there are more clinical image deteriorating factors in play after screwing on a filter - air/glass density changes (twice), loss of acuity through the filter glass, various additional smear/dust/crap and possible flares. Hence my original question whether post might suffice.

[jaapv]

13 minutes ago, piran said:

Still my initial point subsists... there are more clinical image deteriorating factors in play after screwing on a filter - air/glass density changes (twice), loss of acuity through the filter glass, various additional smear/dust/crap and possible flares. Hence my original question whether post might suffice.

Yes, but (assuming a reasonably clean filter) to all practical intents and purposes such things are not perceptible and far less destructive to image quality than extensive postprocessing

[piran]

5 minutes ago, jaapv said:

...to all practical intents and purposes such things are not perceptible and far less destructive to image quality than extensive postprocessing

Noted. I will probably enjoy experimenting ...just as soon as Leica UK release a box for me. No word yet:-/

[nwphil]

I have a couple questions regarding blue filters:

seen a couple with designations like blue KB20, KB3, B12, 80A, 80B....

Internet search says:

80A increases the color temperature from 3200K to 5500K for the use with 3200K lamps.
80B increases the color temperature from 3400K to 5500K for the use of photoflood lamps.
80C increases the color temperature from 3800K to 5500K.- might be equivalent to  KB3
80D increases the color temperature from 4100K to 5500K.
AND:

https://images-eu.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/C14vIg2dJeS.pdf  (PAGE 19 ONWARDS - 35 for B&W)

what might be the better "all-around" blue filter for b&w? does one need to carry at least two? and is there are practicality in really using them?

Thanks

Edited November 23, 2020 by nwphil

[Jay B]

I have never used a blue filter for anything but using tungsten lighting with daylight COLOR film.

With monochrome, color filters lighten their colors and darken their compliments.
So, for example, a blue filter will lighten blue sky and darken yellow objects. Never personally had any call to do that.

I happen to have a huge filter collection, both in sizes and choices. So I have in my Q2M bag light & medium yellow, medium orange, and light & medium red.
Plus neutral densities in 3 and 6 stop and the Elpro close up filter.

[jaapv]

21 hours ago, nwphil said:

and is there are practicality in really using them?

Not really, unless you  want a flat uniform white sky.

[SrMi]

https://www.ilfordphoto.com/colour-filters/

A blue filter is not often associated with black & white photography however, it can really add “mood” to a photograph by increasing the effect of haze or fog.

I got one blue 49mm on order, wonder how it works in practice.

[Charles Morgan]

A helpful video on the effect, inter alia, of a blue filter on black and white.  I've not rushed out to buy one, but it's an option for certain effects.

[Leica28]

I can see using a blue filter for a winter scene where you wish to depict a feeling of pervasive cold and intense stillness.

[JJ99]

Interesting topic this. I have a Q2M and just a polarising filter for now, I have on order the filters that Leica sell for this camera, yellow orange and green. I wonder why Leica don’t sell a red filter, I did ask Leica technical this but got an unsatisfactory answer 
“many thanks for your request.
I don't know why a red violet should be necessary for the Leica Q2, the use of a filter is always optional .
We do not currently offer red filters, but I have no information about whether any are planned.
There are numerous providers who offer very good quality red filters.”

Can any more experienced members comment on the use of filters please?

 

[jaapv]

Plenty of threads on the use of filters - blogs too. Start in the Monochrom forum. The green filter is rather useless in normal photography. 

[nwphil]

11 hours ago, jaapv said:

Plenty of threads on the use of filters - blogs too. Start in the Monochrom forum. The green filter is rather useless in normal photography. 

Reid Reviews just published some articles about this subject: in sum don't overexposure  with or without filters and avoid high iso; be mindful that the filter itself will cause that - my apologizes for not sharing more about content, but it's more of heads up for the one's like me that caved in and got s subscription

[midnightsun]

I just purchased the Leica Q2 Monochrome.   I have always loved B&W because that is what I started with in the 60's.   I have experienced disappointment and lack of inspiration by doing post processing on RAW color images-- close but no cigar.   The Q2 Monochrome seemed like magic to me right out of the box.   I doing some post processing on the RAW monochrome images and it occurred to me that the filters were designed to tweek color data, not B&W data.   It seems to me that filtering before the B&W capture is the only way to go.   I am new to this dedicated B&W camera  and want to learn all I can about using it.   nwphil mentioned the Monochrom Forum.    I want to check it out.   

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[jaapv]

You are correct. With a monochrome file you cannot get colour filter results in postprocessing - your filtering on the lens must be the same as it was with B&W film.