You own M10M are you still considering a Q2M?

[dsm21]

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I actually went the opposite route, so this maybe of limited help.

I bought the Q2M first. After using and really enjoying that camera. It made me very curious as to how the M10M with M lenses would perform. (I would’ve never even thought about the M10M, it weren’t for my experience with the Q2M.)

Right now, I find myself reaching for the M10M more.
But I can definitely see a place on my shelf for the Q2M and don’t have any plans to part with it. I can imagine reaching for the Q2M for times when I want to use a the camera more casually, like not having to worry about range finder focusing, or when the shorter min focusing distance on the Q2M would be welcome....Restaurants, indoors, birthday party’s etc. I like having the video feature too  

Size in hand the 2 are similar.  The Q2M is slightly lighter, but it’s definitely not pocketable 

[Budfox]

On 2/11/2021 at 3:33 AM, acapella said:

Thanks for all the insights on the Q2 and Q2M, considering myself a Q2M

Have a more theoretical question: what is the explanation of larger DOF while cropping, must have something to do with diameters of these famous ‘circles of confusion ‘ and the efeect of cropping (= enlarging) on them or am I wrong here. Is there a thread explaining this? Where explicit calculations are shown?

 

Regards and thanks,

Acapella

 

Depth of field does not change when you crop. If you print out a picture, and cut out the middle part, the depth of field does not change. It's the same picture. DOF changes with a change in the focal length of the lens, aperture value, and distance from the subject - all determined and 'baked-in' to the photo at the time of shooting.

cheers

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[acapella]

Thanks for the reply and yes you are right.

You sometimes read about the effective aperture while cropping, for instance in the review of the Q2 by mr. Slack (I quote:)

The four digital zoom modes are: (addition thanks to John Kot in dPreview for calculating effective aperture)

• 28mm 8368 x 5584   47mp .    effective aperture f1.7
• 35mm 6704 x 4472    30mp .    effective aperture f2
• 50mm 4688 x 3128    14.6mp   effective aperture f2.8
• 75mm 3136 x 2096    6.6mp .   effective aperture f4.6

So I start to wonder: what is the definition of effective aperture in this (and other) examples when it has nothing to do with DOF?

Regards

 

 

 

 

 

[Likaleica]

6 hours ago, acapella said:

Thanks for the reply and yes you are right.

You sometimes read about the effective aperture while cropping, for instance in the review of the Q2 by mr. Slack (I quote:)

The four digital zoom modes are: (addition thanks to John Kot in dPreview for calculating effective aperture)

• 28mm 8368 x 5584   47mp .    effective aperture f1.7
• 35mm 6704 x 4472    30mp .    effective aperture f2
• 50mm 4688 x 3128    14.6mp   effective aperture f2.8
• 75mm 3136 x 2096    6.6mp .   effective aperture f4.6

So I start to wonder: what is the definition of effective aperture in this (and other) examples when it has nothing to do with DOF?

Regards

 

 

 

 

 

If you made a photograph with a 35mm lens at f/2 and enlarged it to a given size, then you made a photograph with a 28mm lens at f/1.7, and enlarged it to where the objects in each photo were the same size, the DOF that your eye detects would be the same.

Remember that true DOF is essentially 0, the plane of focus, but our eyes cannot discern points of light in front or behind the plane of focus as slightly out of focus.  These are called circles of confusion.  When the distance from the plane of focus gets far enough, we begin to see these areas as out-of-focus.

The reason a picture taken with a telephoto lens looks like it has a shallower DOF, compared to say a 35mm lens, is because the former essentially is an enlargement of the latter.  If you enlarged the picture made with the 35mm lens, the DOF would also look shallow.

[robgo2]

On 1/29/2021 at 11:47 PM, nicci78 said:

According to my contact in Leica. M10 Monochrom is selling way way better than Q2 Mono. The latter is quite a disappointment. 

Between the two models customers will chose the more versatile M10 Mono. In a ratio of 9 times over 1. 
They also prefer the much more advanced 40.5MP sensor with incredible very high ISO. 
 

Between Q2 and Q2 Mono. Customers will chose the colour Q2 at 99% of the time. 

 

Hard core B&W shooters have chosen M10 Monochrom. 
 

Q2 Mono is chosen as secondary cameras for occasional B&W shooters. To complement their M10 or SL2.  Or any other primary colour cameras. 
 

Last but not least, M10 Monochrom is selling very well despite the pandemic. 
 

And if you are interested into Q2 Mono. You should act fast. Not sure to be sold for a very long time.
It can be something like M-D typ 262 or M10-D. Not special edition. But only available until the first batch has been sold. 
 

 

These data, if true, are hardly surprising.  Many Leica M owners have historically favored B&W, while Q/Q2 owners are into color.  Do you think that Leica was not aware of this fact when they set out to design and manufacture the Q2M? Also, the M10M is the third generation of an M Monochrom, so it has an established base of users, while the Q2M does not. The development cost of the Q2M was probably relatively low, as Leica already had the Q2 body and lens as well as the monochrome technology.  Thus, it is possible that the Q2M is still profitable, even with low sales.  I bought one to supplement my Q2, and I absolutely love it. The only problem is that the pandemic has limited my ability to put it to use.

Edited April 10, 2021 by robgo2