Summarits - A case study

[epand56]

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14 hours ago, pippy said:

You bought a used 35mm Summilux ASPH for a little less than the price of a new Summarit?

Stephen, yes I did, it was almost 10 years ago. A friend of mine was selling the 35 Summilux Asph. for 1400 euros and the brand new Summarit 35/2.5 I had costed me 1500 euros. I've sold it for 1200 euros and bought the Summilux. I still have and use it. I had it 6bit coded by Will van Manen for 85 euros a coupe years after I bought it. It's the lens I will never give away.

[Dr No]

Given the Summarits have been discontinued and also the 24 Elmar, I have a suspicion we may see them being replaced by Elmarit ASPH's with the newer style hoods and proper leather pouches.

I for one would buy 24, 35, and a new 90 Elmarit ASPH (to go with my existing 28 Elmarit ASPH) because I like and appreciate the super compact "slow" lenses.

Edited January 3, 2021 by Dr No

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[Herr Barnack]

7 hours ago, stephengv said:

Do you think is worth it to get the 75mm Summarit 2.4?

Absolutely.

The APO-Summicron-M 75mm f/2 ASPH is priced at $4395 USD.  Before it was discontinued, the 75/2.4 Summarit was priced at half that. 

Based on everything I have seen and read, the 75/2.4 is virtually equal to the 75/2 in terms of image quality and is equal in terms of build quality. 

JMHO but paying a price increase of 100% or $2200 USD for an extra 1/2 EV and a very minimal increase in image quality in the corners of the frame does not make sense.

Since the 75/2.4 is out of production, I would expect prices to creep (or maybe leap 🙄) upward on both new and used examples.  I would be willing to pay an extra 10 to maybe as much as 25% over the original price of the 75/.24; if sellers become wildly greedy, at some point it makes more sense to just get the 75/2.0 rather than to submit to out of control price gouging.  Supply and demand is one thing; profiteering is another matter entirely.

Leica would do all of us a monumental favor if they would bring back the entire line of f/2.4 Summarit lenses and have them made by the Leica facility in Portugal. 

I hope the decision makers in Wetzlar are listening/reading...

 

 

Edited January 3, 2021 by Herr Barnack

[Matlock]

6 minutes ago, Herr Barnack said:

Leica would do all of us a monumental favor if they would bring back the APO-Summicron-M 75mm f/2 ASPH and have it made by the Leica facility in Portugal. 

I hope the Pooh-bahs in Wetzlar are listening/reading...

 

 

This from the tour of the Portugal plant in 2017.

"Leica Camera’s new Portuguese plant in Vila Nova de Famalicão
is a pleasant half-hour drive north of Porto, made especially easy
since CW Sonderoptic Managing Director Gerhard Baier was at
the wheel. A whimsical Leica M-like gate house greets the visitor.
Beyond is the modern factory of Leica Aparelhos Opticos de Precisão
SA. It is the size of several football fields. Many Leica cameras,
lenses and sport optics are made here. It’s one of the most
high-tech, impeccable places in the industry, with a highly skilled,
enthusiastic workforce."

[Adam Bonn]

I bought a 2.5 90mm (NOS or ex-demo, I forget) and a used 2.4 35mm when I first got into Leica simply because the pair of them cost not much more than a used mint, modern 35 ‘cron and I was just starting out and figured it was better to have more glass than an extra 1/2 stop on the 35.

In usage case the 90 was a mistake... 3 years on and according to LR I’ve only taken 900 images with it. But when I do want a 90 I’m really pleased with it, I love the rendering and I’ve no complaints about the feel of the focus ring and the aperture turns with a robust and crisp click. (The rubber is a bit naff though!)

In terms of touchy-feely and image quality, I found the 90rit very much on par with the 50 cron I had.

I’ve never regretted the 90 ‘rit and I’ve never had 90mm upgrade GAS

It might be my least used lens, but I’ve no complaints

The 35 ‘rit is more of a mixed bag in my copy.. the focus ring is very easy to turn and the aperture ring doesn’t have the same crisp click that all the other M mount glass I own (or owned) has.. (which is a 50 cron v5, 50 lux asph, 90 rit, 21mm zeiss and CV35)

But touchy-feely doesn’t make for a nice image rendering and on my m9 I took many images that I was happy with and the 35rit seemed to pair well with the m9 sensor.

Then I added a M240 to my stable, and I wasn’t so pleased with the 35 on that camera... I don’t want to get into the whole CCD/CMOS 240/M9 crap... but for my opinion the rit didn’t sing so in tune on the 240 as it did the m9

I started to get 35 ‘cron GAS.... but couldn’t really justify the expense... and in the end I saw a CV35/1.7 for a good price and pulled the trigger on that!

I’ve never really compared the 35 rit and CV (despite the fact I own them both)

But I immediately liked the look of the images more from the voigtlander which seems to have more contrast and the extra stop(ish) of light comes in handy too!

But TL DR..

I’ve no regrets about getting rits over crons. Perhaps I should’ve got the 75 over the 90.... perhaps I should’ve saved my pennies for the 35 cron (although I’ve paid less for the used 35 rit and new CV35 than a mint used 35 cron costs) 

But I haven’t found either of my rits to be bad performers, yes maybe on a budget CV (or even Zeiss) offer more for less..

But the rits are small, well enough made, 6 bit coded and light weight.

The irony IMHO is that they’re being discontinued just when their most limiting aspect (max aperture and it’s effect on ISO) is becoming far less of an issue with the performance of the modern Ms. (F2.4 and an M9 isn’t always a happy place 😅)

 

 

[pippy]

4 hours ago, epand56 said:

...it was almost 10 years ago. A friend of mine was selling the 35 Summilux Asph. for 1400 euros...

Ah! Well that explains matters quite a bit. A price between friends 10 years ago. You did well and a good friend to have for sure!

As the price of the cheapest used 35 Summilux I can find currently for sale in the UK is almost exactly double your friend's asking price 10 years ago (being 2,700 Euros plus change) I'm not sure your own experience is going to be of much help to the OP - especially as now all Summarits are also in the 'Used' category and very likely to be less expensive than equivalent but faster lenses.

Still, as I said; you did well! I trust you continue to have great fun and obtain superb results with it!

Philip.

[epand56]

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15 hours ago, pippy said:

As the price of the cheapest used 35 Summilux I can find currently for sale in the UK is almost exactly double your friend's asking price 10 years ago

At the time I bought the Lux 35/1.4 Asph. (not boxed, just hood and front and rear caps), you could buy a Lux 50/1.4 Asph. boxed with less than 2000 euros (I did it two times, one silver and then one black). Prices of lenses were quite less crazy than today at the time. I remember paying 700 dollars for an Elmarit-M 90/2.8 with its pouch and 350 euros for an Elmar 50/2.8 collapsible last version in perfect condition. Even the LUF Classified section of this forum was far more rich and with quite reasonable prices. Today you have to start a leasing if you want to buy a used Summilux and I'm almost out of the drug tunnel of Leica lenses frenzy now. I love my M240 and use the lenses I have that are far more performing than the skills I have 🙂

Edited January 4, 2021 by epand56

[stephengv]

On 1/4/2021 at 12:49 AM, Herr Barnack said:

Absolutely.

The APO-Summicron-M 75mm f/2 ASPH is priced at $4395 USD.  Before it was discontinued, the 75/2.4 Summarit was priced at half that. 

Based on everything I have seen and read, the 75/2.4 is virtually equal to the 75/2 in terms of image quality and is equal in terms of build quality. 

JMHO but paying a price increase of 100% or $2200 USD for an extra 1/2 EV and a very minimal increase in image quality in the corners of the frame does not make sense.

Since the 75/2.4 is out of production, I would expect prices to creep (or maybe leap 🙄) upward on both new and used examples.  I would be willing to pay an extra 10 to maybe as much as 25% over the original price of the 75/.24; if sellers become wildly greedy, at some point it makes more sense to just get the 75/2.0 rather than to submit to out of control price gouging.  Supply and demand is one thing; profiteering is another matter entirely.

Leica would do all of us a monumental favor if they would bring back the entire line of f/2.4 Summarit lenses and have them made by the Leica facility in Portugal. 

I hope the decision makers in Wetzlar are listening/reading...

 

 

Thank you for your insight. 

[stephengv]

Does the Summarit 2.4 Line hve “whitening” of the rubber issues?

[Musotographer]

I was loaned the 50 on an M9 by Leica Mayfair a few years ago while my 50/1.4 and M9P were away being calibrated; I really enjoyed it and was rather sorry to give it back.

[Marac]

I had 3 of the 4 Summarit f2.5's. The 35/75/90 I found them all to be excellent and would buy them back in a heartbeat if I needed that focal length.

[a.noctilux]

3 hours ago, stephengv said:

Does the Summarit 2.4 Line hve “whitening” of the rubber issues?

For me curing is easy with toothbrush and a couple of minutes.

(maybe with very small amount of good/selected shoeshine waxy paste)

[AndreasG]

vor 13 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux:

For me curing is easy with toothbrush and a couple of minutes.

A wet cloth with a few drops of Glycerol is even better, this is my experience with various Zeiss/Hasselblad lenses, which also have a rubber ring for focussing (however, I never have heard a customers' complaint about this in contrast to the Summarit range).

[stephengv]

54 minutes ago, a.noctilux said:

For me curing is easy with toothbrush and a couple of minutes.

(maybe with very small amount of good/selected shoeshine waxy paste)

How long does it last?

 

[jdlaing]

8 minutes ago, stephengv said:

How long does it last?

 

Probably until you get it all over your fingers and transfer it to something else.

[AndreasG]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb jdlaing:

Probably until you get it all over your fingers and transfer it to something else

With sufficient awkwardness it eventually replaces the lens cap.

[Herr Barnack]

4 hours ago, stephengv said:

Does the Summarit 2.4 Line hve “whitening” of the rubber issues?

What's going on is the rubber is experiencing oxidation as it ages.  303 Protectant should remove the oxidation and restore the rubber to near new condition.  A drop or two on the tip of a Q-Tip should be sufficient - just make sure the Q-Tip is damp, not soaking wet so you don't have 303 trickling into the mechanical works of your lens. 

https://www.amazon.com/303-30313-CSR-Protectant-Plastic-Fiberglass/dp/B0045E7PC8?ref_=ast_sto_dp&th=1

[Guest]

After a search of a few months or so I just found and bought a pretty good condition Summarit 35mm f2.4 at a price that I could afford. I've a few 35mm lenses, Summilux f1.4, Summicron f2 and a VC f2.5 Color Skopar, so yes 35mm is a favourite focal length for me. The reason I wanted a Summarit was primarily because of it's compact size, ( the Skopar is compact too, but I've always wondered if the Leica glass would be better in some ways and now I believe it is ). I do like smaller sized lenses on an M whether it's a digital or a film body, for me they just work and balance better than most faster lenses that are by their very design larger, heavier and annoyingly tend to block the viewfinder much more. Sure the "bokeh" may not be so pronounced on a slower lens but frankly in real usage I've yet find that much discernible difference between f1.4, f2.0 and f2.4 in that regard even though admittedly the Summilux does have a pleasing "look" to it wide open. However digital M's have such good available ASA latitude and so for me it's hard to justify the expense and size of faster lenses because now the Summarits can work very well in most lighting conditions. Perhaps not so much though with film where the ASA's top out at 1200 or so and limit their use in dimmer situations. Wide open at f2.4 or f2.5 the Summarits are extremely good and versatile pieces of glass and the "new" 35mm joins the 50mm Summarit in my arsenal now and I do appreciate them. I am sorry that Leica has dropped the line, but good examples are still out there and can be relatively "affordable" for Leica glass.

Edited January 7, 2021 by petermullett

[Guest]

Three simple test shots yesterday after receiving the Summarit 35: M10-P.

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Edited January 7, 2021 by petermullett

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[matted]

What is this talk of rubber o the Summarits? I have a 35 2,5 and a 50 2,4 and do not recall any parts of them being rubber, save for the cap for the 35 2,5 with hood. Is the rubber just limited to the 75/95 focus rings?

 

All in all I love my two Summarits, and don't feel like I'm missing out on anything other than of course speed, and perhaps character wide open when compared to some of the Luxes and Crons in the 35/50 focal lengths.

 

My copies handle beautifully, have nice sharpness, good colour/contrast, and are nice and small. I can see them rising in value for sure!