SL2-S

[nicci78]

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Have you tried their AF system ? It is definitely better for photo and video. 
No way to argue. 
DFD is somewhat ok. But against awesome AF. Which one consumer will choose ? 
This graph just proved that people do not care for DFD. They want awesome AF with foolproof eye AF. 
We can say whatever, it is definitely an improvement in AF department. 
 

Panasonic and Leica ashould just get into phase detect AF bandwagon. Just to avoid bad rap from reviewers. 
They constantly repeating that DFD is crap don’t buy it ! 
Guess what ? people listened to them and did not buy Panasonic stuff. 
Have you seen the almost close to zero percent market share ? 

[Dr. G]

On 10/24/2020 at 12:20 PM, Chaemono said:

Sony lenses usually suck except stopped down is my experience. I bet that one does so hard.

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I now use the SL2 with the APO Summicron-SL 50mm.   My copy of the Zeiss Sony 50mm f/1.4 ZA was an incredible lens wide open - I'm clearly not a fanboy, my images don't lie.

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[Dr. G]

4 hours ago, Steven said:

In that example, rather that speed, I would call it sensitivity. 
In any case, if that’s true, Leica can take my money now. 
Any idea when that sl2s might be announced ? I’m itching to buy an sl2 but now I also want to wait and see the sl2s 

This.  I would take a 24mp sensor that had less noise at higher ISOs.  I could take my Summicron-SL lenses out at night without a flash and use the camera at 1/125 for general shooting at events and never look back.  

I'm not getting rid of my SL2, though.  No issues carrying two bodies.  

[Rick in CO]

The precedent of the R4S is being a "simplified" version at a less expensive price tag.  How would Leica economize features of the SL2 to make the full frame SL2-"S" camera less expensive?  Take out IBIS, the higher res finder, or video - which are the most expensive?  Is the 24 Mp full frame sensor passe' ?  Keeping the 24 Mp sensor camera with IBIS and the high res finder is unlikely if the supply is low and/or being phased out.

I can't see an APS sensor in the SL body with the large size of the camera and calling what would be the CL2 an SL2S. 

Similarly I can't see them putting the S3 sensor in the SL2-"S", it would kill off that line (and not be "simplified").

My guess is the SL2S would have the 47 Mp sensor with the original SL finder, no IBIS and maybe no video - hence "simplified".

 

[nicci78]

I am pretty sure SL2-S does not mean simplified. But Speed. 
Not that R4s is written with lower case s directly attached to R4 : meaning simplified R4.
Here SL2-S has a upper case S separated from SL2 with a hyphen. Signifying same body,  but different internal. 

[Simone_DF]

5 hours ago, Slender said:

I dont have a crystal ball but I wouldn't count on this. Leica specifically says no to phase detect because of IQ loss issues, apparently.

That is just marketing bulls..t, pure and simple. 
There CAN be IQ loss, but it happens only in extreme conditions, and even in that case, it’s rare. I’ve been using Sony cameras since the A7RII and I’ve never encountered this issue. 
Truth is the chances of IQ loss are pretty much negligible, compared to the benefits of phase detect. That’s the reason why every manufacturer except Leica / Panasonic are using phase detect. 

[Simone_DF]

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3 hours ago, tom.w.bn said:

Many people rant about the AF. Still no proof that this a real life problem, except for vloggers.

I did post some real life proof of Leica’s subpar AF performances, but according to some people on this forum it was a “user error”, even when a Leica rep candidly admitted that the AF sucks in low contrast scenarios. 
If Leica want the L alliance to succeed, they need phase detect, there’s no way around it. Leica can still sell cameras based on brand loyalty, but I doubt it will be the same for the other two members. 

[Brian Puccio]

According to this site:

Eine anonyme Quelle hat uns verraten, dass die Leica SL2-S wohl mit 24 Megapixeln auflösen und mit erstklassigen Video-Funktionen überzeugen wird. Sollte dieser Fall wirklich eintreten, wäre das ein interessanter Schachzug von Leica. Schließlich standen die Videofunktionen bei der Kameraschmiede aus Wetzlar bisher nicht unbedingt im Fokus. Doch wir haben in den letzten Monaten in der Branche ja allgemein beobachten können, dass die Videofunktionen eine immer wichtigere Rolle einnehmen. Gut möglich also, dass auch Leica da eine entsprechende Kamera im Angebot haben möchte. Die Leica SL2-S soll sich angeblich im Preisbereich von knapp 5.000 Euro einordnen.

Which Google translates as:

An anonymous source has told us that the Leica SL2-S will probably have a resolution of 24 megapixels and convince with first-class video functions. Should this really happen, it would be an interesting move by Leica. After all, the video functions at the camera manufacturer from Wetzlar have not necessarily been in focus so far. However, in the last few months we have generally observed in the industry that video functions are playing an increasingly important role. So it is quite possible that Leica would also like to have a corresponding camera on offer. The Leica SL2-S is said to be in the price range of just under 5,000 euros.

[Chaemono]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Rick in CO:

...

My guess is the SL2S would have the 47 Mp sensor with the original SL finder, no IBIS and maybe no video - hence "simplified".

It’ll sell like hotcakes.

[peka69]

S - Sport

or

S- Street

So lighter (smaller) and/ or  faster body

???

[Steven]

Im not sure why the S is being such a big debate. It's pretty obvious. All camera brands are doing the same differentiation between their lines now. R is usually for resolution. On the other ride of the spectrum, S is for sensitivity, meaning low light, meaning video centric. Dont make me give you examples.. its just obvious. 

I think this SL2S will be a video centric camera while the 47MP SL2 is better at stills. And I really look forward to it. BUT, if they don't do phase detect AF, then it is doomed before it even comes out. Contrast is ok for photos. It won't cut it for video. Especially without a tilt screen to be able to check focus, or use manual focus. 

The real question for me is when will they announce it. 2020 or 2021? 

Edited October 26, 2020 by Steven

[Gavin Cato]

8 hours ago, Simone_DF said:

There CAN be IQ loss, but it happens only in extreme conditions, and even in that case, it’s rare. I’ve been using Sony cameras since the A7RII and I’ve never encountered this issue. 

I can trigger it pretty regularly in backlit conditions with A7r2/A74/A9.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love the sl2 to focus like a a9. But the iq thing is real.

 

[Simone_DF]

I'm pretty sure you can trigger it, but I guess that for the 95% of people that buy into a system it's not a problem and they prefer a working eye-af and af-c. Canon and Sony together have 80% of the market share, Panasonic has something like 5%, and that includes their micro 4/3 line.

The new AF in the S5 is a step in the right direction, I'm considering getting one myself, but there's only that much that you can do with DFD. 

 

[nicci78]

14 hours ago, Brian Puccio said:

According to this site:

Eine anonyme Quelle hat uns verraten, dass die Leica SL2-S wohl mit 24 Megapixeln auflösen und mit erstklassigen Video-Funktionen überzeugen wird. Sollte dieser Fall wirklich eintreten, wäre das ein interessanter Schachzug von Leica. Schließlich standen die Videofunktionen bei der Kameraschmiede aus Wetzlar bisher nicht unbedingt im Fokus. Doch wir haben in den letzten Monaten in der Branche ja allgemein beobachten können, dass die Videofunktionen eine immer wichtigere Rolle einnehmen. Gut möglich also, dass auch Leica da eine entsprechende Kamera im Angebot haben möchte. Die Leica SL2-S soll sich angeblich im Preisbereich von knapp 5.000 Euro einordnen.

Which Google translates as:

An anonymous source has told us that the Leica SL2-S will probably have a resolution of 24 megapixels and convince with first-class video functions. Should this really happen, it would be an interesting move by Leica. After all, the video functions at the camera manufacturer from Wetzlar have not necessarily been in focus so far. However, in the last few months we have generally observed in the industry that video functions are playing an increasingly important role. So it is quite possible that Leica would also like to have a corresponding camera on offer. The Leica SL2-S is said to be in the price range of just under 5,000 euros.

Thanks for sharing. It is obvious that SL2-S will just be SL2 with 24MP at 1000€ less. The equivalent of what S1 is to S1R. A cheaper, less defined but better suited for video, camera. 

[scott kirkpatrick]

I haven't seen any pictures on Nokeshita yet, so to me this is all speculation.  But I would be happy to go for a 24 MPx SL2-lite with the same controls as the SL2, with improved video in-camera codecs and no 29:59 timeout, and IBIS.  The only question is -- would I get enough tradein $$ for my two SL1's to pay for it?

[tom.w.bn]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb Simone_DF:

I'm pretty sure you can trigger it, but I guess that for the 95% of people that buy into a system it's not a problem and they prefer a working eye-af and af-c. Canon and Sony together have 80% of the market share, Panasonic has something like 5%, and that includes their micro 4/3 line.

The new AF in the S5 is a step in the right direction, I'm considering getting one myself, but there's only that much that you can do with DFD. 

 

Yes. And for 95% the current AF is not a problem. Now what?

[Steven]

2 minutes ago, tom.w.bn said:

Yes. And for 95% the current AF is not a problem. Now what?

It’s not a problem for stills shooter. 
it’s a huge problem for video shooters. At this price point, mirror less buyers look for hybrid options. Look at the R5 debacle because of the overheating. People want great photo and great video in the same body. Won’t be on the M. Wont be on the Q. Won’t be on the S. It’s gotta be on the SL. 

[Simone_DF]

14 minutes ago, tom.w.bn said:

Yes. And for 95% the current AF is not a problem. Now what?

It is a problem, because sales of the L mount are miserable, and while Leica can and will still sell and make a profit because of brand name, Panasonic can't do the same and may abandon the full frame market if there's no economic return for them.

[tom.w.bn]

vor 31 Minuten schrieb Steven:

It’s not a problem for stills shooter. 
it’s a huge problem for video shooters. At this price point, mirror less buyers look for hybrid options. Look at the R5 debacle because of the overheating. People want great photo and great video in the same body. Won’t be on the M. Wont be on the Q. Won’t be on the S. It’s gotta be on the SL. 

Huge problem? Where? I spent hours on youtube and only found vloggers who have vlogging problems. Where are all the descriptions of real life problems in video?

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[Simone_DF]

57 minutes ago, tom.w.bn said:

Huge problem? Where? I spent hours on youtube and only found vloggers who have vlogging problems. Where are all the descriptions of real life problems in video?

The AF is subpar. Shall I post again all my examples of missed af with a SL2? Or do you prefer the written confirmation of a Leica rep? Because I have that too.