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USB Xfer in Linux (Mint)


boojum

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I work mostly in the Linux side of the house even though I have W10. I prefer Linux.  It works.  However when I  plug the M8.2 into the USB port I do not get access to the SD in the camera.  I get a folder called RAMDISK and while that is nice, I suppose, it is not at all useful.  Are there any Linux users on this forum who are transferring images over the USB connection?  And if so, what is the secret?  I will work in W10 but prefer Linux.

Thanks.

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The manual for the M 8.2 explains how to transfer images over the USB cable with Win XP, Windows Vista and Mac OS on pages 148, 148.

What do you see in the folder RAMDISK?

What do you see in Windows Explorer when you connect the M8.2 to the Windows machine?

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7 hours ago, pop said:

The manual for the M 8.2 explains how to transfer images over the USB cable with Win XP, Windows Vista and Mac OS on pages 148, 148.

What do you see in the folder RAMDISK?

What do you see in Windows Explorer when you connect the M8.2 to the Windows machine?

I get a folder in Linux that contains a folder called RAMDISK.  Across the top of the folder it says that there are images in the folder.  But those naughty little images do not want to come out and play.  In W10 it shows the M8, then in that another folder and within that a Leica501 folder and then a DCIM folder.  The sad part is that a couple of times I was able to get the same sequence in Linux!  I really prefer Linux as it is stable, safe, robust and economical of resources.  I've been using MS since the mid 80's and it always has been a kludge.

 

 

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7 hours ago, pop said:

The manual for the M 8.2 explains how to transfer images over the USB cable with Win XP, Windows Vista and Mac OS on pages 148, 148.

What do you see in the folder RAMDISK?

What do you see in Windows Explorer when you connect the M8.2 to the Windows machine?

OK, in W10 I get a folder called M8 Digital Camera which contains RAMDISK and SD Card in it, which contains DCIM, which contains 501Leica, which contains the images.  And, yes, I can toggle back and forth on my dual boot system but I like to believe the canard that computers are to make my life easier not more difficult.  LOL  Silly me.

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As I have neither Mint nor M-eight I can not be as helpful as I would like. (I use Ubuntu)

However.

Your file manager (is that Nautilus?) seems to be able to see the DCIM directory which usually indicates that there ought to be pictures on the card, It even offers to open Digikam which I believe is the program for the KDE desktop which can fetch images from external media. What happens when you open Digikam?

I can think of two reasons why the file manager does not show the SD Card directory. 

One: the directory might be "hidden". Can you instruct your file manager to show hidden files?

Two: your user account might not have the proper privileges to see the directory. You could try and run the file manager as root (only this time, not routinely, as this is too dangerous). Or you could look at the SDCARD directory with the file explorer in Windows and have a look at its properties, namely the privileges or access rights or whatever they are called in the Windows world. In particular, take note of the owners of the RAMDISK and the SDCARD directories. Are they the same?

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Anyway: why do you insist on doing the transfer over USB? That must be painfully slow on the M8. I think I'd rather put the SD Card in the reader of my computer. Come to think of it, that's what I used to do with my M8 and the Linux computer, if I remember that correctly.

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17 minutes ago, pop said:

As I have neither Mint nor M-eight I can not be as helpful as I would like. (I use Ubuntu)

However.

Your file manager (is that Nautilus?) seems to be able to see the DCIM directory which usually indicates that there ought to be pictures on the card, It even offers to open Digikam which I believe is the program for the KDE desktop which can fetch images from external media. What happens when you open Digikam?

I can think of two reasons why the file manager does not show the SD Card directory. 

One: the directory might be "hidden". Can you instruct your file manager to show hidden files?

Two: your user account might not have the proper privileges to see the directory. You could try and run the file manager as root (only this time, not routinely, as this is too dangerous). Or you could look at the SDCARD directory with the file explorer in Windows and have a look at its properties, namely the privileges or access rights or whatever they are called in the Windows world. In particular, take note of the owners of the RAMDISK and the SDCARD directories. Are they the same?

Mint is a flavor of Ubuntu so we are in the same church just different but close pews.  I can see RAMDISK but not the SD card with DCIM that is also on the SD. That does not show up at all, even when opened as root.  I have the "show hidden files" box checked so it is not that. RAMDISK is a 30meg folder.  It is the 16GB DCIM I want to see.  And, again, what is really maddening is that it has worked in the past once or twice.  The problem is I cannot see the SD.  I'll poke around some more.  If Merlin stops by your house before he stops at mine give me a shout.   ;o)  And thanks for giving me ideas.   

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33 minutes ago, pop said:

Anyway: why do you insist on doing the transfer over USB? That must be painfully slow on the M8. I think I'd rather put the SD Card in the reader of my computer. Come to think of it, that's what I used to do with my M8 and the Linux computer, if I remember that correctly.

Why?  Because I am Deutscher Dicke, that's why.  LOL  I find it a lot easier to just plug in the USB for transfer than to take off the half case, detach the bottom, and then pull out the SD card and plug it into the desktop box.  It is a function built into the M8.2 and I find it more convenient.  And it is not slow.  It works like any other file transfer.  I am surprised that others do not use this built-in function. I do not think the Wetzlar Wizards included the ability to also charge the battery over the USB but I sure wish they did.

And while I am whining about Leica shortcomings, I have a nice Miele washer-dryer combo.  It has been running flawlessly for 17 years now and will probably go for at least another 17 without need for repair.  They are great gear.  We all know that. And they are just computers with a wash tub or a dryer tub attached.  If the washing machine guys can put in circuit boards that last almost forever there is no reason the guys at Leica cannot do the same.  I was raised with the concept that "Es ist immer Deutscher besser" and electronic failures in Leica cameras are a disgrace.  I have  30 year-old radio that is running just fine.  Likewise a stereo receiver.  And, yes, an old ReVox CD player.  I have a nice old Olympus XA3 and a 20 year-old SONY Cybershot that are running just fine.  Was ist hierlos, Leica?

/rant

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vor 8 Stunden schrieb boojum:

I find it a lot easier to just plug in the USB for transfer than to take off the half case, detach ...

Yes, I can understand that. I did not think of a fractional case. However, you also have to do all of that in order to charge the battery.

vor 8 Stunden schrieb boojum:

And while I am whining about Leica shortcomings

We don't know yet whose shortcomings we are whining at. Both Mac and Win can see the pictures just fine. 

vor 8 Stunden schrieb boojum:

electronic failures in Leica cameras are a disgrace

If it still works with Windows, it's not an electronic failure. Presumably, it's a peculiar application of a standard for showing directories on an attached USB device (if there even was a standard and not a mere convention). The peculiarity could even lie with Mint, who knows. 

Besides, the M8 was Leica's first digital camera. It is a well-known fact that it takes Microsoft three attempts to get any new product barely working. Remember Windows 1 and Windows 2? Utter rubbish and not fit for use, and Windows was not even their first product. Windows 3 finally could be made to work, after a fashion, Windows 3.1, that is. Compared with Microsoft, Leica did a splendid job with a first digital product, even if it also has a large helping of (understandable) faults.

Keep on trying, you'll make it yet.

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vor 9 Stunden schrieb boojum:

If Merlin stops by your house

Ah yes; my Nephew says to try and change the order in which you do your thing.

1: Plug in USB cable into Leica; switch on Leica; plug USB cable into PC (with Mint already up and running, of course)
2: Plug in USB cable into Leica; plug USB cable into PC (with Mint running); switch on Leica

He also says to try and use another USB cable.

But then, we all know he's not the brightest candle on the tree.

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40 minutes ago, pop said:

Yes, I can understand that. I did not think of a fractional case. However, you also have to do all of that in order to charge the battery.

We don't know yet whose shortcomings we are whining at. Both Mac and Win can see the pictures just fine. 

If it still works with Windows, it's not an electronic failure. Presumably, it's a peculiar application of a standard for showing directories on an attached USB device (if there even was a standard and not a mere convention). The peculiarity could even lie with Mint, who knows. 

Besides, the M8 was Leica's first digital camera. It is a well-known fact that it takes Microsoft three attempts to get any new product barely working. Remember Windows 1 and Windows 2? Utter rubbish and not fit for use, and Windows was not even their first product. Windows 3 finally could be made to work, after a fashion, Windows 3.1, that is. Compared with Microsoft, Leica did a splendid job with a first digital product, even if it also has a large helping of (understandable) faults.

Keep on trying, you'll make it yet.

The defense strategy of saying that I am nor as bad as the other guy does not wash.  It is like a staggering drunk talking about another drunk passed out on the floor.  There are lots of capable circuit board designers and manufacturers.  Circuit board instability within a Leica camera does not point to good design or QC.  Did they really put their best effort into it? And lets face it, almost anything will look good alongside of MS.  That's why I use Linux.  It works.

If Leica was unused to electronics they could have hired a good team.  Look at Miele, German hardware and software which does not fail.  I like Leicas, I just bought another, but I am sure disappointed in their CMOS strategies.

Now that the spleen is vented on to the USB transfer. Trying to have a clean slate I formatted the SD in W10, full format not quick format, and then put it in the M8.2 and formatted it there.  Then I transferred the files which had been on the SD back to it, put it in the camera and hooked up the USB cable.  Hallelujah!  Now it fails in W10 just as it does in Linux.  I get RAMDISK but I cannot see the DCIM folder.  Lucky with hardware, unlucky with software.  

Back in the dim recesses of my past there is a career of writing software.  I was never a star but I paid the rent and put food on the table.  My experience in a good shop is that hardware failures like those Leica experiences would be flagged, red-lighted, and that part of the project stopped until it was fixed.  Against the background of Leica's history it looks awful.  My old SONY DSC S70 works without a whimper and it is 20 years old.  It has never failed and has tagged along all over the US, Canada and Mexico. I kind of thought that Leica's hardware and software would at least be as good if not better.

So while I still like Leicas - I've bought three in a month - there is little doubt in my mind that they failed with their electronics.  The cameras?  One M8.2 and two M240's.  

Here's a camera which has not failed in 20 years.

 

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9 hours ago, boojum said:

Why?  Because I am Deutscher Dicke, that's why.  LOL  I find it a lot easier to just plug in the USB for transfer than to take off the half case, detach the bottom, and then pull out the SD card and plug it into the desktop box.  It is a function built into the M8.2 and I find it more convenient.  And it is not slow.  It works like any other file transfer.  I am surprised that others do not use this built-in function. I do not think the Wetzlar Wizards included the ability to also charge the battery over the USB but I sure wish they did.

And while I am whining about Leica shortcomings, I have a nice Miele washer-dryer combo.  It has been running flawlessly for 17 years now and will probably go for at least another 17 without need for repair.  They are great gear.  We all know that. And they are just computers with a wash tub or a dryer tub attached.  If the washing machine guys can put in circuit boards that last almost forever there is no reason the guys at Leica cannot do the same.  I was raised with the concept that "Es ist immer Deutscher besser" and electronic failures in Leica cameras are a disgrace.  I have  30 year-old radio that is running just fine.  Likewise a stereo receiver.  And, yes, an old ReVox CD player.  I have a nice old Olympus XA3 and a 20 P/rant

Post some images taken with your Miele please, preferably using a Noctiwash...🙄
I have a Digilux2 still running fine, as do most M8 cameras, I wonder what evidence you have that Leica circuit boards don't last, even if they have to be miniaturized compared to washing machines...

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vor 7 Minuten schrieb boojum:

Now it fails in W10 just as it does in Linux.  I get RAMDISK but I cannot see the DCIM folder.

That clearly points to a software compatibility issue.  Did you format the card as FAT32? I think that used to be the only format supported for SD cards at that time. Did you try and format the card with Mint or with the SDFORMAT tool? And I don't think you should format the card in the M8, once it's formatted in a computer. All the M8 has to do in this case is to write a number of directories, and it does that all on its own.

The electronics and software in the M8 were developed by a third party which reportedly had already learned how to do that. And again, the hardware appears to be working. It's the software.

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41 minutes ago, pop said:

Ah yes; my Nephew says to try and change the order in which you do your thing.

1: Plug in USB cable into Leica; switch on Leica; plug USB cable into PC (with Mint already up and running, of course)
2: Plug in USB cable into Leica; plug USB cable into PC (with Mint running); switch on Leica

He also says to try and use another USB cable.

But then, we all know he's not the brightest candle on the tree.

As for "1." hot plugging is not a good strategy.  Just like when you fiddle with hardware on your computer: turn it off, then unplug it, and wait wait about ten minutes to be safe from frying a board.  "2." is how I have been doing it.  The fact that the cable has worked makes me wonder if changing it could help.  But it is worth a try.  If I can find an old style one I will use it.  If not I will buy one.  

I like the analogy of the brightest candle on the tree.  We all use electric lights out here.  I know the Germans are fond of candles on the Christmas tree and happy to learn so, too, are the Swiss.  Just keep that CO2 fire extinguisher handy.  And since we are on Weinachten do you have Bunten Teller and Baumkuchen in der Schweiz?  I do not know if these customs have crossed the border or are even still practiced.  Baumkuchen, himmlich.

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