Leica M10-R or SL2

[TrickyMrT]

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Hello,
I like to switch from my M10 to M10-R or SL2, but I´m not sure which one is the best option. 🤯
 
Benefits of the SL
- more Megapixel
- IBIS
- Highres viewfinder 
- Weather sealed 
- Works fine with M - Lenses
 
Benefits of M10-R 
- more Megapixel
- Works best with M - Lenses
- less weight 
- Beautiful 
 
What to do? Do you have any experience with the SL2 and M lenses?
 
Please help

 

 

 

 

 

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[pietchen]

the M lenses are great on the SL, the viewfinder in the SL is the biggest differenz 

 

[scott kirkpatrick]

Focusing M lenses with the M rangefinder , for some of us, is faster and potentially as accurate (depends on the individual) than focusing through the EVF on an SL2. Shooting through an optical finder can speed your reactions to the scene unfolding in front of you.  M wide angles may need the precaution of stopping down one or more stops to get the absolute sharpest edge to edge image on an SL2.  After that it's all up to individual style and preferences.

[Jeffry Abt]

I’ve committed to the SL2; it is a very versatile camera system.

Meanwhile, I will keep using my M10 with the 35 mm Cron. It is a classic set up as far as I’m concerned.

 

Edited August 5, 2020 by Jeffry Abt

[anickpick]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb scott kirkpatrick:

Focusing M lenses with the M rangefinder , for some of us, is faster and potentially as accurate (depends on the individual) than focusing through the EVF on an SL2. Shooting through an optical finder can speed your reactions to the scene unfolding in front of you.  M wide angles may need the precaution of stopping down one or more stops to get the absolute sharpest edge to edge image on an SL2.  After that it's all up to individual style and preferences.

I agree.

One thing I noticed though is that I get sharper images with the SL2 at infinity.

I compared both cameras using the 50 Apo Summicron M at f4 and shutter speeds of 1000/sec or faster. I believe the difference is in the use of the electronic shutter.

The difference is marginal though (only visible at 2:1 magnification).

So if landscape photography is someones main interest, I‘d say the SL2 is the better option, as long as one is not using one of the more critical wide M lenses.

Edited August 5, 2020 by anickpick

[Rob L]

You forgot to mention the autofocus of the SL2 and the small size of the M10-R as pluses. Two very different cameras. If you like manual focus and plan to use M lenses, get the M10-R, assuming you like the rangefinder experience. If you want the option of autofocus or might want to try the superb SL Summicrons, get the SL2

[scott kirkpatrick]

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True in a broader discussion, but the OP was starting with an M10 and some M lenses, I think.

Edited August 5, 2020 by scott kirkpatrick

[TrickyMrT]

Yes I have 2 m lenses 

 

50mm apo ( love it)

35mm 1.4

[rent]

It really depends on what you shoot. For me, it's M10-R and Canon (gasp!) R5:

M10-R for travel and day to day casual shooting. I chose it over SL2 primarily for its portability, and really have no need for AF.

Canon R5 for birds / animal with the big white lenses, and architecture with TS lenses. I will most certainly put my M lenses on the R5 and see how they work out.

[paulsydaus]

Well you posted this is the M10 forum so I think the answer is M10R!

Now if you had posted this in the SL forum...???

[gotium]

Rangefinder has the advantage that you don't have to open up the aperture every time you want to get the focus right. Disadvantage compared the SL2 is that you have to focus-and-recompose (I cannot get accurate focus with the low-res M-EVF). 

[Tailwagger]

As you list highres VF as a plus for the SL2, if your using it on your M10, I think you will find the EVF on the 10-R much improved... with the exception of blackout times which sadly have become more noticeable.  The noise levels are very low now, even in modest light. Sitting in my living room, looking across it, 5  to 6 meters and focusing fully zoomed, while there is some noise, I can easily focus accurately on a fine mesh screen in front of my fireplace, for what would be an indicated exposure of 4" at ISO 100.  Perhaps it's the new sensor, better amplification circuitry or improved software, but whatever they've done it is far, far better than I recall it being on the M10. I should add that I had mentioned elsewhere that there seemed to be a problem with LV zoom levels not being fully available, but I'm pleased to report... must have had a setup issue though I puzzled as to what I might have changed... I can now use the wheel for EV normally, but when the camera detects I'm focusing, I can now use the thumb wheel to move through all three levels.

IMO, make the choice on the basis of optics, not body features. M lenses will always be better on the M. Many consider the SL performance excellent with M optics, but there are some lenses that don't work anywhere near as well... sadly I own a few of them. Even if for others the drop off is slight, why pay this much money and not get every cent you paid for? Beyond the desire to have an AF camera after many years of only shooting pretty much only Ms, the primary reason I bought into the SL2 was to gain access to the new Summicrons.  If you only intend to shoot M lenses, the SL2 really make far less sense. About the only tangible advantage in my view is the ability to use IBIS with M lenses. Not something I personally have ever needed to do, but YMMV.   And on the downside, perhaps a minor point, but the SL2, being an AF camera first is operationally more complex and not as straightforward a shooting experience as the M. No auto zooming as well. In the end very different cameras with equally diverse strengths and shooting experiences. 

One thing I'll add don't lose a wink of sleep over the difference in pixel count. They are useful for cropping, but from an IQ comparison standpoint either camera is several steps beyond truly excellent. 

 

 

[TrickyMrT]

Hello Tailwagger,

Thank you very much for the detailed feedback.

You are writing exactly what I thought. I will stay in my M system, because I love it.

Only fast apertures in combination with fast-moving objects like kids are challenging to manage. 

I need to be honest... if I see my M I just like to grab it and go out shooting :)

 

There are two things on the M10-R, which are very, very disappointing!

1. No new EVF

2. No USB-C connection

 

So waiting on an M11 in the hope Leica makes it a bit more modern?

 

 

[Manicouagan1]

I find the Visoflex 020 to be quite usable and well integrated into the M system as an EVF.  I use to for lenses wider than 28mm and when I want gps tagging.  Most of the time the Visoflex just lives on my camera.  

[John Smith]

On 8/6/2020 at 1:03 AM, TrickyMrT said:

So waiting on an M11 in the hope Leica makes it a bit more modern?

A bit more modern? What in the world would make it more modern?

[Guest]

2 hours ago, John Smith said:

A bit more modern? What in the world would make it more modern?

Autofocus,EVF and auto selfie filter mode i guess he means?

[hillavoider]

On 8/6/2020 at 4:03 PM, TrickyMrT said:

Hello Tailwagger,

Thank you very much for the detailed feedback.

You are writing exactly what I thought. I will stay in my M system, because I love it.

Only fast apertures in combination with fast-moving objects like kids are challenging to manage. 

I need to be honest... if I see my M I just like to grab it and go out shooting :)

 

There are two things on the M10-R, which are very, very disappointing!

1. No new EVF

2. No USB-C connection

 

So waiting on an M11 in the hope Leica makes it a bit more modern?

 

 

Wouldn’t waste time waiting on that, it’s a classic, and priced that way too unfortunately, I’d get an M10R tomorrow but the price in Australia is just absurd, in fact it’s just rude, when an SL2 is 4 grand cheaper

Edited August 8, 2020 by hillavoider

[John Smith]

18 hours ago, steve 1959 said:

Autofocus,EVF and auto selfie filter mode i guess he means?

Ah, yes, selfie mode. What was I thinking?

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[Mikep996]

I took "selfies" quite often with my M6 back in the day.  Other than calling them "selfies," there was certainly nothing new in the concept when it started to be used with cellphones.

[budjames]

I own the M10, just received the M10-R and the SL2. I just purchased the SL 16-35 zoom for a trip next week to the National parks in Utah and Wyoming. In my initial testing of the 16-35 I happy to report that this is an amazing, although heavy, zoom. The quality at all focal lengths is far superior to the Canon 16-35 L II lens that I used to own when I shot with Canon. 

I will be taking my SL2, the SL 16-35, SL 90-280 and APO Summicron M 50 with the M-adapter on my trip. 

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.