21mm Summilux or 24mm Summilux

[Kamyar]

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Hey all. 
i have m10m and sl2. 
i have 35 f2. 50 apo. 75 apo. 
i need one wide angle lens for landscape and street . 
i can buy one Summilux wide angel Summilux series. 
i have 2 offer , one 24 lux and one 21 lux. 
which better? ( quality, optic and..... ) 

thanks all

[250swb]

Neither, I can't see the point of a Summilux for landscape or street. If f/2 isn't enough for the light increase the ISO. If however Bokeh is your thing and you want lots of out of focus background the DOF will be massive even at f/1.4 so why bother? And then there is the size and weight of a wide angle Summilux....

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[lethaln]

Quote

Neither, I can't see the point of a Summilux for landscape or street. If f/2 isn't enough for the light increase the ISO. If however Bokeh is your thing and you want lots of out of focus background the DOF will be massive even at f/1.4 so why bother? And then there is the size and weight of a wide angle Summilux....

 

I quite agree with this argument. Especially since you are shooting digital bodies that already have fantastic ISO capabilities (especially the M10M). Bokeh on such lenses only give proper subject separation at close up distances. The usual recommendation would be to rent out the lenses (more difficult for the 24mm lux due to it being discontinued) and see what you like, or to get the 21mm and see how often you crop. If you are after a quality perspective and bokeh isn't in your list of requirements, then I would point you to the 24mm f3.8 elmar, which provides much higher image quality imo than its summilux equivalent (faster does not always mean better). Good resources for your answers include previous posts about this, and also a recent reddotforum video on wide-angled lenses. Their first question is 21 vs 24mm. 

 

[lethaln]

Another thing to think about particularly since you also do landscape is the availability of filters. I believe (correct me if im wrong) is that the 21mm summilux takes the series 8, whereas the 24mm takes the series 7 filters and finding adapters for their filter size to use modern-day filters can be difficult

[JTLeica]

56 minutes ago, Kamyar said:

Hey all. 
i have m10m and sl2. 
i have 35 f2. 50 apo. 75 apo. 
i need one wide angle lens for landscape and street . 
i can buy one Summilux wide angel Summilux series. 
i have 2 offer , one 24 lux and one 21 lux. 
which better? ( quality, optic and..... ) 

thanks all

21mm Super Elmar. 21 and 24 arent as nice as the 28 Lux and are large without purpose I think.

If I were you, a 28 Lux is the one to get or if you have to have wider, a 21SE which is the best 21mm Leica offer.

The posts before are totally right, F1.4 is a waste in a wide, no longer do you need it for low light as ISO is so good, plus the wide field of view allows you to shoot at slow speeds anyway. And you really dont need shallow DoF with a wide either 😏

[Kamyar]

28 is great, I know. But so near to 35mm. 
i need wider. 

[FrozenInTime]

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The new 21/1.4 Voigtlander might even be the better lens - lots of examples on FM https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1603441/34?b=2#lastmessage

Having owned the Leica 21/1.4, I would buy the 21 SEM and the 21/1.4 VC ; giving a choice of compactness with ultimate sharpness and switch for occasional night time use of 1.4.

I sold the 21 Summilux for the 28 Summilux as it was more practical use on a M OVF. However my 28 Summicron still gets more use than the Summilux as it smaller and sharper across the frame.

[JTLeica]

8 minutes ago, Kamyar said:

28 is great, I know. But so near to 35mm. 
i need wider. 

Why do you think you need a Wide Summilux? Also why are you awake so early

Or late... 

Edited August 5, 2020 by JTLeica

[Kamyar]

Sharp corner to corner actually. Very important for me. 

[JTLeica]

4 minutes ago, Kamyar said:

Sharp corner to corner actually. Very important for me. 

The Super Elmar 21mm is far sharper corner to corner than the 21 and 24 Lux, also with better flare control, and barely any distortio. It is also cheaper, smaller, lighter... You can shoot it wide open and get sharp corner to corner images, you cant do that with the lux's. Your call though.

[Mark T]

Wow, you have accumulated these lenses very quickly from what I remember of your other recent posts. Firstly, I agree that you don't need a Summilux for "street" or landscape. As far as 21 mm vs 24 mm goes, I would say 21 mm (or wider) if you want to shoot more indoors, and 24 mm for outdoor use. I really like 24 mm for landscape in particular. However, plenty of people take fine pictures doing exactly the opposite.

[darylgo]

I would buy either of the lenses you mention, they’re both excellent. Technically, neither is the “sharpest” or “best” available.  What you get with a Summilux is a softer contrast and beautiful colors wide open, as the lens is stopped down there will be more contrast and detail with those same  beautiful colors.  Choose your rendering with the aperture. The Leica lenses are all superb, the Summilux’ give you choices you don’t get with other lenses. I wouldn’t hesitate to shoot these for landscape wide open.   If you do purchase either Summilux and wish to use filters then buy the dedicated adapter.  The choice of 21 or 24 is difficult, Galen Rowell loved his 24mm and it’s my favorite but the 21mm gives that extreme wide angle foreground look with receding background that if well done looks spectacular.  

 

[mmradman]

1 hour ago, darylgo said:

I would buy either of the lenses you mention, they’re both excellent. Technically, neither is the “sharpest” or “best” available.  What you get with a Summilux is a softer contrast and beautiful colors wide open, as the lens is stopped down there will be more contrast and detail with those same  beautiful colors.  Choose your rendering with the aperture. The Leica lenses are all superb, the Summilux’ give you choices you don’t get with other lenses. I wouldn’t hesitate to shoot these for landscape wide open.   If you do purchase either Summilux and wish to use filters then buy the dedicated adapter.  The choice of 21 or 24 is difficult, Galen Rowell loved his 24mm and it’s my favorite but the 21mm gives that extreme wide angle foreground look with receding background that if well done looks spectacular.  

 

Fully agree, I find Summilux 21mm images beautiful at any F stop.  Apart from speed pictorially M 21mm is unique at max F stop. 

If fast lens is requirement, poor light for instance, no slow lens & high ISO can substitute it.  For shooting in good light and razor sharpness corner to corner SEM 21mm is perhaps better lens.

[jaeger]

If VM21 f/1.4 was available at the time I pulled the trigger on the 24 Lux, my photography history would be different and I have enough savings for a nice used M10P today.  But for sure I would be itching to know how much different for having the 24 Lux.   Anyway, since 24lux is discontinuing, I guess you might be offered some discounts.

I also realize you had a post about VM21 1.4 back in March, what makes you give that up?

 

[darylgo]

1 hour ago, mmradman said:

 If fast lens is requirement, poor light for instance, no slow lens & high ISO can substitute it.  For shooting in good light and razor sharpness corner to corner SEM 21mm is perhaps better lens.

+1

1 hour ago, jaeger said:

  Anyway, since 24lux is discontinuing, I guess you might be offered some discounts.

I'm seeing some good pricing on the 24mm, $4000 used.  Also some higher prices, $6000 used.  It's difficult to determine which way this lens will be priced in the future.   A highly collectible because of low production numbers or dismissed and a lower priced summilux....if I had to guess I would say the former but what do I know, my stock picking lately is horrendous.   Both fall under the category of the more I know the more I realize how little I know.  

[S/W]

Kamyar, this picture was tanken with the Monochrom 246 and Summilux 1.4/24 at f/8.0 (you can view it in my Flickr Account in better Resolution):

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Edited August 6, 2020 by S/W

[Fedro]

for street and landscape ... neither. I would get the 21 SEM and crop. it is light, for street, well corrected and taking standard filters (for landscape)

I had both the 21 and 24 lux and kept the 21. it is great for environmental portraits and a very artsy lens, but not one of my most used lenses for sure

a good combo would be 21 sem (or WATE) and 28 lux,  imho

[JCR33]

I have an 21 2.8 Pre and used occasionally. Seen some 21 Lux images online and was very impressed. Didn't get it because the size and weight, not to mention the price and frequency of use. Like most M users, 35 lux is my most used, 28 is too close and 24 seems to be a nice one to fill the gap. So I bought one back in 2014. Since then, I have been using a lot and loving it. I use it for landscape, street, portrait, food or even macro(adding Novoflex adaptor), day or night. Quite versatile for my use.

 

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[Kamyar]

9 hours ago, JCR33 said:

I have an 21 2.8 Pre and used occasionally. Seen some 21 Lux images online and was very impressed. Didn't get it because the size and weight, not to mention the price and frequency of use. Like most M users, 35 lux is my most used, 28 is too close and 24 seems to be a nice one to fill the gap. So I bought one back in 2014. Since then, I have been using a lot and loving it. I use it for landscape, street, portrait, food or even macro(adding Novoflex adaptor), day or night. Quite versatile for my use.

 

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24 lux???

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[Kamyar]

On 8/5/2020 at 6:33 PM, jaeger said:

If VM21 f/1.4 was available at the time I pulled the trigger on the 24 Lux, my photography history would be different and I have enough savings for a nice used M10P today.  But for sure I would be itching to know how much different for having the 24 Lux.   Anyway, since 24lux is discontinuing, I guess you might be offered some discounts.

I also realize you had a post about VM21 1.4 back in March, what makes you give that up?

 

I cant read trust review actually ( vm 21 1.4 )