Sigma 16/30/56 for APS-C sensors

[nicci78]

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Stepping and stepper motors are the same thing. Just different terms. 

Sigma 70mm DG Macro / Art is using coreless DC motor. Not fast but precise and relatively silent. 

But Sigma 16, 30 and 56mm DC DN / Contemporary are using smooth, fast and totally silent stepping motors. Especially made for video. Hence the excellent AF-C and pursuit mode AF. 
 

So DC DN trio are using completely different kind of motors than slow 70mm DG macro. I am not the one saying this. Sigma is saying it themself. 
 

 

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Edited September 14, 2020 by nicci78

[gteague]

i covered this when i said that sigma have said that they compromised on several items their way more expensive art lenses had in order to keep the 70mm art macro at a low price point. thus, they didn't try to make it faster or smaller or to focus faster. and that's entirely fine with me as the 70mm is tied for first place in image sharpness with my full frame 50 summicron. indeed, it's one of the sharpest lenses i've ever owned, some exceptions being the m43 40.5mm noctilux and a couple of olympus m43 pro lenses such at the 75/1.8.  the 70mm would live on my s1 if it were more compact and maybe a stop faster, but the 56mm has taken its place their nicely.

and yes, in normal use which for me is afs mode where i use a small box and half-press and reframe if necessary, i see no practical differences in focus speed in any of my half-dozen or so l-mount lenses even considering all their differences. i shoot next-to-no video and have only tried the tracking mode one time on my cl with very mixed results and i haven't used it since. 

/guy

Edited September 14, 2020 by gteague

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[nicci78]

70mm DG Macro and DG HSM line up are not like DC DN or DG DN lenses. DN lenses are made exclusively for mirrorless, hence using stepping motors. Ideal for contrast detect and video. 

However Macro and HSM lenses are made for DSLR, hence a focusing tailored for phase detect sensors. Which is fast on DSLR but slower on mirrorless. 

[nicci78]

2 hours ago, gteague said:

A double focus system combines a linear motor and stepping motor to achieve sensor drive at a maximum speed of 480 fps for fast, high-precision autofocus

Only APO-Summicron-SL 35, 50, 75 & 90 and APO-Vario-Elmarit-SL 90-280 has dual-synchro drive motors. 
So every other SL and every TL lenses do not have such fancy motors.  
Not sure why do you want cheap DC DN lenses to have it too. It is not necessary for fast focusing. 

[gteague]

i didn't say that. i said that the premium l-mount and m43 mount lenses have that dual mode system. and that's part of their much higher cost. no one should expect that when paying $500-1000 less for a lens. but there's a point where the lens motor gets irritating and i found the canon ef 'l' lenses extremely irritating when used via the mc-21 adapter although i doubt the adapter had much to do with it. even the sigma 45/2.8 which had the clunkiest focus was 5x better than those lenses and the 56 and the 70 are 100x better, although still just noticeably behind the l-mount 'pro' lenses with that dual system.

/guy

[nicci78]

They do not use dual motor AF, because it is better. They are using it, because they have to move two focusing lenses in tandem to achieve fast focusing while maintaining image quality. 
If only one AF lens or group of AF lens have to move. They will just use one motor. It will be just as fast.
To be clear, dual motor is not twice as fast. It will be the same speed, actually. That’s why it is primarily used in telephoto lenses.

[gteague]

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i thank the godz every day i don't have to worry or understand this. all i have to know is whether the focus is accurate or not and whether the trip to getting there doesn't annoy me due to speed or noisy 'clunks'. if i shot video or afc or used tracking i might have to pay more attention. /guy

[nicci78]

Actually my own testing proved that you should only shoot AF-C or even better just tracking. It works way better than AF-S for 56mm DC DN. Yes even for static object  
 

By the way I am sorry for the bad translation from the french « poursuite » That’s why I am talking about « pursuit » AF mode. But there is no such thing. Of course in English it is « tracking » AF mode in CL menu. 
 

 

Edited September 14, 2020 by nicci78

[Le Chef]

Anyone taken any nice pictures with these lenses recently? Would love to see them.

[oldwino]

My copy of the 56 has arrived. It is indeed, sometimes, very slow to focus. It travels through the entire focusing range before settling in. As in, I could focus my old Nikkor 55/1.2 faster than the Sigma. 

Other times, it is quick enough. It is sharp, with a gentle rendering.

I wonder if this is fixable with a firmware update.

[gteague]

well, that is disheartening. wonder if they made some change since it was released? i got mine the week it was released and have shot pretty extensively with it, but mostly on the s1 and i have yet to have it rack focus on me. and i usually go out shooting on the edge of sundown in low light low contrast conditions. /guy

Edited September 15, 2020 by gteague

[nicci78]

S1 is not CL. 
Focusing is certainly faster and more reliable with the more recent Panasonic  
And don’t forget that the S1 only has 10MP to be in focus instead of 24MP for the CL. 

[nicci78]

5 hours ago, oldwino said:

My copy of the 56 has arrived. It is indeed, sometimes, very slow to focus. It travels through the entire focusing range before settling in. As in, I could focus my old Nikkor 55/1.2 faster than the Sigma. 

Other times, it is quick enough. It is sharp, with a gentle rendering.

I wonder if this is fixable with a firmware update.

Just try target AF mode instead. 

[oldwino]

I’ve decided to return the Sigma 56. It’s not a focal length I use very often anyway, and with the sluggish autofocus performance, I would use it even less. 
I can use my Nikkor 55/1.2 (and focus just as fast) or my beautiful old coated Summar 50 when I need that length. 

I’ve rented the Sigma 14-24/2.8 for a week to try it out, just for grins. It’s huge on my CL, but not totally unbalanced. But that’s a story for a new thread...

[nicci78]

I understand you. Still not sure about AF performance too. 
Target mode is not ideal. Still some weirdness. 
Not top quality AF for sure. Quite disappointed about that. 
I may return it too. But I have until 5th October to decide.
French law is very nice to give us 4 weeks to try any product bought online. 

Edited September 17, 2020 by nicci78

[nicci78]

I decided to keep the 56mm. 
Results are good.
AF is average. 
Size and weight are perfect for CL. 
Price is awesome. 
Build quality is just OK. But hopefully Sigma did not ask for Leica prices. 
 

I hope that Sigma will add in the future a 12 or a 14mm DC DN to save L-Mount APS-C optics line up. 

 

[aldam]

http://findingrange.com/2020/11/20/sigma-56mm-f1-4-dc-dn-contemporary-lens-first-impressions-l-mount/#more-30786

[Le Chef]

I recently bought the Sigma 56mm but had not had time to use it until yesterday. It was one of those days by the lake when the sun occasionally breaks through the clouds, so perfect for a faster lens. I took along my 23mm as well and they make a lovely, reasonably fast and lightweight combo. Some of the shots I took are posted in the CL image thread.

[LeicaS2]

Just got the 56mm on the CL.

I saw interesting golden  light coming through a window on this Nativity Set on our table. So I saw color, and grabbed by CL with new 56mm sigma.

Then I converted it to B&W as it liked the structure more than the color, even though it was the color of the window light that had caught my attention. But really it was the angle of that light more than the color.  ISO 800  f4.5  1/1250.   2:43 CST.

So it was a grab shot as the sun was moving the lighting. Tomorrow I may shoot this again after carefully positioning each figure. Yet this first shot will probably win.

 

 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[ramarren]

These Sigma lenses look interesting, albeit a bit on the bulky/heavy side. 

A fast lens in the 16 to 24mm focal length range would be nice to have. Of course there's the Leica Summicron-T 23mm f/2 ASPH, a known quantity at $2000 and fully compatible with all CL features. The Voigtländer Ultron 21mm f/1.8 is another possibility ... a little bulkier and a little shorter, and $800 or so. I wonder how that compares with the Sigma 16mm f/1.4, at half the price...? 

I have fast lenses in 35 and 50 mm focal lengths already (Leica Summilux 35/1.4 (1972 M-mount), Leica Summilux-R 50/1.4) and they're much more compact than any of these Sigma lenses (although particularly the R lens needs adapters that make it much bulkier). That's why the 16mm is the only one of any interest to me, but its size/weight is a bit off-putting.

G