Jump to content

Thinking of upgrading my "new" Leica T...


Recommended Posts

Advertisement (gone after registration)

I hesitated posting this, but I searched the forum for answers. I recently ran into a 2nd hand and mint Leica T that was way too affordable to resist. Hoped to be able to use my Sigma SA lenses on it (I use several brands...) but alas - the Sigma MC-21 SA-L adapter wouldn't recognize my Art lenses (known issue?).

From my favorite camera store I could borrow a Sigma 45mm L Mount for a weekend to be able to test the Leica T anyway and that became somewhat of a love story. I bought the 18-56mm Vario Elmar shortly after and recently I even added the 55-135mm to my new collection - both 2nd hand btw, still waiting for the 55-135mm...

Now seller of the 55-135mm is also selling the Leica CL and I'm tempted once again... The combination of both systems with both zooms seems fantastic to me.

I wonder about the CL however. I know it has an EVF of course, offers higher pixel count and is faster than the older Leica T.  Does it seriously improve in IQ however? I don't plan to get the Visoflex for the T. Also, I read the TL2 will blow the CL out of the water...

Can't compare though. Seller is asking €1K for the CL and that seems reasonable. Still, it's quite an investment for me and I'd like to be really sure about a possible next step. Just stick to the Leica T, add a Leica CL or wait for a chance to upgrade to a TL2? I'm not thinking about upgrading to anything M nor SL, I'm really looking for experience with the T vs CL and or TL2. 

Thank you so much in advance. Just sharing a shot from my T and 18-56mm to lively up this post. 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

The CL will be an upgrade on the T in terms of image quality - not a lot, but noticeable - a later generation sensor as well as more pixels.

The person who told you the TL2 would blow the CL out of the water must have been pulling your leg, to put it kindly. I believe they are the same, or very similar sensors. The CL is faster all round in my experience (I've had the TL2 twice, and now have just the CL), noticeably so in AF and in the EVF blackout when taking a shot, which is imperceptible in the CL. The TL2's EVF lag is also more noticeable.

The TL2 has HDMI-out for video, which the CL does not, so you can use it as a webcam in these zoom-oriented days.

Don't get me wrong - I loved the styling and user interface of the TL2, but the CL's better performance and the convenience of the built-in EVF was too much to ignore. 

   

Edited by LocalHero1953
  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Both the TL2 and CL are both great but flawed in their own ways , making this such a difficult question.

I’m still torn as to which is the better: 

Over the CL, I prefer to use the TL2 with the visoflex and M lenses. But the the focus edge highlight peaking is all but impossible to use with just the LCD.

The CL buttons and mode switching always confuse me when in a rush , compared to the TL2 UI. Spot AF on the CL is frustrating with the D-pad focus point wander.

Today I was hillwalking with the CL and 18-56 . The CL low profile of the in built EVF make it better for putting into a pouch; I found it difficult to adjust expose and shield the EVF from the sun leakage at the same time. 

At high ISO my CL seems to have a higher black clip level the my TL2 , and more hot pixels if pushed in post.

Link to post
Share on other sites

The CL is 3-years old so you should be able to find good deals later on if you don't jump on your current offer.

The practical side of me says to just enjoy the T with your two zoom lenses until you want to upgrade to the T2 or CL.  There's no rush to upgrade now, is there?

Of course, the impractical side of me says to get the CL now so you have both options to try out, and then sell the one you don't like.

Good times...

:)

Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanx all! Will stay with the T for the time being. Turned out the CL offered missed a little button (for ocular setting) and I just love to have my gear in perfect condition anyway. So I'll wait for another opportunity, maybe one day - either the CL or the TL2, time will tell. Tomorrow my 55-135mm will arrive so ill have enough to enjoy with my T the rest of the year I guess 🙂 

Link to post
Share on other sites

What would a good price for a 2nd hand Leica CL be? And for a TL2? Knowing myself, I know I won't stop searching. Found a 2nd hand Sigma 45mm today as well btw, expecting two L mount lenses in the mail tomorrow... 🤩

Link to post
Share on other sites

T, TL and TL2 did not received the much needed software update for full compatibility with all L-mount lenses. Actually they are left for dead since October 2018. No more firmware update since then. 
So I would look for a used CL. Which is still fully supported (latest FW in March 2020)
 

Newly announced Sigma DC DN 30mm f/1.4 (for APS-C) is better and cheaper than Sigma DG DN 45mm (for 24x36). 
30mm is an excellent lens, whereas 45mm is a nothing special one. 

Edited by nicci78
Link to post
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, nicci78 said:


30mm is an excellent lens, whereas 45mm is a nothing special one. 

Well, for €325 I'm more than happy to give the Sigma 45mm 2.8 another try. It's pretty fast, small, light and yet built like a tank. 

Edited by MarcW
Link to post
Share on other sites

Sigma DG DN 45mm f/2.8 with APS-C may made sense before the release in L-mount of the trio DC DN f/1.4 16mm + 30mm + 56mm.
All three especially formulated for APS-C. They are cheaper, faster and offer better IQ than the full frame 45mm. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, Le Chef said:

What about the Sigma 56mm?

I think that's very interesting as well, either the 56mm or the 30mm will probably be next. Or knowing me, both 😆 Thing is I really like the size, weight and build of the 45mm. It'll give me almost 70mm on my Leica T, really nice for portraits. Reviews of the 45mm are great as well. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, nicci78 said:

Sigma DG DN 45mm f/2.8 with APS-C may made sense before the release in L-mount of the trio DC DN f/1.4 16mm + 30mm + 56mm.
All three especially formulated for APS-C. They are cheaper, faster and offer better IQ than the full frame 45mm. 

Do you have the Sigma 45? What do you find wrong with it? Those who own it or have reviewed it sing its praises.

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

On 7/28/2020 at 7:38 PM, MarcW said:

What would a good price for a 2nd hand Leica CL be? And for a TL2? Knowing myself, I know I won't stop searching.

Quoting my own question, since I'd really like to know from your experience what a reasonable price would be for a 2nd hand TL2 or CL... 

Link to post
Share on other sites

And to rephrase my first question: is upgrading from the T to either the CL or TL2 really worth it IQ wise? I know the jump from 16 to 24MP, do you noticeably win in ISO performance, DR, focusing speed? I have the two amazing Leica Vario-Elmar  zoom lenses now, tempted to add a 2nd body, but only if it's definitely worth yet another investment.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Upgrading T to CL =     
- better high ISO : 25000 still usable instead 3200-6400
- better resolution. Obviously 24>16MP 
- better dynamic range at every ISO steps
- way faster camera operation    
- no viewfinder blackout, contrary to T+Visoflex. 
- AF speed is in another planet. Way faster with CL. Especially with Face detect. 
- integrated EVF 

However UI is different. It is Leica unified 3 buttons user interface. The same across Q, M10 (every variants), SL, CL, Q2 & SL2 and future made in Germany Leica cameras. 
 

TL2 will have a more refined variant of T tactile user interface. It will have most of CL advantages. Except AF speed. CL will be noticeably faster. 
 

Last tip     
- CL will have the best DNG   
- TL2 will have the best JPG. But its DNG will not match CL ones. Because it is already pre-cooked by the camera.  
- both will have way better DNG than TL. 

 

PS : yes I owned the T during 6 months; alongside CL that I still owned, since the end of 2017. I also evaluated the TL2 before choosing CL instead. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

With TL2 and CL you will lose the handy pop up flash. Which is not really good, but still serviceable. 
 

I think that the best TL lens for the T is  the tiny Elmarit-TL 18. Which provide the fastest AF speed among all TL lenses. So it is more than usable with the T. Especially when combined with its pop up flash for dark environment. 

Edited by nicci78
Link to post
Share on other sites

On 7/28/2020 at 10:38 AM, MarcW said:

What would a good price for a 2nd hand Leica CL be? And for a TL2? Knowing myself, I know I won't stop searching. Found a 2nd hand Sigma 45mm today as well btw, expecting two L mount lenses in the mail tomorrow... 🤩

Right now, a good price on a good condition CL (8/10) would be around $1,500, give or take a few hundred...In fact, that's what I got mine for...lol...

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...