Just got my SL2

[masjah]

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5 minutes ago, earleygallery said:

How are you finding the SL2 John?

Love it James. Balances very nicely with R-L adapter and my R lenses. Effortless tack sharp results with no tripod thanks to IBIS, and focus confirmation seems to work very well - better than on my M240. I've been out on my exercise walks taking pictures around the university. Tremendous resolution of course. Early days yet, so I've not at all explored its full potential.

Battery life is a bit of a shock though. I've seen posts to make sure WLAN is off. I'm not sure about this - is Bluetooth technically something different from WIFI or WLAN or are the terms used interchangeably? Bluetooth is off, and I skipped FOTOS set-up on initial installation. 

I think I'm going to buy a second battery!

 

 

[earleygallery]

Sounds good John. Definitely turn off Bluetooth if you’re not using it as it will use some battery power (as with phones). 

I think you should have at least a couple of batteries for any digital camera though. 

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[farnz]

On 5/30/2020 at 2:16 PM, masjah said:

is Bluetooth technically something different from WIFI or WLAN or are the terms used interchangeably? Bluetooth is off, and I skipped FOTOS set-up on initial installation.

Glad to hear you're enjoying your SL2, John, and that you and Marilyn are both well.

Bluetooth and WiFi are quite different.  Bluetooth is a short distance ( <= 30 m) wireless link that uses a mutual 'handshake' security protocol to connect to another Bluetooth enabled device such as a mobile phone, tablet, or desktop computer.  For example, my keyboard and mouse are connected to my computer using Bluetooth so there aren't so many wires trailing all over the place.  Once the link is established the power used by a Bluetooth connection is quite low.

WiFi and WLAN are different names for the same thing, which is a longer distance ( <= 100 m) wireless connection that can offer much larger speed, capacity, and distance than a Bluetooth connection can.  

For your SL2, the main difference will be the power usage inherent in WiFi because it uses power to continually search for WiFi connections that it might be able to connect to.  Unless you're downloading pictures from your SL2 to your computer or to Fotos I recommend switching it off to extend your battery life.  For the same reason it's probably good practice to turn off your Bluetooth too if you're not using it.

Pete.

[masjah]

5 hours ago, farnz said:

Glad to hear you're enjoying your SL2, John, and that you and Marilyn are both well.

Bluetooth and WiFi are quite different.  Bluetooth is a short distance ( <= 30 m) wireless link that uses a mutual 'handshake' security protocol to connect to another Bluetooth enabled device such as a mobile phone, tablet, or desktop computer.  For example, my keyboard and mouse are connected to my computer using Bluetooth so there aren't so many wires trailing all over the place.  Once the link is established the power used by a Bluetooth connection is quite low.

WiFi and WLAN are different names for the same thing, which is a longer distance ( <= 100 m) wireless connection that can offer much larger speed, capacity, and distance than a Bluetooth connection can.  

For your SL2, the main difference will be the power usage inherent in WiFi because it uses power to continually search for WiFi connections that it might be able to connect to.  Unless you're downloading pictures from your SL2 to your computer or to Fotos I recommend switching it off to extend your battery life.  For the same reason it's probably good practice to turn off your Bluetooth too if you're not using it.

Pete.

Pete, many thanks for this. I think I understood this in general, but I was puzzled with regard to the SL2. I can't find any WiFi reference in the camera menu system. Is it a submenu of "Bluetooth"? (I never went into the Bluetooth menu because I just left it "off".) Can I assume that WiFi is "off" as well? (For example, with regard to WiFi, I couldn't find any reference as to how to input my home router details, which is what WiFi is about? 

This is very helpful to me!!!

[farnz]

4 hours ago, masjah said:

Pete, many thanks for this. I think I understood this in general, but I was puzzled with regard to the SL2.

I'm glad it was helpful to you, John.  I'm afraid I can't help with the SL2 because I have the SL1.

Pete.

[masjah]

6 minutes ago, farnz said:

I'm glad it was helpful to you, John.  I'm afraid I can't help with the SL2 because I have the SL1.

Pete.

Thanks again Pete. You confirmed what I had always understood, namely that Bluetooth was a very short range device "pairing" protocol, whereas WiFi/WLAN was a connection to a wireless network, such as one's domestic router or other public access. The SL2 instructions (page 5) are mainly boiler plate, talking about not connecting o networks to which you have no right of access, and general security implications, but don't tell you how actually to join, whereas there are instructions for Bluetooth pairing. I can't find a reference in the root menu to WLAN, so I wondered if it was also buried as a submenu within what is labelled "Bluetooth"?

Please can any SL2 users clarify the position? Sorry for being a bit thick!

[farnz]

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Not to confuse the issue further but before some well-meaning person takes issue with what I wrote, there are a number of Classes of Bluetooth and the most common is Class 1.5 as mentioned earlier with a radius of 20 to 30 metres depending on objects and other nearby interfering wireless devices.  Class 1 is high power and can extend up to about 100 metres but are typically restricted to specific uses such as security monitoring of clothing tags in expensive shops so that items can report their whearabouts to a security system etc or police/military uses.  Telecommunications industry legislators prefer to keep Class 1 for special uses to reduce the risk of 'drowning' nearby devices and over-stuffing the already busy frequency spectrum.

Pete.

[scott kirkpatrick]

3 hours ago, masjah said:

Please can any SL2 users clarify the position? Sorry for being a bit thick!

Your puzzlement is widely shared.  I haven't tried to read up on how BlueTooth is supposed to work, and how the new BTLE (low energy) version differs from plain old BlueTooth, but I do have an SL2, and I have struggled to get Fotos to do the things that it is intended to do.  By comparing the SL2 with its distant relatives the Lumix S1 and S1R, you see that many historical ways of using WiFi for bandwidth between camera and computer, which are still to be seen in Panasonic products and perhaps in some of the older Leica series, have been removed from the SL2, leaving only the basic Fotos protocol.  This would be simpler for all of us, if it worked.  There is no wifi ON/OFF control.  BlueTooth turns it on or off when needed.  Your phone or tablet must first register with the camera, going all the way to being able to run the wifi.  Whatever deep secrets this required are then saved on each phone or tablet that is registered, and some information about each mobile device is also saved on the camera.  When all this works it is quite nice and simple, but there are pitfalls.  For example, sometimes when a connection doesn't quite work out, the camera is left in a state with BlueTooth off, and it cannot turn it back on until the battery is removed and replaced.

When they get all of this working, the goal is that BlueTooth with a range of a few meters will let the camera know that your phone is near, and has location information if desired.  And when you want to see the pictures that you just took, or operate the camera by remote control, the Fotos app will fire up the more power-hungry wifi, with a range of10 meters or more, to do the heavy lifting.  The problems seem mostly to start when the camera or the phone has gone off to sleep without the other side of the transaction quite figuring this out.

 

Edited June 6, 2020 by scott kirkpatrick

[masjah]

41 minutes ago, scott kirkpatrick said:

Your puzzlement is widely shared.  I haven't tried to read up on how BlueTooth is supposed to work, and how the new BTLE (low energy) version differs from plain old BlueTooth, but I do have an SL2, and I have struggled to get Fotos to do the things that it is intended to do.  By comparing the SL2 with its distant relatives the Lumix S1 and S1R, you see that many historical ways of using WiFi for bandwidth between camera and computer, which are still to be seen in Panasonic products and perhaps in some of the older Leica series, have been removed from the SL2, leaving only the basic Fotos protocol.  This would be simpler for all of us, if it worked.  There is no wifi ON/OFF control.  BlueTooth turns it on or off when needed.  Your phone or tablet must first register with the camera, going all the way to being able to run the wifi.  Whatever deep secrets this required are then saved on each phone or tablet that is registered, and some information about each mobile device is also saved on the camera.  When all this works it is quite nice and simple, but there are pitfalls.  For example, sometimes when a connection doesn't quite work out, the camera is left in a state with BlueTooth off, and it cannot turn it back on until the battery is removed and replaced.

When they get all of this working, the goal is that BlueTooth with a range of a few meters will let the camera know that your phone is near, and has location information if desired.  And when you want to see the pictures that you just took, or operate the camera by remote control, the Fotos app will fire up the more power-hungry wifi, with a range of10 meters or more, to do the heavy lifting.  The problems seem mostly to start when the camera or the phone has gone off to sleep without the other side of the transaction quite figuring this out.

 

Scott, many thanks for your post. It is most helpful (particularly the quote I've put in bold italics above). It's actually quite reassuring that I'm not going gaga, and missing something obvious!

From all the posts I've read (of which yours are amongst the most informative if I may say so) it's clear that FOTOS is still far too much of a work in progress; I don't need it at the moment, so I propose to stay well away from it until it reaches even what I would call a beta stage of development, and leave Bluetooth firmly switched off.

Thanks again.

[chris_tribble]

Adding a first thought after a week with the SL2 ... 

1. I tried the SL1 (twice!) and could never get on with it.  I didn't need it for standard M lenses (28/35/50), and I hated the way the fixed focus point limited its use with wider lenses or longer lenses on a tripod.  Although it was easier to nail focus with 75 / 90 or 135, it still didn't really feel right.  I also didn't like the sharp edges (pace Jono Slack) and couldn't justify the cost of going into the SL 24-90 / 90-280 zooms as I already had a perfectly acceptable Canon system with the holy trinity...
2. I now LOVE the SL2.  IBIS has transformed its usefulness with long lenses (and the M Macro-Elmar 90), and everything seems to have come together with focusing and metering.  Also, essentially for me, the Sigma MC-21 adapter for EOS lenses  means that I can hold on to the Canon L zooms and get really good use from them for the moment, and eventually (maybe) go for the Leica zooms , or (perhaps more probably as they're not bread and butter lenses) get the now excellent Sigma 24-70mm f/2.8 DG DN Art and (once it's released) the Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 DG DN Art. 
3. What I'll then have is an integrated system which will let me use M lenses on an RF body (the M10 replacement is going to have to be VERY special to tempt me) and the same M lenses on a body that will give me better focusing with long and specialist lenses, IBIS and high resolution files (which handle very very well in Lightroom).  If I'm on assignment I won't have to carry two systems, just an M10 and SL2 with the lenses that I need for that kind of job.

Is there anything I don't like about the SL2?  Nothing as yet.  I like the sticking out lugs (again, pace Jono).  I like the fact that it if I'm out for a walk with a Think Tank Quick Changer 3.0 on the belt, I can put the SL2 with one lens attached and a spare lens in the same pouch. I love the quality of the files.  I like the leather cover.  It isn't too heavy or too bulky.  It isn't actually too expensive if you compare it with the competition and look at what you get for your money.  

Happy?  Yes.

Frustrated with the lockdown so I can't do all the things I want to do with it - yes, too.  But hey, it could be worse - at least I've got the best camera combination I've ever had!

Emerging work with both M10 and SL2 here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/ctribble/

 

[vinicio]

Hi all; wish to share with you all that now I also have the SL2 close to my M10-P.

Added the 24-90 vario to my M lenses equipment.

Hope to test in deep asap

Best

[michaeljp]

Vinicio, looking forward to hearing your test results!