Leica X-U questions I can’t find answers to...

[w44neg]

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I’m currently considering a Leica X-U but I have a few questions I can’t seem to find answers to. I’ve seen reviews showing off it’s ruggedness, but I wondered...

- Is 1/2000th very limiting during bright daylight conditions at F1.7? I really enjoy shooting at all hours of the day when I travel, quite often wide open, but it looks like there’s no way to apply ND filters to the X-U, so would stopping down in the middle of a Las Vegas day etc be essential?

- Is AF poor? I noticed in the great review of a member on here, she insinuating she’d missed focus by the time she’d composed and half pressed. Granted she was floating when snorkelling, but she still made it sound like AF may not be the best on this camera, especially under water/darker conditions.

- How is battery life? Will it last a decent chunk of a day?

- Does the design cause issues in strong sunlight? There’s no protection from the sun so I wondered how the optical coatings help to alleviate internal reflections etc. 

- Overall, how does it stack up in 2020 in terms of IQ? I’m not expecting it to rival an M, but I wondered how it compares to say a CL with 23mm etc 

Thanks in advance 😊

Edited May 11, 2020 by w44neg

[allans1976]

@w44neg

I am currently considering a Leica X-U, but I have a few questions to which I don't seem to find answers. I've seen reviews that emphasize the robustness of the Leica X-U, but I wonder...
A very good idea. The camera is outstanding. I have it myself and it is still my favourite camera. Waterproof and dustproof. I use it for street photography as well as for hiking in the Alps or when it rains. I'll never sell the camera.

- Is the 1/2000th in bright daylight at F1.7 very limiting? I like to take pictures at all times of the day when I travel, quite often with the sky wide open, but it seems that there is no way to apply ND filters to the X-U. So would it be essential to stop in Las Vegas in the middle of a day? 
When I was new to manual settings, I also often used f1.7. Over time, I learned that the main purpose of the aperture is to improve the depth of field. You control the rest with the exposure time and ISO value. The aperture f1.7 is not everything in darker situations. I therefore first set the aperture (what distance do I want to focus on), then the exposure time (how fast is my subject, do I want to show motion blur) and finally the ISO value (the Leica has a high potential for this). You can also optonally increase or decrease the exposure by a few steps (EV+/-) or use an exposure time series (the camera then takes three pictures).  

- Is AF bad? I noticed in one member's great review on this site that she hinted that she missed the focus when she was composing and was half under pressure. Granted, she was swimming while snorkeling, but she still made it sound like the autofocus on this camera might not be the best, especially under water/dark conditions.
It depends on what you expect. It is slower compared to the CL or Ricoh for example. Yes. With the settings for exposure metering 1 point or spot, it produces solid results. But: The focus is a contrast focus. And it's hard to do in dark conditions. Here you can switch to manual focus. You have to try several times at this point.

- What is the battery life like? Does it last a decent part of the day?
It's hard to answer such a question. It depends on how much you do with it. For a day trip I take maybe 120 pictures. The battery is good enough for that. But I always take another one with me anyway.

- Does the construction cause problems in strong sunlight? There is no protection from the sun, so I wondered how the optical coatings help to reduce internal reflections etc. 
The coating is very good. Reflections are rare. But they do happen from time to time (street lighting, for example https://www.instagram.com/p/Bz7KO5wou_v/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link).

- What is the overall IQ in 2020? I don't expect it to be able to compete with an M, but I wonder how it will look compared to a CL with 23 mm etc. 
The CL is newer and more modern. But you should consider one thing. The X-U has an f1.7 Summilux lens. This is the second best lens series at Leica, even before the Summicron. Look at the prices for a Summilux-TL or for the Summilux-M. This is probably the biggest deal on the X-U (same as the Leica X Typ 113 =X-U with less robustness, but with filter options). And the X-U is waterproof and dustproof. And high quality. And probably the long last of its kind. You can already see that from the second-hand market prices. Such a similar Leica model won't be in the program for a long time. Even though I very much hope so. 

Here in the forum (also in the German section) and my Instagram account you can find some shots with the X-U. You can also find information about the settings there. For example a f1.7: https://www.instagram.com/p/B52Sl1DoMUL/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Edited May 11, 2020 by allans1976

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[w44neg]

Thank you, this was truly very helpful. I guess I need to make a decision on purchasing it 

[tom0511]

I have never used a x-u but other x-cameras, while I rate IQ quite good and color great I have big concerns if you wanted to shoot fish or anything in motion. I shoot m43 gear underwater and a TG-5 and I believe fast focus is important. the other thing is 35mm fov is quite long for underwater images.

I am convinced the x-u is great all weather and beach camera, but for underwater I would choose something else, faster and wider.

[w44neg]

1 minute ago, tom0511 said:

I have never used a x-u but other x-cameras, while I rate IQ quite good and color great I have big concerns if you wanted to shoot fish or anything in motion. I shoot m43 gear underwater and a TG-5 and I believe fast focus is important. the other thing is 35mm fov is quite long for underwater images.

I am convinced the x-u is great all weather and beach camera, but for underwater I would choose something else, faster and wider.

I keep seeing a lot of comparisons to olympus. I actually use M43 myself and love the IQ, but I would expect the small sensor of the TG series wouldn’t lend itself well to dark conditions?

[tom0511]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb w44neg:

I keep seeing a lot of comparisons to olympus. I actually use M43 myself and love the IQ, but I would expect the small sensor of the TG series wouldn’t lend itself well to dark conditions?

It is what it is - a small sensor. And its not great at higher ISO. However as soon as you get a little deeper you usually would need to use either flash or a good dive light anyways. The TG series has some great macro capabilities, so I was surprized myself - you can get pretty good results specially for macro and short distance images underwaterOverall it really depends what you want to use the camera for.

 

 

[w44neg]

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1 minute ago, tom0511 said:

It is what it is - a small sensor. And its not great at higher ISO. However as soon as you get a little deeper you usually would need to use either flash or a good dive light anyways. The TG series has some great macro capabilities, so I was surprized myself - you can get pretty good results specially for macro and short distance images underwaterOverall it really depends what you want to use the camera for.

 

 

Very interesting, thanks. I love olympus tech so will have a look. Maybe that and a Leica X 113 would be a good pairing. 

[tom0511]

What do you plan the camera(s) to use for?

Beach? Snorchling? Diving? Still subjects or moving subjects.

The CL AF is quite a bit faster than theX, you also get a EVF which can be quite usefull specially in bright light.

If you allready use m43, you eventually als could just get a under water housing.

for occasional use the TG series is compact and fun.

 

[w44neg]

True, I have the 7-14 f2.8 as well, which could be an option. I’m guessing the price of the X-U would cover the cost of a case. 
 

I do miss the simplicity of Leica though, and I don’t have one in my camera collection right now. 
 

The CL is much more expensive and too close in versatility to my E-M1 mkiii

Edited May 11, 2020 by w44neg

[Guest JMF]

Hi, I have the X-U as well. Bought it used some years ago.

I love it for its ruggedness  and IQ quality, using it at sea mostly.

Yet the AF is IMHO appalling and as mentioned earlier it is better to use the 1 point AF focus mode or manual pre focussing . A X1 should fare better AF wise.

The battery duration  is fine still I always have a couple of spare ones when traveling.

It does not shoot DNG only but always DNG and JPEG together.

No problem in strong sunlight.

Even with its flaws, it's a keeper as the IQ and color rendering never cease to amaze me ! 

Edited May 12, 2020 by JMF

[Guest]

I also bought a X-U 2nd hand a few months ago and am very satisfied.
So far I've only used it over water (because Lake Constance is still too cold for swimming).
As a bad weather camera, it should also allow photos in heavy rain and snow storms, where the M10-P would be taken out of the backpack only for a short moment.

Two questions for the experts:
1. How long does the energy of the battery last at outside temperatures of more than minus 10 degrees Celsius?
On my M8.2, I had to experience that the battery went flat already after about 50 photos.
Changing the battery outdoors could destroy the water resistance of the X-U.
I also want to avoid having taken off my gloves for a change of the battery.

2. The lens cap of the X-U is soft and falls off too often on the way.
For the first time I attached a lens cap to the camera with the twine, but this is annoying when taking pictures.
However, I don't want to go outdoors without the lens cap entirely, so that incident strong sunlight cannot damage the inside of the camera.
Does anyone know a better lens cap?
 

Edited May 12, 2020 by mnutzer

[w44neg]

6 hours ago, JMF said:

Hi, I have the X-U as well. Bought it used some years ago.

I love it for its ruggedness  and IQ quality, using it at sea mostly.

Yet the AF is IMHO appalling and as mentioned earlier it is better to use the 1 point AF focus mode or manual pre focussing . A X1 should fare better AF wise.

The battery duration  is fine still I always have a couple of spare ones when traveling.

It does not shoot DNG only but always DNG and JPEG together.

No problem in strong sunlight.

Even with its flaws, it's a keeper as the IQ and color rendering never cease to amaze me ! 

It’s a shame about the AF performance. Have you ever found the 1/2000th shutter to be an issue?

[Guest JMF]

4 hours ago, w44neg said:

It’s a shame about the AF performance. Have you ever found the 1/2000th shutter to be an issue?

No, if necessary , I  underexpose  to gain an extra stop according to the conditions !

 

Edited May 12, 2020 by JMF

[allans1976]

vor 13 Stunden schrieb mnutzer:

..

2. The lens cap of the X-U is soft and falls off too often on the way.
For the first time I attached a lens cap to the camera with the twine, but this is annoying when taking pictures.
However, I don't want to go outdoors without the lens cap entirely, so that incident strong sunlight cannot damage the inside of the camera.
Does anyone know a better lens cap?
 

The camera cover is really bad at that point. 

My solution is Billingham Hadley Digital. The bag is one of the smaller ones and with a divider from the Hadley Small (is a little bit higher as the divider flaps). The lining is very soft. The divider is near the middle. And the back of the camera is against it, so the lens is facing the outside, which is also padded. The padding is very soft, so the lens (which is made of tempered glass) is well protected. After my photos I put the camera back into the bag. Only for journeys (trains, flights), where I don't use the camera, the rubber cover is still on. The other half of the bag I use for a mini bag with zipper, batteries, an iOS SD card adapter, cleaning cloths and lens cleaner are stored. And behind it a air blower fits into it. At the front of the Hadley Digital is another roomy bag where I can store my iPhone 11 Pro Max (it's my backup, upload and first editing tool with Lr CC) including Smart Battery Case. For me a perfect solution. Fits for the street as well as for hiking in the Alps. And the solution is relatively lightweight.

As hand strap I use the flexible and soft strap from BNC Camera (on my V-LUX 114 as well):

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Edited May 12, 2020 by allans1976

[pgsalton]

I've had a Leica XU since the Fall of 2017 and love it for what it is - an amphibious machine that takes awesome photos.  But only if you get the focus right!  I really don't use it much underwater but do use it skiing and in sea kayaks etc.  All that said, the auto focus is AWFUL.  Still if you grew up using an old style camera (like I did with the Pentax K1000) then you can make do with manual focus or what I mostly use 'spot' focus.  I do love that all of the controls are super simple - it is really stripped down to just what you need.  I also own the Olympus TG6 (and TG3 before that).  The Olympus TG series is the only other waterproof camera that is at all decent and it does not hold a candle in terms of picture quality to the Leica XU.  But that said the Leica XU misses the focus a lot!

As regards the lens cover.  I've found that when new it grips great and does not come off all that much.  But after a couple of months of hard use - the rubber loses its 'grippiness'.  My fix was to buy an extra five lens caps!  I'm now now down to just 2 new un used ones left!