Leica M3 top plate-stains?

[LJB007]

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Hello! Sorry if this is a question that has been answered somewhere else, made a few searches and there didn't seem to be anything.

The last couple of months have pickled my mind and in a moment of total madness I bought online an M3 last week. It hasn't arrived yet but I can see from its photos that there are marks and stains on the top plate (dotted all over the camera actually but much lees obviously). I'm guessing this is some kind of erosion that is permanent (aside from replacing or repainting); maybe a problem similar to the M6s that had a zinc and not brass base (I found this info on here)?? 

It's worrying me because I think the camera was kept in a leather bag near the sea with the lens attached. If the staining is corrosion and is the result of fungal reactions, the top plate may well be the very least of my worries. 

Obviously, I need to wait and examine the camera when it arrives  but delivery is going to take a while so I'm here to see if there might be another explanation before I drown myself in tears. If anybody has any ideas I'd be very glad to hear them (I think). Thanks in advance. 

 

 

[jaapv]

Well, if it is indeed moisture damage the cosmetic condition is indeed the least of your worries - internal corrosion may make the camera irreparable. Any return policy?

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[LJB007]

Auction, alas. Maybe I've dreamed up the worst possible scenario-we'll see....  (I have it in writing from the auction house that the camera is working, so that might be something to fall back on if there are serious problems). 

[jaapv]

"Working" is a bit of a flexible concept. Whatever else, send it in to a good Leica specialist for an overhaul.  BTW, normally the chrome on an M3 won't stain. A good clean may do wonders for the looks of the camera.

[250swb]

The chrome plating is very tough, I don't think fungus will have any effect on it, so it may just be some staining from the case that could be removed with some IPA.

[LJB007]

Ah, really? My heart has jumped for joy and my fingers are crossed, thank you both very much.

I assumed it's permanent because I looked at a load of other adverts online for M3s and they all had it to some degree or other-most much less than mine.  I wonder why people don't remove it if it is possible to clean it up. Again, I realise this is a tricky conversation when you can't even see what I'm talking about. 

 

 

[Stealth3kpl]

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If it's ebay and you paid by Paypal, (and the camera isn't functioning) you will be able to get your money back even if "no returns" is stated. Just say that the description implies the camera functions normally and it doesn't, then wait for Paypal to work its magic.

Pete

[willeica]

The most common marking on the top plate of an M3 comes from the putting on and taking off of a Leicameter. It is usually around the shoe and speed dial area. If that is what this camera has then the damage will only be cosmetic. Please post a picture when the camera arrives.

Some IIIcs had difficulties with the chrome and there can be speckled marks on the body chrome. Again these were only cosmetic. This issue had been long since dealt with when the M3 came along, though.

William

[250swb]

9 hours ago, LJB007 said:

Ah, really? My heart has jumped for joy and my fingers are crossed, thank you both very much.

I assumed it's permanent because I looked at a load of other adverts online for M3s and they all had it to some degree or other-most much less than mine.  I wonder why people don't remove it if it is possible to clean it up. Again, I realise this is a tricky conversation when you can't even see what I'm talking about. 

 

 

Hmm, well you were talking about 'stains', if it's the sort of things you see on many cameras, such as scratches from a Leicameter or strap rings, they aren't stains.

[jerzy]

a photo illustrating would help. Here is an example what I understand as stain, very early M3 stored in ERC and in humid environment for a longer period of time, I suppose.

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Lucky enough, the interrior of the camera was not not affected and, after regular CLA everything is fine.

Another possibility is green patina, this is less dangerous as only on the surface, may be cleaned with very small effect on the chrom plating quality

[LJB007]

Thank you all very much for you wisdom, kind and helpful to my nerves! 

[wlaidlaw]

For removing many years of dirt and stains from the satin chrome of Leica cameras without damaging the chrome, the best thing I have found is an artists eraser. This is not the modern white synthetic rubber type but the old fashioned toffee brown one made from natural gutta percha - like the one below. They will also remove darkening from white engraving filling on black finish Leicas. The very grubby engravings on my black Leicaflex SL2 are now gleaming after a rub with one of these erasers. 

Wilson

 

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[LJB007]

Dear All,

It's arrived and seems much less worrying than I'd expected. There are a couple of scratches but I'll try the suggestions above on the other marks, the range finder seems to be working too and from a few school boy experiments,  pretty accurate. In fact, I think it may have had a restoration of some kind very recently. 

Thanks for all the advice, I hope somebody else new to this amazingly exciting and historic world might find it useful in the future. 

 

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Edited May 23, 2020 by LJB007

[willeica]

Looks in better condition than my 2 M3s (DS and SS) and they both work fine. Enjoy it, it is one of the best cameras ever.

William 

[wlaidlaw]

My 1966 SS M3 has a tiny dent on the top cover (looks like it was made by a sharp pointed object) but luckily it can be hidden by a MR-4 Leicameter, so it does not offend my eyes. Otherwise I might well have bought a new top cover for it. That looks like a lovely M3 you have bought. Is that a 50/1.5 Summarit you have mounted on it? A very under-rated lens IMHO but essential to use a hood, as it is very flare prone, which totally kills the already quite gentle contrast. Then used wide open you will get the best swirly bokeh in the business other than an f1,2 Noctilux. 

Wilson

Edited May 23, 2020 by wlaidlaw

[M9reno]

But is it on sale again?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174291424620

 

[sabears]

1 hour ago, M9reno said:

But is it on sale again?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/174291424620

 

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[willeica]

1 hour ago, M9reno said:

But is it on sale again?

We should call you 'Hawkeye', Alfonso. I hope the chap who has it, enjoys it for as long as he has it.

William

[LJB007]

Thanks for the tip about the lens hood! 

I had an eBay £1 fees offer come through so I stuck it all up yes. But as you’ll see I haven’t priced it particularly competitively in the hope I can survive without needing to sell it. 

Photography is a hobby, there’s a clue to my main work in the images lol. I’ve had 6 months of work cancelled so I’ll see how it goes, might be some furniture up there too soon...

 

 

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[wlaidlaw]

If you do want to sell them, I would split the items up. Much more likely to find buyers for individual parts than the whole. I don't think your total price is totally unreasonable but you might well realise even more, as separate items. For example, just the XOONS hood is worth about £150-£200 on its own. A good Summarit, as long as the front coating is near intact, is worth around £600-£750. All adding up but it would need someone reasonably knowledgable to want a DS M3, a slightly specialist camera compared with the SS M3 and both the Hektor 135 and Summarit are somewhat left field lenses, desirable to Leica aficionados but not to Joe Public. These aficionados may well already have an M3 but would like one of the lenses and vice versa. 

Wilson