50mm APO Summicron-SL vs Summilux-SL?

[globalwander]

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Dear fellow Leica nerds,

I need your help please. Trying to decide between the 50mm Summicron-SL and the 50mm Summilux-SL on my SL camera. 
 

Would appreciate your insights and thoughts. I am not a professional photographer. This is for my personal use. Typical application is for family, travel and portraiture. 
 

My current cameras and lenses are as follows: Leica Q, M (Typ 262) with 35mm Summicron-M, and my SL with the Vario Elmarit 24-90. 
 

Thank you!

[paulsydaus]

For portraiture on a tripod the 50/1.4.

For hand to hand combat, the 50/1.4.

For travel the 50/2.0

For family the 50/2.0.

How often do you find yourself reaching for the 24-90 versus those other cameras?  I think there in lies your answer...

 

Edited April 4, 2020 by paulsydaus

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[globalwander]

Love the “hand to hand combat” 

[vincent_1919]

Just get the sigma or pana 50 1.4 instead of summilux. The quality difference between summilux and pana is indistinguishable to most of people.

As to apo-summicron-sl, the sharpest lens on the market, period.

[globalwander]

9 hours ago, vincent_1919 said:

Just get the sigma or pana 50 1.4 instead of summilux. The quality difference between summilux and pana is indistinguishable to most of people.

As to apo-summicron-sl, the sharpest lens on the market, period.

I’m waiting for the Panasonic super telephoto for birding and wildlife. But for standard focal range, I love my Leica glass rendering. Thanks for the response. 

[jplomley]

10 hours ago, vincent_1919 said:

Just get the sigma or pana 50 1.4 instead of summilux. The quality difference between summilux and pana is indistinguishable to most of people.

As to apo-summicron-sl, the sharpest lens on the market, period.

Having shot with all four of the APO Summicron SL lenses, I would have to respectively disagree. That honour goes to the 35 APO SL

[vincent_1919]

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4 minutes ago, jplomley said:

Having shot with all four of the APO Summicron SL lenses, I would have to respectively disagree. That honour goes to the 35 APO SL

You are right. Should say "standard" lens. 

[Jared]

I don’t think we can tell you which is a better match for your particular needs.  We can just tell you the relative strengths.

For the Summicron:

- Faster focusing

- Sharper across the field and especially in the corners up to f/5.6

- Smaller and lighter
- Less expensive (a bit)

For the Summilux:

- Lovely, swirly bokeh at f/1.4

- A bit more light grasp

So, do you need or want the f/1.4 bokeh?  Enough to put up with a lens that is nearly as big and heavy as the 24-90?  
 

Oh, one other factor to consider... The Summicron May be hard to find.  I don’t think they are generally in stock, and with Covid 19 delays it could be a while. 

[Jared]

38 minutes ago, jplomley said:

Having shot with all four of the APO Summicron SL lenses, I would have to respectively disagree. That honour goes to the 35 APO SL

Yeah, the 35 is just plane stunning.I can’t quite reconcile my experiences with the DXO test result for that lens.  They considered it average for a 35mm prime.  Not certain whether they got a bad copy, made a mistake in testing, or whether there is something their tests just don’t account for.  My 35mm APO-Summicron-SL is optically the best lens I have ever used of less than 90mm focal length.  By a lot!

[Jeff S]

Discussion here..

Jeff

 

[globalwander]

5 hours ago, Jared said:

I don’t think we can tell you which is a better match for your particular needs.  We can just tell you the relative strengths.

For the Summicron:

- Faster focusing

- Sharper across the field and especially in the corners up to f/5.6

- Smaller and lighter
- Less expensive (a bit)

For the Summilux:

- Lovely, swirly bokeh at f/1.4

- A bit more light grasp

So, do you need or want the f/1.4 bokeh?  Enough to put up with a lens that is nearly as big and heavy as the 24-90?  
 

Oh, one other factor to consider... The Summicron May be hard to find.  I don’t think they are generally in stock, and with Covid 19 delays it could be a while. 

Excellent insights, thank you. Exactly what I was looking for. Doesn't make the decision any easier, but helps me understand the relative merits.

[globalwander]

4 hours ago, Jeff S said:

Discussion here..

Jeff

 

Thank you Jeff! Will check that out.

[tom0511]

I had the Summilux first and later got the Summicron to replace it because of smaller size and weight.

However I have a hard time letting the Summilux go. Overall I feel the Summilux to render with a Little more gentle bokeh and you gain f1.4 and Focus Wheel is smoother if you focus manually. But it is bigger. So if I am at home or dont have to do Long hikes I bring the Summilux, for travel I would prefer the Summicron because of ist smaller size. YOu can find good used deals for the Summilux but seldom for the Summicron. So Price should not be the determing factor.

 

 

[globalwander]

2 hours ago, tom0511 said:

I had the Summilux first and later got the Summicron to replace it because of smaller size and weight.

However I have a hard time letting the Summilux go. Overall I feel the Summilux to render with a Little more gentle bokeh and you gain f1.4 and Focus Wheel is smoother if you focus manually. But it is bigger. So if I am at home or dont have to do Long hikes I bring the Summilux, for travel I would prefer the Summicron because of ist smaller size. YOu can find good used deals for the Summilux but seldom for the Summicron. So Price should not be the determing factor.

 

 

Really appreciate the info. Thanks for sharing your direct experience with both lenses.

[ocean2059]

I also want to echo what Tom wrote above about the two lenses. I have has very similar experience and I am keeping both. I don't think you can go wrong with either.  

[tom0511]

Overall just in regards of size the Summicron fits the SL(2) perfectly.

If I could Keep just one I guess I would probably keep the Summicron, if one wants to carry the lens a lot or if one likes to travel often.

 

[globalwander]

13 hours ago, tom0511 said:

Overall just in regards of size the Summicron fits the SL(2) perfectly.

If I could Keep just one I guess I would probably keep the Summicron, if one wants to carry the lens a lot or if one likes to travel often.

 

Thanks again Tom, I went with the Summicron.

[globalwander]

Many thanks to everyone for your insights and for sharing your experience with these two great lenses. In the end I went with the 50mm APO Summicron-SL. 

[scott kirkpatrick]

On 4/5/2020 at 5:30 PM, Jared said:

Yeah, the 35 is just plain stunning.I can’t quite reconcile my experiences with the DXO test result for that lens.  They considered it average for a 35mm prime.  Not certain whether they got a bad copy, made a mistake in testing, or whether there is something their tests just don’t account for.  My 35mm APO-Summicron-SL is optically the best lens I have ever used of less than 90mm focal length.  By a lot!

DXO tested the SL/SC 35 on an S1R, which is not an ideal match.  And then, they are DXO, so who knows what their reviews mean, as all of the numbers they plot are aggregates of measurements not clearly specified  I agree that the 35 is outstanding, even compared with the SL/SC 50 and even on an S1R, but it is better on the SL2.

Edited April 7, 2020 by scott kirkpatrick

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[vincent_1919]

2 minutes ago, scott kirkpatrick said:

DXO tested the SL/SC 35 on an S1R, which is not an ideal match.  And then, they are DXO, so who knows what their reviews mean, as all of the numbers they plot are aggregates of measurements not clearly specified  I agree that the 35 is outstanding, even compared with the SL/SC 50 and even on an S1R, but it is better on the SL2.

The test method itself is ridiculous. When a company design a modern lens, the thickness of the filter is a factor that no one can ignore and has a great impact on the result. This explains why Sigma 50 1.4 Art performing poorly on sony camera but very good on canon and nikon. S1R has a filter of 1.7mm thickness before CMOS which SL2 only has a only 0.7mm one. 35mm apo sl is definitely far superior to any of lenses they have tested in regard with sharpness when on a SL2 system.